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RedditAnyone who has had much experience with America's health care system knows that nurses are the essential players in making things work.
So as the swine flu outbreak evolves into a genuine public health emergency -- with cases being discovered in more states and the announcement by President Obama of the first death in the U.S. -- it is time to consult the nation's nurses.
And the nurses are saying that federal authorities must move more aggressively on a number of fronts. Of particular note in a call for steps to be taken to require insurance companies to suspend or waive insurance company fees -- such as co-pays and high deductibles -- that may discourage sick people from seeking care.
The California Nurses Association/National Nurses Organizing Committee, which has most of its 86,000 members in the state of California, where Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger has declared a state of emergency to tackle the outbreak, is making a smart call for national action to promote containment and prevention of a broader swine flu pandemic.
At the heart of that call is a reminder that the United States has badly neglected public health and allowed the nation's health-care infrastructure to degenerate at precisely the points where Americans are most vulnerable. "From SARS to avian flu to the current escalating outbreaks of swine influenza it has become increasingly clear that we are risking a major catastrophe unless we act to restore the safety net, and devote the resources that are needed to protect the public," says CNA/NNOC co-president Deborah Burger, who like other leaders of the union is a registered nurse.
But there is, as well, a need for action to assure that insurance company greed does not erect barriers to care.
The CNA/NNOC call comes at a time when the federal government is starting to take both the swine flu outbreak and the broader threat of a pandemic seriously -- after neglecting the issue when House Appropriations Committee chair David Obey, D-Wisconsin, urged forward-looking action during last winter's stimulus debate.
President Obama has taken an important step in the right direction with his call on Congress -- which stripped Obey's plan to provide $870 million for pandemic preparedness and related initiatives from the emergency stimulus legislation -- to allocate $1.5 billion for combating the virus. With public concerns and political pressures rising as the World Health Organization urges countries to prepare for a pandemic, it is unlikely that Maine Senator Susan Collins, the Republican who led the fight against allocating the preparedness money (cheered on by unthinking Democrats such as New York's Chuck Schumer), will object this time.
But Obama's call focuses on emergency funding to provide an adequate supply of vaccines and the equipment to handle a potential outbreak. That's just a piece of the puzzle.
CNA/NNOC officials argue that president's commitment, while significant and welcome, is not enough.
The union has developed an action plan that seeks a federal commitment to:
* Reinstate the $870 million for pandemics that was cut from the economic stimulus bill.
* Recruit and mobilize teams of scientists to create the appropriate effective vaccine for the virus.
* Cease and desist any reductions in public health programs at federal, state and local levels. Lift any freezes on public health funding currently in place.
* Implement a moratorium on any closures of emergency rooms, layoffs of direct health care personnel, and reductions of hospital beds.
*Allocate funding for recruitment and retention of school nurses, public health nurses.
* Expand the network of community clinics, especially in medically underserved areas.
*Add thousands of additional ventilators/respirators, which are critically needed in the event of epidemics.
* Assure the availability of protective equipment for all health care personnel.
* Require all insurance companies to suspend or waive all out-of-pocket expenses, including co-pays, deductibles, or co-insurance that discourage individuals from seeking preventive care for early signs of infection.
The nurses union's proposals should be taken seriously, especially by members of Congress who -- aside from Obey and a few others -- have failed to take public health issues seriously.
The CNA/NNOC is not a newcomer to this issue. Three years ago, it warned that the "firewalls for stopping the next great pandemic are getting thinner." In particular, the union focused on reductions in public health funding and serious gaps in the distribution of essential medical devices such as mechanical ventilators.
While research and technology are important, access to care is even more essential.
That's why the union's call for federal action to require insurance companies to suspend or waive all out-of-pocket expenses is so vital.
This will be controversial in Washington, where the insurance industry has plenty of friends -- including Collins, who accepted $258,700 in insurance industry funding for her 2008 reelection campaign, and more than a few of her Republican and Democratic colleagues.
But it is essential to make sure that skyrocketing co-pays, deductibles, and other charges that have been imposed by insurance companies do not discourage Americans who are ailing from seeking care.
As CNA/NNOC president Burger says: "Price gouging by the healthcare industry has already put tens of millions of families in healthcare jeopardy, especially in an economic crisis. At a time when untold numbers are already exposed to a dangerous virus, we need to be removing any barriers to medical care that would exacerbate the spread of contagion."
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John Nichols
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pfffft! socialist whiners! just die and quit complaining.
greed is good!!!!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/29/2009 @ 1:01pm
People who would let a $20 co-pay prevent them from seeking treatment for flu with all the Chicken-littles screaming the sky is falling are too stupid to live and deserve to die.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 1:31pm
Besides, it's not up to the government whether you pay your co-pay. Your copay is part of your insurance contract with your private insurance company. The government doesn't dictate what you pay on you auto loan to you private company, they can't change your contract with you private insurance company.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 1:33pm
Human life should not be reduceable to a contract.
Posted by garethhe at 04/29/2009 @ 2:08pm
I think they are calling it Mexican flu now, cause nobodies buying pork cause of the name.
I love Jimmy Deans. Gonna wait a week till the price drops and buy up all his Maple flavored sausage!
I must have it, to, cause I suddenly have an uncontrollable urge to repair a roof and mow the grass!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! (NO OFFENSE FROSTY!)
Posted by PRESTERJOHNofASIA at 04/29/2009 @ 2:23pm
In this economy, Darin, people may very well skip getting checked out for the flu when that $20 might be the only money available to eat for the next two days. And your auto loan analogy is irrelevant - somebody missing a car payment only means they might lose their car, and not avoiding treatment which could help stop the spread of a pandemic. As corporate citizens, insurance companies have to serve not only their shareholders but also the greater good, especially in a time of potential national emergency.
Posted by pete29 at 04/29/2009 @ 2:29pm
The benefits realized from having a healthy (and therefore productive) society are, as usual, trumped by the almighty Greenback Dollar. The Captains of Modern Industry have long since lost any vestiges of the moral compass that guided their distant predecessors. Inasmuch as we can attempt to bring changes through government-supported healthcare funding, tighter restrictions on insurance companies, and better working conditions and rights for our health care workers through unions, we cannot force Big Insurance, Big Pharma, and Big Hospitals to accept that they have a moral obligation, an imperative, to serve the greater good, and to serve the patients above all in the vein of Hippocrates. (Sorry for the egregious pun!)
Until that moral compass is restored to our health care industries, I hold little hope that any changes will be panacea; we'll be lucky to get a poultice. The author is right to fear that in the event of a Spanish Flu-style pandemic, the healthcare industry, slaved to the dollar's pursuit, will do nothing in the public interest.
