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RedditThe senior Republican member of the US Senate, Alaska's Ted Stevens, conceded defeat Wednesday in his race for a new term.
The announcement by Stevens confirmed that Democrats will have at least 58 seats in the new Senate. And with two contests yet to be settled -- in Minnesota and Georgia -- the party that just two years ago was a minority player in the chamber could begin the new Congress with a filibuster-proof majority of 60.
While several thousand ballots are still to be reviewed in Alaska, Stevens acknowledged Wednesday that he fallen so far behind Democratic challenger Mark Begich that his reelection was now out of the question.
"Given the number of ballots that remain to be counted, it is apparent the election has been decided and Mayor Begich has been elected," said Stevens, who campaigned for a new term despite having been convicted prior to the election on seven felony counts of hiding illegal gifts from an Alaskan contractor.
Republicans had hoped Stevens would be reelected and that he would then be expelled from the Senate or forced to resign -- a circumstance that would position an Alaskan Republican, perhaps Governor Sarah Palin, the party's 2008 vice-presidential candidate, to claim the seat in a 2009 special election.
But it was not to be.
After a long day of counting in Alaska Tuesday, Begich led by 3,724 votes. The Associated Press labeled this "an insurmountable lead, with only about 2,500 overseas ballots left to be counted" and identified the Democrat as the winner.
Steven's concession confirms that Begich, the mayor of Anchorage, will now be the 58th member of the Senate Democratic Caucus. (That's 56 Democrats, Vermont Independent Bernie Sanders and Connecticut Independent Joe Lieberman -- who on Tuesday was effectively welcomed back into the caucus by members who allowed the backer of Republican John McCain to retain his chairmanship of the powerful Homeland Security Committee.)
Could Democrats make it to 60 seats, thus positioning the party to override Republican procedural moves to block legislation and approve Obama administration nominations?
In a word: Yes.
Democrat Al Franken is still locked in a Minnesota recount fight with Republican Senator Norm Coleman. If Franken wins, as is very possible, that would be seat 59.
Democrat Jim Martin gets another shot at Republican Senator Saxby Chambliss in Georgia. If Martin wins that uphill but doable race, that would be seat 60.
Democrats went into the 2008 competition with a 51-49 split in the Senate.
Democratic candidates took seats where Republican incumbents were stepping down in Colorado, New Mexico and Virginia. And they beat Republican incumbents in New Hampshire, North Carolina, Oregon and, now, Alaska.
The Stevens defeat is a sweet one for Democrats, who had expected to displace the convicted senator with relative ease on November 4 but instead saw the felon pull ahead in the initial tabulations. Begich caught up only as as early votes and so-called "questioned ballots" were counted.
Begich's win is good news for Senate Democrats and, at least to some extent, for Senate Republicans, who will now be relieved of the burden of kicking Stevens out of their caucus. But that caucus is small, and getting smaller.
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John Nichols
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Despite recent indications otherwise...
I guess Alaskans in general are smarter than we thought.
Posted by Mask at 11/18/2008 @ 9:13pm
Posted by Mask at 11/18/2008 @ 9:13pm
I know you're a cynicist Mask. But there is stupid everywhere. It just so happens that Alaska was represented by stupid recently.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/18/2008 @ 9:34pm
Great news!
Posted by irabird at 11/18/2008 @ 9:47pm
I guess that settles that then. And Nate Silver can feel a touch more vindicated in his predictions.
Posted by yutsano at 11/18/2008 @ 10:04pm
looks like governor sarah will have to find another way to get to washington
Posted by rabunski at 11/18/2008 @ 10:06pm
It just so happens that Alaska was represented by stupid recently.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/18/2008 @ 9:34pm
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think.
Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
"filibuster-proof majority"
ah, but is it joe the lieberman proof?
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
"If Franken wins that uphill but doable race, that would be seat 60."
whooo,
good thing ms. palin wasn't elected viceroy in arms of the senate!
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:11pm
*"If Franken wins that uphill but doable race, that would be seat 60."
whooo,
good thing ms. palin wasn't elected viceroy in arms of the senate!
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:11pm*
I'm pretty sure that was a typo. Martin would get the Dems to 60, Franken gets them to 59.
Posted by yutsano at 11/18/2008 @ 11:25pm
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think.
Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm | ignore this person | warn this person
you shouldn't assume those who reach high levels of power and/or wealth are necessarily possessed of great ability either.
here, in america, any incompetant mushmouthed idiot trust fund wonder, born with a silver spoon in his mouth, surrounded by clever handlers his entire life...can become president!!! TWICE!!!
furthermore, any babbling hotty with half a brain can hide embarrasing beliefs, associations, ignorance, and wierdness long enough to convince a critical mass of wierd, ignoramuses and yahoos to elect her to the governorship of a state...
its a great country, ACOOK!!! the possibilities are almost limitless!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:27pm
the possibilities are almost limitless!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:27pm
Elvis Presley Sighting:
I was at a friend's house on Saturday, November 1st in the wee hours of the morning. I heard a noise that resembled a knock at the door and went to see if anyone was there. Outside stood a man that greatly resembled the King flanked by a woman who looked very much like Priscilla. He was sunburnt and appeared to be wearing a Univ. of Kansas shirt on under one of his trade mark jumpsuits.
Date Submitted: Monday November 3, 2008 - 08:35am
782
Location: West Lawrence, KS
Submitted By: Reed
Of: Lawrence, KS USA
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:35pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:27pm
GASP!
Talking about Sarah Palin that way is sexist!
SEXIST SEXIST SEXIST!
Just ask the newly feminist GOP!
LOL
This is really a funny time to be alive.
Posted by TexasFlood at 11/18/2008 @ 11:37pm
This is really a funny time to be alive.
Posted by TexasFlood at 11/18/2008 @ 11:37pm | ignore this person | warn this person
may you live in really funny times!!!
hee hee...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:43pm
Ted "A Series of Tubes" Stevens, former chairman of the Senate commerce committee where he strongly opposed 'Net neutrality, and who was a proponent of logging of old-growth forest.
Posted by aethera at 11/18/2008 @ 11:44pm
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:35pm | ignore this person | warn this person
damn! someone recognized me!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:45pm
TODD HAS A FUTURE!!!!!
Anchorage Elvis Impersonators
Here are the online press kits of 41 professional Anchorage Elvis impersonators and Elvis impersonators who will travel to Anchorage to perform at your event.
Please check off all the Elvis impersonators you wish to contact, and when you're finished, click the 'Proceed to Contact Form' button which is located near the bottom of this page.
Please note, in addition to Anchorage, these Elvis impersonators will also travel to Fort Richardson, Indian, Eagle River, Trapper Creek, Chugiak, Big Lake, Houston, Wasilla, Moose Pass, Willow, Palmer, Tyonek, Hope, Cooper Landing and many other locations in and around the Anchorage area.
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:49pm
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:49pm | ignore this person | warn this person
perhaps one will become the next alaska governor...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:51pm
Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeooooooooooooooooooooowwww!!!!!!!
Posted by winyahn at 11/18/2008 @ 11:54pm
"MYSTERIOUS ALASKA GOVERNOR ELVIS ONLY EVER SEEN FROM THE WAIST UP."
"Could this be the work of witches?"
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:58pm
i guess mr. stevens has had his tubes tied.
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:59pm
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/18/2008 @ 11:58pm | ignore this person | warn this person
there have been witches around ever since men walked with dinosaurs right after god created the world, you idiot!!!
or were those bones really nephilim? hmmm...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 12:02am
Senator Ted Stevens, true quote, on potential outcome of the trial:
"They're not going to shoot us, it's not Iraq. Worst can be that -- worst that can happen to us is we run up a bunch of legal fees and might lose, and we might have to pay a fine, might have to serve a little time in jail."
Even sweeter, Senator Ted Stevens, true quote, on an expensive massage chair in his house, "He put it there and said it was my chair. I told him I would not accept it as a gift. We have lots of things in our house that don't belong to us."
Posted by winyahn at 11/19/2008 @ 12:05am
Too bad for Ted. I'm glad he is gone. But, I got to give him credit for one awsome soundbite. "NO!"
That insane.... "NO!"
I hope they send him to a rest home type jail. Where he won't get beat up or anything.
Posted by koroviev at 11/19/2008 @ 12:06am
Posted by winyahn at 11/18/2008 @ 11:54pm | ignore this person | warn this person
"nobody fucks with thuh king."
elderly elvis (bruce campbell) from the movie, "Bubba Hotep", preparing to face the mummy thats preying on nursing home patients in a texas nursing home...
also
"yer some kinda...big bitch cockroach, aren't ya?" prior to killing the vicious scarab beetle, and...
"this place has bugs!" to the nursing home administrator after killing it...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 12:08am
Can see Ted now, waiting for the election results.
A campaign worker says, "I don't trust em, we better check the addition."
Ted-" Yeah, get the car. Head for the house. See if that extra room's done yet."
Posted by Sorelish at 11/19/2008 @ 12:23am
Bye, Sarah, you're stuck in Anchorage now.
We'll miss you. You were great entertainment value, while it lasted.
Would've loved to have had you has the voice of the GOP for years to come.
Obama - Palin debates in '12 would've been sidesplitters.
Now all we have are your reruns. And they all sound the same.
Posted by sloper at 11/19/2008 @ 12:31am
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think.
Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
Say what?! Actually, AC, it appears that folks here are perhaps judging someone who's more corrupt than they are. Stevens is crooked, and he's arrogant - he flaunts his corruption in the same manner that DeLay did when he was in Congress. And that's a lot less smart than you might think.
Posted by jmusolino at 11/19/2008 @ 12:33am
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think.
Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
= Don't judge those ACook judges to be smarter than he judges we judge them to be.
Posted by winyahn at 11/19/2008 @ 12:52am
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 12:08am
OK, the immaturity match is on!
Posted by winyahn at 11/19/2008 @ 12:58am
Shame on Alaska that only a few thousand more Alaskans preferred a democrat to a felon!
Posted by mikecope at 11/19/2008 @ 01:14am
And there's only one true Uncle Ted - the esteemed (and beloved) senior Senator from the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. And it was great to see him back.
Posted by jmusolino at 11/19/2008 @ 01:20am
Now all we have are your reruns. And they all sound the same.
Posted by sloper at 11/19/2008 @ 12:31am
She does a barely passable Tina Fey...but, again, just barely passable.
Posted by jmusolino at 11/19/2008 @ 01:21am
I don't understand this fascination with 60 Democrats in the Senate. A whole bunch of them are unreliable progressive votes (Ben Nelson, Bill Nelson, Ken Salazer, Mark Pryor, Mary Landrieu, and others...) Keeping them in line and voting in a unified fashion will be impossible, especially for a weak Majority Leader like Harry Reid.
I think the D's screwed themselves yet again-- they allowed Lieberman to bluff his way into a position of strength.
Posted by eagleye at 11/19/2008 @ 02:39am
Sent to the Begich HQ tonight, from Juneau:
Fifty years ago on January 3, 1959, I went down to the "ball park" in Cordova, AK, to play my saxophone in the High School Band for the Statehood celebration. It was cold, and our instruments played sharp, be we didn't care. The event was warming and most memorable. We were honored with Democrat Bill Egan as our Governor – and Democrats Bob Bartlett and Ernest Gruening as our Senators. The promise of the day was wonderful and truly inspiring.
But that "dream" has been sidetracked for a long time. Individually and collectively, we succumbed to the siren call of the worst angels of our natures – the greed, the thoughtlessness, the selfishness that has motivated too many years of our public policy. Tonight, absolute Republican rule has ended; we have recaptured the possibilities. This is a great day for Alaska, and one that I'm proud and happy to see.
Your hard work, the quality of Mark's candidacy, and the faith and good works of thousands of Alaskans have conspired to bring about a wonderful new chapter for our beloved state. I thank you, and I congratulate you. Peace,
Phil Smith Juneau
Posted by AlaskaVet at 11/19/2008 @ 03:06am
Fifty years ago on January 3, 1959, I went down to the "ball park" in Cordova, Alaska, to play my saxophone in the Statehood celebration. It was cold, and our instruments played sharp, but we didn't care. The event was warming and most memorable. We were honored with Bill Egan as our Governor – and Bob Bartlett and Ernest Gruening as our Senators. The promise of the day was wonderful and truly inspiring.
But that dream has been sidetracked for a long time. Individually and collectively, we succumbed to the siren call of the worst angels of our natures – the greed, the thoughtlessness, the selfishness that has motivated too many years of our public policy. Tonight, absolute Republican rule has ended; we have recaptured the possibilities. This is a great day for Alaska, and one that I'm proud and happy to see.
The hard work of the campaign staff and volunteers, the quality of Mark's candidacy, and the faith and good works of thousands of Alaskans have conspired to bring about a wonderful new chapter for our beloved state. I thank, and congratulate all who made this happen.
Peace, from an Alaskan,
~Phil Smith Juneau
Posted by AlaskaVet at 11/19/2008 @ 03:21am
Fifty years ago on January 3, 1959, I went down to the "ball park" in Cordova, Alaska, to play my saxophone in the Statehood celebration. It was cold, and our instruments played sharp, but we didn't care. The event was warming and most memorable. We were honored with Bill Egan as our Governor – and Bob Bartlett and Ernest Gruening as our Senators. The promise of the day was wonderful and truly inspiring.
But that dream has been sidetracked for a long time. Individually and collectively, we succumbed to the siren call of the worst angels of our natures – the greed, the thoughtlessness, the selfishness that has motivated too many years of our public policy. Tonight, absolute Republican rule has ended; we have recaptured the possibilities. This is a great day for Alaska, and one that I'm proud and happy to see.
The hard work of the campaign staff and volunteers, the quality of Mark's candidacy, and the faith and good works of thousands of Alaskans have conspired to bring about a wonderful new chapter for our beloved state. I thank, and congratulate all who made this happen.