Posted by Paralyse at 04/29/2009 @ 2:55pm
There's no cure for influenza, so if people think they have the swine flu, they should just stay home. Going to a hospital, to spread it to kids with broken ankles and whatnot, is irresponsible and selfish. Unless you want to take the TamiFlu "treatment." And I can't imagine anyone who's read about the side effects of that poison would desire THAT.
Posted by KevinRiley at 04/29/2009 @ 2:59pm
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 1:31pm | ignore this person | warn this person
lol...you have a point, D, but...
when they cough on you or yours their stupidity becomes your problem.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/29/2009 @ 3:16pm
I am right you are wrong....on and on and on.
Posted by leelbrig at 04/29/2009 @ 3:26pm
This thread is a perfect example of the marxist agenda I've been charging Obama and the left with.
We have a mild incident of a new flu strain and with the complicity of the MSM, suddenly the left and the Administration act as if a reintroduction of polio has taken place.
As has been noted, 36,000 Americans die of the flu every year. So far about 200 people have been tentatively diagnosed and one unfortunate infant have died from this particular flu.
But we see how quickly the marxist California Nurses Association jumps on board. They never miss an opportunity to wreak more havoc just as they have been doing in California.
So, small incidents like this are just the springboard for Obama and the left to manipulate a public paranoia and foment their socialist revolution.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm
But we see how quickly the marxist California Nurses Association jumps on board. They never miss an opportunity to wreak more havoc just as they have been doing in California.
So, small incidents like this are just the springboard for Obama and the left to manipulate a public paranoia and foment their socialist revolution.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm | ignore this person | warn this person
marxist nurses association?
well i DO agree that the flu thing is being a tad overblown. lots of people die of the flu every year, but...
when and if a truly nasty bug shows up, i'm glad to know we have SOP's in place and some experience responding to this provided by the current issue.
marxist california nurses association...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/29/2009 @ 3:52pm
and one unfortunate infant have died from this particular flu.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm
This is bewildering!
The infant was a 23-month old Mexican citizen with other "health issues" who was brought to Texas after he was diagnosed with Swine Flu.
Can somebody at The Nation please answer this question for me:
Why oh why, would they bring an infant from Mexico where they have socialized medicine to the US where they don't have socialized medicine for treatment?
Clearly, socialized medicine is so far superior to the US's system of medicine why would they bring him here?
Surely he wouldn't have died if they'd left him in a country with a superior medical system rather than enacting a death sentence on him by bringing him to this healthcare hellhole.
Can somebody please explain to me why his parents murdered him by bringing him to the US?
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 4:05pm
Swine flu prompts WHO to raise alert level
"The level goes from 4 to 5, meaning the likelihood of a pandemic "is very high or inevitable," an official says."
(from the Marxist LA Times)...
yes, let's keep our heads in the sand and assume everything is fine...
gschwartz
Posted by cidelson at 04/29/2009 @ 4:28pm
This thread is a perfect example of the marxist agenda I've been charging Obama and the left with.
We have a mild incident of a new flu strain and with the complicity of the MSM, suddenly the left and the Administration act as if a reintroduction of polio has taken place....
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm
Ditto!
Hey, Johnny Nichols.....
The stock market was up a decent bit today......and that means, by your very own logic, the Swine Flue "Pandemic" is no longer a problem.......you may want to revise your fear-mongering of yesterday attributing the market drop of Monday to this "Pandemic"!
Posted by Happy at 04/29/2009 @ 4:42pm
I had dinner with 4 hard core "progressives" last Saturday night. The topic came around to health care. All of them were enthusiastic supporters of Obama's plan. I asked some simple questions, such as "What is the plan?", "Where will the money come from?", "How much does the US spend on prescription drugs?". None of them had the slightest clue. They just know that the "new" system will be fair, efficient, whatever. Not a hint of curiosity to check for themselves. I could have picked any topic at all, gone one level below what is written in the NYTimes or Daily Kos, and they would not have had a clue. Go to whitehouse.gov and read the healthcare stuff yourself. Ask yourself what will it cost and what will it cover. Not a chance of getting that answered. Why the blind faith that Obama's plan will work?
Posted by sntauri at 04/29/2009 @ 4:54pm
And, do you really believe that all of the Insurance company and Pharma Industry profits would be enough to pay for all the uninsured? Really?
Posted by sntauri at 04/29/2009 @ 4:55pm
I have a better idea. Total single-payer health insurance, now.
Posted by Milhaus at 04/29/2009 @ 5:21pm
I agree that it is not the government's job to control co-pays...that is a contract...but we should recruit and mobilize teams of scientists to create the appropriate effective vaccine for the virus; cease and desist any reductions in public health programs at the federal level (states need to address this state by state); lift any freezes on public health funding currently in place; implement a moratorium on any closures of emergency rooms, layoffs of direct health care personnel, and reductions of hospital beds that are governmentally funded (not the government's job to dictate to the private sector); assure the availability of protective equipment for all health care personnel; and lastly we need to educate the public that it has nothing to do with Jimmy Dean or James Dean.
Posted by truthandjustice at 04/29/2009 @ 5:26pm
Leave it to anti-science conservatives to dis-inform the public.
The mortality rate of swine flu is much greater than the "regular" flu. This is also a completely new strain, meaning people are far less able to fight it off should they get infected. The problem here is the potential..if this takes off we could have huge numbers of infected, and dead. Small, preventative measures early on can save huge costs later (costs that will come out of your packet, one way or another). We are too late for doing what should have already been done to maintain good pandemic preparedness in the United States, but we can at least stay scientifically informed and do what we can to limit the spread of this virus.
The Health Insurers would be foolish NOT to wave the co-pays and encourage preventative care. They will take the hit if this rises to disaster levels.
Think of the warning of a Category 5 pandemic in terms of the unheeded warnings of a Category 5 storm not so long ago.
Posted by mdetrano at 04/29/2009 @ 5:35pm
So, small incidents like this are just the springboard for Obama and the left to manipulate a public paranoia and foment their socialist revolution.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm
I still don't understand the paranoid delusional world you live in.
Obama said. "We are closely monitoring the emerging cases of swine flu in the United States. This is obviously a cause for concern and requires a heightened state of alert. But it is not a cause for alarm."
This sure is a manipulation of public paranoia...? Seems to me this is more a case of the Corporate Media, scaring the public into increased ratings and profit.
Socialist Revolution? You sure have gone of the deep end lately. Egypt killing 300K pigs seems a bit more of an over reaction. I sure you would include them in the Marxist left agenda to destroy America right?
Posted by Extraneous at 04/29/2009 @ 5:48pm
The mortality rate of swine flu is much greater than the "regular" flu. This is also a completely new strain, meaning people are far less able to fight it off should they get infected. The problem here is the potential..if this takes off we could have huge numbers of infected, and dead. Small, preventative measures early on can save huge costs later (costs that will come out of your packet, one way or another). We are too late for doing what should have already been done to maintain good pandemic preparedness in the United States, but we can at least stay scientifically informed and do what we can to limit the spread of this virus.
The Health Insurers would be foolish NOT to wave the co-pays and encourage preventative care. They will take the hit if this rises to disaster levels.
Think of the warning of a Category 5 pandemic in terms of the unheeded warnings of a Category 5 storm not so long ago.
Posted by mdetrano at 04/29/2009 @ 5:35pm
Ok mr "science". Where is your evidence that this is far more deadly than regular flu?
How many hundreds of thousands are you then predicting will die this year because of this strain of flu?
Where are the emergency rooms and urgent care centers that must already be filled with people suffering from this flu?
How come the numbers in Mexico aren't catastrophic?
Out of a population of 109 million, 2400 people have been infected with the flu and 150 are assumed to have died of this flu strain. Yet, Mexico also says that the situation is already stabilized and they are lifting the citywide shutdown in Mexico City.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/swine_flu_world
You are just part of the hysteria feeders.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 5:58pm
Why oh why, would they bring an infant from Mexico where they have socialized medicine to the US where they don't have socialized medicine for treatment?
Clearly, socialized medicine is so far superior to the US's system of medicine why would they bring him here?
Surely he wouldn't have died if they'd left him in a country with a superior medical system rather than enacting a death sentence on him by bringing him to this healthcare hellhole.
Can somebody please explain to me why his parents murdered him by bringing him to the US?
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 4:05pm
Answer me this. Why oh why do Americans who have the superior private insurance go to Mexico and Canada for prescribed medicine? Why do American doctors go to Cuba for training? Must be our superior private system.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:24pm
You are just part of the hysteria feeders.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 5:58pm
Very true, this much like the SARS thing is way overblown.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:25pm
Clearly, socialized medicine is so far superior to the US's system of medicine why would they bring him here?
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 4:05pm
Cause they could not get a flight to France.
Posted by Extraneous at 04/29/2009 @ 6:30pm
Answer me this. Why oh why do Americans who have the superior private insurance go to Mexico and Canada for prescribed medicine? Why do American doctors go to Cuba for training? Must be our superior private system.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:24pm
That's a misleading statement.
Very few doctors go to Cuba for training. Can you put a number out that is significant? Say in the thousands?
And most of those who go to Mexico for medicines do so to obtain medicines that are not approved. And some including celebrities have died because they did so. That doesn't mean all Mexican medicine is bad or dangerous.
As for Canada, with the advent of $4 and $5 prescriptions, that trend has pretty much gone away. There are even free prescriptions available and I linked one liberal here to a site for his diabetes meds a couple of years ago.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 6:30pm
CCC,
According to Castro himself in this 2005 speech, 65 students graduating from the medical college were from the US.
http://www.hellocuba.ca/castro_elam.php
And here is a concern from the AMA about it
<Representatives of the American Medical Association have voiced concern about the quality of education and training American students would receive in Cuba, noting that they might have a difficult time getting licensed upon returning to the US. According to a report by the National Board of Examiners, only 48 percent of the graduates of foreign medical schools passed the final stage of their US licensing examinations in 1999, compared to 92 percent of those who graduated from schools in the United States or Canada.>
http://afrocubaweb.com/infomed/havanahealing.htm
http://www.autentico.org/oa09487.php
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 6:36pm
Where is your evidence that this is far more deadly than regular flu?
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 5:58pm
The CDC and WHO have good info on their websites. The marxist fear mongering organizations that they are. It is not that swine flu is more deadly than other diseases, but that it has the potential to be. Humans are not normally exposed to this flu, thus we lack the antibodies to fight it. All flu strains evolve (thats why flu shots change annually) and thus there is the potential for this flu to become extremely deadly. Will it? No one knows. But like Obama said, it is cause for concern but not alarm.
Posted by Extraneous at 04/29/2009 @ 6:41pm
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 6:30pm
People go to Mexico because the medicine is cheap. Plain and simple. You can argue it of course. But if you don't have insurance here, which many people don't because they can't afford it, then you won't be able to afford the medication.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:47pm
"According to Castro himself in this 2005 speech, 65 students graduating from the medical college were from the US."
Probably because it's a relatively new program and people haven't fully caught onto it yet.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:51pm
"<Representatives of the American Medical Association have voiced concern about the quality of education and training American students would receive in Cuba, noting that they might have a difficult time getting licensed upon returning to the US. According to a report by the National Board of Examiners, only 48 percent of the graduates of foreign medical schools passed the final stage of their US licensing examinations in 1999, compared to 92 percent of those who graduated from schools in the United States or Canada.> "
This is innaccurate because as far as I can find the program only began truly taking shape in 2004 with Cuba when the ban was lifted on exchange programs there. Which means the AMA was expressing fears basd on OTHER countries not on Cuba's educational system. So both of these statements are meaningless because they don't apply to a Cuban education.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:53pm
The first set of students to go there I believe was in 2001. I could easily be wrong but I'm pretty sure. Which is still after the AMA's statement.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 7:13pm
http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/content/full/164/10/1477
Looks like American doctors have some positive things to say about a Cuban education.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 7:15pm
This is also a completely new strain, meaning people are far less able to fight it off should they get infected. The problem here is the potential..if this takes off we could have huge numbers of infected, and dead.
Posted by mdetrano at 04/29/2009 @ 5:35pm
How is that different from the potential thousands dead from the Library Bombing plot that torture helped prevent?
36,000 die from flu in the US every year for that past 10 years. In 2001 3000 died from terrorist plots; in 2002 0; in 2003 0; in 2004 0; in 2005 0; in 2006 0; in 2007 0; in 2008 0;
It seems some deaths are preventable, and some are not. Why are we getting all worked up over deaths that aren't preventable and completely ignoring potential deaths that are preventable?
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 7:30pm
Why do American doctors go to Cuba for training?
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:24pm
For the cigars.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 7:32pm
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 6:36pm
Thanks for the assist, Larry. Couldn't have said it better myself.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 7:34pm
36,000 die from flu in the US every year for that past 10 years.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 7:30p
yes, but they weren't in their twenties..
right, mr. actuary?
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 7:40pm
I think they are calling it Mexican flu now,
••• some nimrods at my son's school were swining him today cause he's mexican. humans.....
cause nobodies buying pork cause of the name.
••• some are buying nothing because they are dead.
I love Jimmy Deans. Gonna wait a week till the price drops and buy up all his Maple flavored sausage!
••• this is a family blog so i shan't comment.
I must have it, to, cause I suddenly have an uncontrollable urge to repair a roof and mow the grass!
••• just like your dad and grandad did. ¿remember?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! (NO OFFENSE FROSTY!)
••• not much taken... i am worried about the in-laws, though..
Posted by PRESTERJOHNofASIA at 04/29/2009 @ 2:23pm
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 7:44pm
We have a mild incident of a new flu strain
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm
hopefully.
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 7:47pm
We have a mild incident of a new flu strain
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm
"I just felt horrible," Roberts said. "I couldn't hold my head up and it was like the worst feeling I've ever felt."
hopefully...
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 7:53pm
MY SON IS HOME YA'LL!!! THANK THE LORD!!
Note to C3: The reason American students goes to Cuba for "Medical" training is because they don't meet the minimum requirements to get into Medical School here in the US. In otherwords, their MCAT scores fall well below 25. The average test scores are between 34 and 36 (and that's the top 2% in the nation) out of a possible 45. Also, GPA must be above 3.0
One more note: Cuban medical training is considered substandard in the west. Despite what the Canadian Medical Journal thinks, anyone medically trained in a third-world country will almost never qualify to get a license to practice medicine in the US, that especially goes for Cuba. (Hint: the Boards are administered in English only - gotta speak it, read it, and write it)
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 8:02pm
<i>Posted by Extraneous at 04/29/2009 @ 6:41pm </i>
Right. And this is why the "we shouldn't worry about this any more than normal flue" line of argument is silly. Should we panic? No, but we also shouldn't refrain from rational precautions.
Posted by Thrawn at 04/29/2009 @ 8:02pm
"According to Castro himself in this 2005 speech, 65 students graduating from the medical college were from the US."
Probably because it's a relatively new program and people haven't fully caught onto it yet.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:51pm
Actually, they've been going to Cuba for years now. Not as many because the ban was still in place, but they have. They were going via Mexico, Central and South America.
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 8:09pm
You are just part of the hysteria feeders.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 5:58pm
Very true, this much like the SARS thing is way overblown.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 6:25pm
maybe.
i'm sure people said the same thing in 1917.
best to be ready.
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 8:10pm
"Humans are not normally exposed to this flu, thus we lack the antibodies to fight it."
Posted by Extraneous at 04/29/2009 @ 6:41pm
But that's why the body developed a complement system. It's what we call an adaptive defense.
So fear not, we'll develop the antibodies, just give the antigens time to produce an immune response the virus.
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 8:26pm
Let's hope when antisocialist comes down with the Mexican flu some compassionate "marxist" nurse is available to take care of him. No copays or deductibles. Also, hopefully there is a ventilator available to prevent him from drowning in his own secretions.
Posted by nursevic at 04/29/2009 @ 9:11pm
"But there is, as well, a need for action to assure that insurance company greed does not erect barriers to care."
No, Mr. Nichols isn't a psychotic paranoid, just a duplicious scheming "shill" for Obamanation and the Demoncrats socialistic national healthcare plans! The health industry could not begin to fund fighting the class action law suits that would result from denying contracted care!
How would a $25.00 co-pay disable anyone paying a monthly insurance premium from seeking medical assistance? That is just a stupid assumption.
Posted by comancheamerican at 04/29/2009 @ 9:51pm
I swear this is one pathetic thread. The CNA is a joke. The things they're "proposing" have nothing to do with stopping the spread of Swine Flu.
The is nothing but another scam to spend more money we don't have. And CA wants as much as they can get their hands on because they're broke.
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 9:53pm
For the cigars.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/29/2009 @ 7:32pm
I've never had a Cuban.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 9:58pm
Note to C3: The reason American students goes to Cuba for "Medical" training is because they don't meet the minimum requirements to get into Medical School here in the US. In otherwords, their MCAT scores fall well below 25. The average test scores are between 34 and 36 (and that's the top 2% in the nation) out of a possible 45. Also, GPA must be above 3.0
One more note: Cuban medical training is considered substandard in the west. Despite what the Canadian Medical Journal thinks, anyone medically trained in a third-world country will almost never qualify to get a license to practice medicine in the US, that especially goes for Cuba. (Hint: the Boards are administered in English only - gotta speak it, read it, and write it)
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 8:02pm
I was under the impression that it was because it's free now, and poor students who can't afford college in the US now go to Cuba because there they can get a free education.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 9:59pm
maybe.
i'm sure people said the same thing in 1917.
best to be ready.
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 8:10pm
I can't argue with being prepared I'm all for it, I was a boyscout, but there's no point in creating hysteria over something that is not a real problem yet.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 10:00pm
Despite what the Canadian Medical Journal thinks, anyone medically trained in a third-world country will almost never qualify to get a license to practice medicine in the US,
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 8:02pm
Do you think before you post, or is it okay to post any nonsense as long as it hews to the party line? Do you have any idea of the overwhelming number of doctors - and nurses - practising in the USA who have had their medical education in "third-world" countries (most notably India) and then been licensed "to practice medicine in the US"?
Posted by oneworld at 04/29/2009 @ 10:29pm
<i>Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 8:26pm </i>
I mean, yes, adaptive defenses exist, but they're not a magic answer. The body often doesn't have the means to fight particular diseases, which is why medication is necessary. When you have something that is effectively immune to various forms of medication, you run into problems. Even when you're dealing with a virus, which I don't think can be cured by medication but rather is fixed by antibodies, to just blithely assume "no worries, it's cool, we'll adapt" seems dangerously short-sighted given the fact that epidemics aren't a mythical concept.
Posted by Thrawn at 04/29/2009 @ 10:52pm
What about the people living in the US who don't have any health insurance?
How many of the working poor without insurance can afford to miss work?
They'll be showing up to work sick and infectous until they're too sick to work.
Listen to the Flat Earth Society... It's no big deal... No one is dying here?
1918 Spanish flu spread across the globe, even reaching the Arctic and remote Pacific Islands, killing between 20 and 100 million people...
Posted by koroviev at 04/29/2009 @ 10:53pm
Posted by oneworld at 04/29/2009 @ 10:29pm
Yes, I know what I'm talking about, I'm a nurse and no, most Indians from India don't get their medical training in their home country. They apply for education visas to train over here in the US. That means they're attending college early on to improve their english. Almost all foreign medical students get their training in the US, Britian and Canada.
Most of the foreign nurses come from the Phillipines or the islands (West Indies, Bermuda, Virgin Islands, or Porter Rico)
And again the State Licensing Boards are very strict. If a foreign doctor can not grasp either the oral or the written portion of the test, they can't practice medicine in the US. They do not deviate.
Practicing without a medical license is a Class A felony, punishable up to 20 years.
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 11:05pm
Posted by Thrawn at 04/29/2009 @ 10:52pm
Back up, it can take about 5 to 7 days for our bodies to build up enough antibodies to resist and deactivate the virus.
However, there are a couple of reasons a body may not fight off a contaigen like that:
1. Compromised immune system
2. Inadequate production of Helper T Cells and/or Cytotoxic T Cells (Cytokines) - WBC
3. Or the virus is coated with a glycoprotein that fits into a CD4 receptor (like a plug into a socket) and locks in.
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 11:30pm
Posted by Thrawn at 04/29/2009 @ 10:52pm
One more thing, the medicines act as chemical messengers that aid WBCs.
Posted by ACook at 04/29/2009 @ 11:36pm
i'm sure people said the same thing in 1917.
best to be ready.
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/29/2009 @ 8:10pm
Frosty here is what people were worring about in 1917 (causes of death) (I hope the formatting works out):
01)Diseases of the heart -------------------------- 119,307
02)Pneumonia and influenza ------------------------ 115,526
03)Tuberculosis ----------------------------------- 100,789
04)Nephritis --------------------------------------- 73,685
05)Intracranial lesions vascular origin ------------ 67,362
06)Cancer and other malignant tumors --------------- 56,764
07)Accidents excluding motor-vehicle --------------- 55,054
08)Diarrhea enteritis intestine ulceration --------- 52,814
09)Premature birth --------------------------------- 32,390
10)Syphilis ---------------------------------------- 13,382
All causes ---------------------------------------- 981,239 ************************************************************
Premature birth is #9 at 32,390. I wonder if the people who kept statistics in 1917 would list abortion as #1 today
In 1998 (Last year I have statistics
01)Diseases of the heart -------------------------- 724,859
02)Cancer ----------------------------------------- 541,532
06)Stroke ----------------------------------------- 158,448
All causes ---------------------------------------- 2,337,256
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 06:46am
I can't argue with being prepared I'm all for it, I was a boyscout, but there's no point in creating hysteria over something that is not a real problem yet.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/29/2009 @ 10:00pm
Wait, It was Nichols who started all this "hysteria" with his claim that Republicans gutted preparedness by cutting $900 million.
There is nothing wrong with hysteria so long as you can use it as a club to beat your enemies with.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 06:56am
A few days back, someone asked about Conservatism and what it meant. I didn't have time to answer.
Today, rather than defend Conservatism directly, I'm going to provide an axample of my beef with Liberalism (which, in turn, will argue for incremental change to the status quo, a.k.a. Conservatism.)
This story is the classic tale of Liberalism in action: 1) Good intentions, followed by 2) moral vanity and arrogance, follow by 3) action, followed by 4) disaster for the objected of Liberal help, followed by 5) denial.
(Oh, and the article is from New Scientist, which means I'm talking science so I must be right.)
***********************************************************
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17039
Why freeing Willy was the wrong thing to do
Willy was never really free. The killer whale star of the Hollywood movie Free Willy had to be cared for by humans even after he was released and he never successfully integrated with his wild kin. Researchers now say attempts to return him to the wild were misguided...
The killer whale, whose real name was Keiko, died in December 2003, at about 26 years old. Despite efforts to integrate him with wild killer whales in Iceland towards the end of his life, he proved unable to interact with them or find food.
"While we as humans might find it appealing to free a long-term captive animal," the researchers say in the paper, "the survival and well-being of the animal may be severely impacted in doing so."...
The team's comments contradict those made by members of the Free Willy-Keiko Foundation, who declared in 2003 that his case had challenged the perception that whales cannot be returned to the wild. But Simon's account of Keiko's last few years shows just how unsuccessful his release was.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 07:21am
Premature birth is #9 at 32,390. I wonder if the people who kept statistics in 1917 would list abortion as #1 today
The people in 1917 are glad that we don't have butchers in dark alleys and rusty old barns. The people in 1917 would be astonished that with all our sophistication we still result to Mid-evil torture.
Posted by truthandjustice at 04/30/2009 @ 07:31am
There was a great injustice. Willy was captured at age 2 and put in a Mexican pen for 10 year, then he became a celebrity cause when he starred in two movies about freeing a captive whale.
This created public pressure to free him. But the great uniformed masses didn't know what they were talking about.
Oh sure, "freeing" a captive animal made Liberals feel good about themselves because they were ordering the universe to conform to their own sense of justice, but they were effectively handing down a death sentence to a poor creature that had been unlucky enough to be captured as a baby.
Liberals mistakenly believe...
(There I go again, Cons/Reps believe Libs/Dems are misguided. Libs/Dems believe Cons/Regs are evil.)
Liberals mistakenly believe that their values are universally held. And if they aren't universally held, well, they should be. "Everybody should think like me." is the epitome of arrogance.
Well victims of capture and incarceration don't always long for freedom, especially if they aren't human. Sometimes, all they really want is free frozen herring.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 07:34am
I think I already know how other people think is pretty high up there though [arrogance-wise].
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 07:54am
To a certain extent, this can be a tutaulogy: Muslims beleive... Socialists believe... Capitalist believe... When a group of people are defined by their beliefs knowing what they think isn't a stretch. "Liberals" as well as "Conservatives" seem to be defined by political beliefs.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 08:09am
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 07:54am
BTW, snow, keep well aware of Darin's MO...that being direct attacks on liberals and Democrats, then when cornered to feigh impartiality and bipartisanship and "Oh, I'm not saying BOTH sides don't do it..."...when he is trying to say that, but just focusing on one side.
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 08:20am
BTW, snow, keep well aware of Darin's MO...
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 08:20am
That's not my MO today. I started by saying that I couldn't defend Conservatism's approach to change, it just seems better than Liberalism's approach to change.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 08:36am
when they cough on you or yours their stupidity becomes your problem.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/29/2009 @ 3:16pm | ignore this person | warn this person
not meaning to pick on darrin, but this is how one must deal with most conservatives. one must find some kind of example of how they are directly affected or threatened by whatever you are discussing.
unless they percieve a direct threat or consequence to themselves or their own, they have a hell of a hard time giving a shit.
unfortunately many phenomena affect them in more complex, indirect manners, and explaining the labrynthine chain of cause and effect is difficult in the often limmeted time frame one has to attempt to explain, and the hard wired conservative brain just shuts off and filters out long before one has even had the opportunity to drive a point home.
nobody said it was easy...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/30/2009 @ 08:37am
I think you need many more axes than just Lib/Con to properly label the diverse set of beliefs supported by our Constitution.
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 08:33am
I'm fully in agreement here. This linearity is what causes a tiny, miniscule faction of Cons/Reps know as Fundamentalists who believe a literal interpretation of the Bible proves the Earth is 6000 years old get the entire Republican Party branded as anti-science.
Well, them and the faction that believes experimenting on human fetuses is morally reprehensible also get us branded as anti-science.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 08:42am
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 08:48am | ignore this person | warn this person
sure. sometimes its impossible.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/30/2009 @ 08:57am
That's not my MO today. I started by saying that I couldn't defend Conservatism's approach to change, it just seems better than Liberalism's approach to change.-----Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 08:36am
Darin, you realize that your "denial" actually made my point...look at it-
1. "I'm not defending Conservatism".
2. "It's better than Liberalism".
So you ARE defending Conservatism, by offering it as the only OTHER political ideological option, but you're trying to SEEM "bipartisan" or "impartial" by saying "Oh, I'm not saying Conservatism is great...just better than anything else!"
So what's the difference between you and a Larry or a SJCHER or even RIO???
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 09:19am
Let's hope when antisocialist comes down with the Mexican flu some compassionate "marxist" nurse is available to take care of him. No copays or deductibles. Also, hopefully there is a ventilator available to prevent him from drowning in his own secretions.
Posted by nursevic at 04/29/2009 @ 9:11pm
Sorry to disappoint Nurse, but I don't use the medical system or doctors. I have practiced holistic/natural health all of my life.
I'm perfectly fine with dying if it's time. I don't try and play G-d with my health. Use natural things, exercise, and let nature take it's course. No one is guaranteed to live forever.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 09:55am
1. "I'm not defending Conservatism".
2. "It's better than Liberalism".
So you ARE defending Conservatism,
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 09:19am
Have you every heard the "defence" of capitalism? "It's a completely shitty system for running things. Unfortunately, everything else ever tried is worse."
That's not a defense, councellor.
Changing the status quo through slow, deliberate, incremental changes is indefenssible as it perpetuates injustice. How can anyone defend that?
You can't defend it.
Unfortunately, humans make a lot of mistakes. Too often they confuse "change" with "progress" because of hubris and impatiences. Perpetuating injustice is indefensible, but it saves a lot of lives.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 09:56am
Think of the warning of a Category 5 pandemic in terms of the unheeded warnings of a Category 5 storm not so long ago.
Posted by mdetrano at 04/29/2009 @ 5:35pm
(This bears repeating.)
Posted by drhammer at 04/30/2009 @ 10:13am
this is not a issue that justifies all the panic driven by the media
"Scientists see this flu strain as relatively mild
Genetic data indicate this outbreak won't be as deadly as that of 1918, or even the average winter.
By Karen Kaplan and Alan Zarembo April 30, 2009
As the World Health Organization raised its infectious disease alert level Wednesday and health officials confirmed the first death linked to swine flu inside U.S. borders, scientists studying the virus are coming to the consensus that this hybrid strain of influenza -- at least in its current form -- isn't shaping up to be as fatal as the strains that caused some previous pandemics.
In fact, the current outbreak of the H1N1 virus, which emerged in San Diego and southern Mexico late last month, may not even do as much damage as the run-of-the-mill flu outbreaks that occur each winter without much fanfare.
"This virus doesn't have anywhere near the capacity to kill like the 1918 virus," which claimed an estimated 50 million victims worldwide, said Richard Webby, a leading influenza virologist at St. Jude Children's Research Hospital in Memphis, Tenn
"There are certain characteristics, molecular signatures, which this virus lacks," said Peter Palese, a microbiologist and influenza expert at Mt. Sinai Medical Center in New York. In particular, the swine flu lacks an amino acid that appears to increase the number of virus particles in the lungs and make the disease more deadly.
http://tinyurl.com/chcdnq
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 10:30am
According to the CDC, as of 4/29/09, there are 91 confirmed cases of swine flu in the US and 1 confirmed death.
Posted by plainbruce at 04/30/2009 @ 10:38am
I just think it's funny that Nichols and everyone else at the Nation seems to take every statement that the CNA says/releases as truth without any critical thinking. From what I hear the CNA is one of the most liberal organizations around.
Oh, never mind.
Posted by plainbruce at 04/30/2009 @ 10:42am
nobody said it was easy...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/30/2009 @ 08:37am | ignore this person | warn this person
the hard wired lefty ideologue is obnoxious in different ways...often over empathizing with those who deserve it not and ignoring personal responsibility.
but hard core leftyism has not been seen on a widespread basis since the 70's when it ushered in the reagan reaction which just finally played itself out ushering in the current reaction to that reaction...
the great circlejerk of life...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 04/30/2009 @ 10:53am
It is hysterical how overly partisan people can turn every issue into a partisan issue.We now have left/right views when it comes to diseases.I believe that we should be concerned with helping those who suffer rather than use the suffering to play partisan games with.
Posted by i'm nobody at 04/30/2009 @ 11:01am
Posted by i'm nobody at 04/30/2009 @ 11:01am
You are absolutely correct.
Posted by ACook at 04/30/2009 @ 11:07am
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 04/30/2009 @ 09:56am
Sure it's a defense. It's not like you're offering a THIRD option.
And have we yet seen paragraphs and paragraphs of your criticisms of Conservatism?
Or just more of the same ol' Darin/MARYBRET "Libs/Dems suck...oh, but I'm not saying Cons/Repubs are perfect...just better than everything else on the whole planet!" b.s.
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 11:22am
Posted by i'm nobody at 04/30/2009 @ 11:01am
It's primarily because the conservatives have completely dropped all logic, dumped their brains, and have just become rote contrarians.
Whatever the left says, they just automatically and reflexively think and say the opposite.
I just have to wonder, why do right wing trolls even bother hanging out on liberal websites?
Posted by Urieldagda at 04/30/2009 @ 11:36am
"I just have to wonder, why do right wing trolls even bother hanging out on liberal websites?"
Posted by Urieldagda at 04/30/2009 @ 11:36am
It's the same reason left-wing trolls hang out at liberal websites.
Posted by ACook at 04/30/2009 @ 11:41am
It's the same reason left-wing trolls hang out at liberal websites.---Posted by ACook at 04/30/2009 @ 11:41am
To mock and point out the fallacies of right-wingers???
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 11:46am
What if this did turn out to be a truly devastating pandemic?
Would waving co-pays be an option then?
Or is this something that could never be conceded?
Posted by !immutable at 04/30/2009 @ 11:57am
Posted by !immutable at 04/30/2009 @ 11:57am
Correction *waiving.
Posted by !immutable at 04/30/2009 @ 12:26pm
Posted by Urieldagda at 04/30/2009 @ 11:36am
I know you are, but what am I?
Posted by plainbruce at 04/30/2009 @ 12:34pm
I was told there would be punch and pie?----Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 12:23pm
That was SJCHERMAK's idea. He said more people will come if you say you're going to have punch and pie!
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 12:36pm
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 12:36pm
No, I think it was Darin and he said "A punch in the eye".
Posted by !immutable at 04/30/2009 @ 12:43pm
the figure being tossed around of 36,000 deaths from flu each year is totally bogus. That number is unsubstantiated by any method. It would have to include all deaths from pneumonia, and other respiratory diseases most unrelated to flu and never even tested for flu. the flu season of 1968-69 had an "attributed" number of deaths of 34,000 and that was by a factor of at least 10 more than our average season. The 36,000 figure began being used when the government began pushing the flu shots...perhaps to frighten people but that's just a guess on my part. Today the unwarranted use of that 36,000 figure would certainly keep people from panicking as early as they might otherwise. I am not suggesting a plot,just the fact that the number being "noted" is not valid.
Posted by budmurray at 04/30/2009 @ 12:55pm
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 12:45pm
A-Larry/antisoc...with an alteration- "Screw you guys, I'm going to El Salvador!"
B-Barry25
C-Darin...with later caveats of "Not that I'm saying we should eat dolphins...
just that I'm saying anybody who doesn't eat dolphins is a dopey liberal Democrat....
not that Republicans can't be dopey, but just that they're not AS dopey as Democrats...
and besides what's wrong with eating dolphins?"
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 1:30pm
well, they're full of mercury to start...
Posted by frosty zoom at 04/30/2009 @ 1:45pm
So true. I feel bad for people who like eating fish.
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 2:00pm
????
I've been eating mostly fish all of my life. In fact, never had a steak until I worked in a restaurant.
The whole mercury thing is so overblown.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 2:06pm
the figure being tossed around of 36,000 deaths from flu each year is totally bogus. That number is unsubstantiated by any method. It would have to include all deaths from pneumonia, and other respiratory diseases most unrelated to flu and never even tested for flu. the flu season of 1968-69 had an "attributed" number of deaths of 34,000 and that was by a factor of at least 10 more than our average season. The 36,000 figure began being used when the government began pushing the flu shots...perhaps to frighten people but that's just a guess on my part. Today the unwarranted use of that 36,000 figure would certainly keep people from panicking as early as they might otherwise. I am not suggesting a plot,just the fact that the number being "noted" is not valid.
Posted by budmurray at 04/30/2009 @ 12:55pm
Ok-go argue with the CDC
http://tinyurl.com/c9tkcl
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 2:22pm
antisocialist, you contradict yourself when you say the government pushes flu shots to frighten people. Then you say you are not suggesting a plot.
This kind of talk is counterproductive at a time when we should consider the seriousness of a global pandemic.
Posted by nursevic at 04/30/2009 @ 3:06pm
We now have left/right views when it comes to diseases.
Posted by i'm nobody at 04/30/2009 @ 11:01am
Of course we do! Stereoisomers, silly rabbit.
Posted by sntauri at 04/30/2009 @ 3:14pm
Agilent Technologies just introduced an LC and an LC/MS system that let's Pharma companies measure undesired components of drugs down to an order of magnitude below that which is required by the FDA. The ever vigilant progressive will now press the FDA to change its requirements to be 10x lower than now, in order to protect us from unacceptably high contamination levels. But why stop at that? Only zero is an acceptable level!
Posted by sntauri at 04/30/2009 @ 3:19pm
The whole mercury thing is so overblown.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009
You say that, but I bet you get taller in the summer.
:)
Posted by plainbruce at 04/30/2009 @ 3:38pm
Posted by sntauri at 04/30/2009 @ 3:19pm
Low doses can be the worst. BPA anyone?
Posted by !immutable at 04/30/2009 @ 4:05pm
I was told there would be punch and pie?
Posted by snowball666 at 04/30/2009 @ 12:23pm
No, just trollhouse cookies... ;-)
Posted by ACook at 04/30/2009 @ 4:20pm
People just tend to be too reationary when they hear about a new strain of disease. Just like I'm sure in LA whenever the ground shakes everyone thinks "This is the big one" instead of waiting to see if it is. Wait and see. Viruses are unpredictable and quick to evolve and change, but this is not the time for hysteria.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/30/2009 @ 6:10pm
antisocialist, you contradict yourself when you say the government pushes flu shots to frighten people. Then you say you are not suggesting a plot.
This kind of talk is counterproductive at a time when we should consider the seriousness of a global pandemic.
Posted by nursevic at 04/30/2009 @ 3:06pm
Don't know who you are quoting, but I made no such statements.
Here's my statement on the manipulation:
"So, small incidents like this are just the springboard for Obama and the left to manipulate a public paranoia and foment their socialist revolution.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm"
Nothing about shots, and in that posting and others I stated and accurately so, that this is considered by medical experts including researchers to be a mild form of the flu virus.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 6:14pm
Nothing about shots, and in that posting and others I stated and accurately so, that this is considered by medical experts including researchers to be a mild form of the flu virus.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 6:14pm
I don't think this has anything to with socialism I think you like the people calling this an epidemic are just paranoid. I think the reason he is responding so completely is because he doesn't want to happen to him what happened to Bush. Bush didn't respond decisively to Katrina. Instead he sat back and hoped it would take care of itself. In not responding he turned most of the country against him. I think Obama wishes to over respond rather than not respond and it become a serious issue.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/30/2009 @ 7:35pm
"So, small incidents like this are just the springboard for Obama and the left to manipulate a public paranoia and foment their socialist revolution.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/29/2009 @ 3:40pm"
This stuff makes you sound like RESE man.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/30/2009 @ 7:36pm
and besides what's wrong with eating dolphins?"
Posted by Mask at 04/30/2009 @ 1:30pm
Tastes like chicken....lol
Posted by ACook at 04/30/2009 @ 7:44pm
Tastes like chicken....lol
Posted by ACook at 04/30/2009 @ 7:44pm
CHICKEN OF THE SEA!
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/30/2009 @ 9:40pm
Nothing about shots, and in that posting and others I stated and accurately so, that this is considered by medical experts including researchers to be a mild form of the flu virus.
Posted by antisocialist at 04/30/2009 @ 6:14pm
Oh and by the way LVL. If it's just the Obma administration trying to push socialism then why is it it's Texas one of the reddest states in the union that just shut down their school districts in response to the flu?
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/30/2009 @ 10:01pm
Oh and why is it it's the WHO who are saying this thing is on the verge of a pandemic? These organizations are not CONTROLLED by the Obama administration. Stop and think for a second before you make these conspiratorial posts.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 04/30/2009 @ 10:03pm
SWINE FLU: THE BIG LIE.
Posted by ADELITA at 04/30/2009 @ 10:19pm
I have had to ask my insurance company to waive co-pays for care because of the economic crisis that I am facing as I applied for subsidized help. There is no indigent fund available in our county. The insurance company is suppose to create and run the programs as part of their contract to do business within the county and the state of New Mexico - a privatized indigent care that now doesn't exist. I was told that they would never waive it for the sniffles or just a bad cold especially in helping get to my PCP, which I see as a part my Seniorcare HMO. Where's the spittoon! I have found that my insurance company is now purging disabled and seniors off their Medicare senior health plans at the fist sign of medical problems or inability to pay their high co pays especially those that have predominate treatments requiring multiple appointments Physical therapy, mental health counseling and oncology for examples. There is a law called the Wellstone - Domenici Act that these insurance providers must provide equitable care that was passed melded into the Bush stimulus in Nov 2008. As a physically challenged person my insurance company must process my medical services through Medicare, where they receive 80% plus subsidies through privatized Rx drugs, its rackets set for the insurance corporation bottom line not the health of individuals. They are now refusing care and pointing to another plan at a local hospital where I would not be covered because of pre-existing conditions. In others words, they are pushing more and more people off the cliff into the abyss on the onset of the flu pandemic. In the Medicaid office last week I over heard social workers comment about how their clients were told to come to the state for help they were not getting it from their insurance co
Posted by Ecimino at 04/30/2009 @ 10:44pm
BTW, this whole Swine Flu thing is hitting Larry/antisoc pretty bad...
he keeps having this dream about following the Walking Dude to Las Vegas!
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 08:29am
Posted by snowball666 at 05/01/2009 @ 08:44am
Mother Abigail was African-American like Obama....
and Larry DOES (by his own admission) make a lot of trips to Vegas....
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm???
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 09:33am
The talk of swine flu is as foolish as the talk of leftist! Alway you seize on exploiting ignorance to push agendas and that is all this is;
"So far this year only one person--a baby visiting from Mexico--has died of swine flu in the United States, but more than 56,000 people died from the flu in the United States in 2006, the most recent year for which data is available, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC).
In 2005, the flu killed 63,001 people in the United States, according to the CDC. But that year the President of the United States did not use a primetime news conference to admonish the American people that they must wash their hands, and the Vice President did not say he would not want his family to have to ride on a plane or a subway because someone might sneeze near them.
An average of 36,171 people died each year of flu in the United States from 1993 to 2003, according to a recent CDC study.
Despite the recent fervor surrounding swine flu, conventional flu viruses have killed far more people than other, more publicized, strains in recent years."
Posted by comancheamerican at 05/01/2009 @ 09:53am
Posted by comancheamerican at 05/01/2009 @ 09:53am
But, uh, RIO by that standard, we shouldn't be worried about...
TERRORISM.....should we? Given the "statistically low" number of Americans who have died from terrorism in the last several years.
???
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 11:03am
Posted by snowball666 at 05/01/2009 @ 11:13am
Actually, I'd see Larry as more "Barry Dorgan" the ex-cop in charge of Randall Flagg's security who kneecaps Glen Bateman.
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 12:55pm
he keeps having this dream about following the Walking Dude to Las Vegas!
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 08:29am
Actually, I'd see Larry as more "Barry Dorgan" the ex-cop in charge of Randall Flagg's security who kneecaps Glen Bateman.
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 12:55pm
Who are these people? I don't recognize any of those names.
What or who is the Walking Dude?
Posted by antisocialist at 05/01/2009 @ 2:15pm
Scavenger pigs -- Eat putrefied dead flesh
God created scavenger animals to remove the stench, filth and disease inherent in putrefied dead flesh.
Comes now a law of health set down by Moses, "And the pig... You must not eat their meat or touch their carcasses; they are unclean for you."
Three cheers for Egypt, surely for the first death of this H1N1 virus was a boy in a Mexican village surrounded by a gigantic pig farm owned by a USA multinational. And a village that has complained for years about the poor health they suffer.
Posted by Alabama.John at 05/01/2009 @ 4:04pm
By the way, for all those who were saying "pshh, swine flu," there are actually multiple school closings in Texas due to it. Clearly, school administrators aren't blowing this off, and unless you want to say that some pretty conservative administrations are dramatically overreacting, I think it may be time to acknowledge that this probably shouldn't be ignored.
Posted by Thrawn at 05/01/2009 @ 5:03pm
Actually, I'd see Larry as more "Barry Dorgan" the ex-cop in charge of Randall Flagg's security who kneecaps Glen Bateman.
Posted by Mask at 05/01/2009 @ 12:55pm
Who are these people? I don't recognize any of those names.
What or who is the Walking Dude?
Posted by antisocialist at 05/01/2009 @ 2:15pm
I looked them up. I've never read anything by Stephen King or seen any movies based upon his books; so no wonder I didn't know.
Walking Dude- some kind of non speaking person in Chicago?
Posted by antisocialist at 05/01/2009 @ 5:08pm
By the way, for all those who were saying "pshh, swine flu," there are actually multiple school closings in Texas due to it. Clearly, school administrators aren't blowing this off, and unless you want to say that some pretty conservative administrations are dramatically overreacting, I think it may be time to acknowledge that this probably shouldn't be ignored.
Posted by Thrawn at 05/01/2009 @ 5:03pm
I'm fine with saying they are overreacting. This is JUST like SARS. Everyon freaked out like it was the black plague now its downgraded to a seasonal virus for God's sake. A good portion of people in medicine are saying this isn't a big deal. People are just overreacting.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 05/01/2009 @ 10:53pm
<i>Posted by Cccomfo1 at 05/01/2009 @ 10:53pm </i>
I mean, I think that's fair. Black plague this clearly isn't. At the same time, there are other people working on this that have a lot more knowledge than we do, and I'm not willing to blithely dismiss their concerns. Do I feel like there's reason to panic? No, not at all. Is it good that officials are at least paying careful attention to this? I think so.
By the way, I just want to throw something really random into this mix. I've noticed that I tend to frame my perspectives via questions, which in turn (don't ask how) reminded of a video which is also entertaining:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDQd49rEF_0
Posted by Thrawn at 05/04/2009 @ 01:20am