Peace, from an Alaskan,
~Phil Smith Juneau
Posted by AlaskaVet at 11/19/2008 @ 03:21am
Shame on Alaska that only a few thousand more Alaskans preferred a democrat to a felon!
Posted by mikecope at 11/19/2008 @ 01:14am
Mike, Shame on them yes, but it's no surprise. The GOP party rants and raves about faith and values, yet supports convicted felons. You know how doctors are supposed to take the hippocratic oath? Well, to join the GOP, they have to take the hypocritic oath.
You know the old addage, he's a son-of-a-bitch, but he's our son-of-a-bitch. That's the rethug creed. They are a party of sons (and daughters)-of-a-bitches and assholes (male counterpart).
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 11/19/2008 @ 06:57am
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think.
Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
Whats your defination of sucessful?
Posted by Truthman at 11/19/2008 @ 07:32am
Here's their core. Remember how the 911 shock gave way to a heart thumpin' patriotic? Hand over heart, draped in the flag Chimp n Cheif told them what they wanted to hear, the call of Gesimine. A heart needs blood, and the thirst for this was ripe for media narratives. Evildoers, brave rescuers, warriors, battles, wars and the heroism.
That's their core. Any ol' evildoer and Chimp n Chief will do. Could be, almost was:
evildoer - exotic/celeb/Muslim & 'blue collar hero' Hillary
evildoer - exotic/celeb/Muslim & war hero McCain / Christian breeder hero Palin
Posted by winyahn at 11/19/2008 @ 07:49am
Whats your defination of sucessful?
Posted by Truthman at 11/19/2008 @ 07:32am
Let me take a stab at this for the neocons, Truthman. Being successful means not getting caught with your hands in the cookie jar. Not having to do any physical labor as well.
Then, he who ends up with the most toys wins and denies access to the cookie jar for anyone else.
Translate cookies into stocks, bonds,properties (foreign and domestic) overseas tax havens and a federal tax return of zero dollars so you don't have to pay any taxes but have millions or billions of tax sheltered money at your disposal. That's success for the neocons.
For the rest of us, success means being able to pay your house, car, college loans, and remaining bills off in a lifetime. If you die with any money left over and didn't have to mortgage your home before you died, you would be considered successful.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 11/19/2008 @ 07:57am
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 11/19/2008 @ 07:57am
Hummm, interesting defination. I wonder if our friend ACook has the same dictionary?
Posted by Truthman at 11/19/2008 @ 08:03am
From the State of Change Blog:
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/ state_of_change/384365/gop_senators_to_ alaska_please_get_rid_of_stevens_for_us *************************************************************
Darin is missing from every post on the nation.
Posted by Malcontent at 11/18/2008 @ 7:01pm
I actually had to look through my ignore list just to be certain. I thought maybe I was missing something but yup, Darin got eaten by the blog gremlins!
Posted by yutsano at 11/18/2008 @ 10:03pm
Yeah, they banned me.
I'm running out of unique E-mail addresses.
I don't think I even used any naughty words yesterday. I am at a total loss. Could the all powerful Oz that banned me at least tell me why?
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 08:07am
On the bright side, my screen name gets more and more accurate with each banning.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 08:11am
On the bright side, my screen name gets more and more accurate with each banning.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll_Who_Voted_For _That_Loser_Palin_Just_Cause_She's_"Hot" at 11/19/2008 @ 08:11am
Posted by frosty zoom at 11/19/2008 @ 08:16am
Thanks, Frosty. I like to start the day with a laugh.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 08:28am
It might not be "banning", Darin.
Remember, I had the same trouble with TWO different accounts, hence the rise of "Maskdelta" for a while there.
The website has been buggy ever since they "improved" it.
Posted by Mask at 11/19/2008 @ 08:53am
Good job Stevens has gone, shouldn't have benn running again in the first place being a felon and all. Sarah Palin can also say goodbye to that little job as well....boy, that was a relief!!!!
Posted by Caj at 11/19/2008 @ 09:42am
Posted by Caj at 11/19/2008 @ 09:42am
Taking Stevens' Senate seat was always an "iffy" proposition for Palin. True, it thrust her back into the national spotlight (she's going back to nearly invisible as Gov of AK)....but it would have meant burying her as a junior Senator in Congress and little chance she wouldn't be out of her element.
Posted by Mask at 11/19/2008 @ 10:39am
OK, the immaturity match is on!
Posted by winyahn at 11/19/2008 @ 12:58am
"RIGHTEOUS!!! RIGHTEOUS!!!"
Crush, Finding Nemo
Posted by Benchrest at 11/19/2008 @ 12:42pm
I'm glad Stevens is finally out, and so are a lot of Alaskans. But...
At the risk of being ridiculed, I have to mention that guy Jefferson, who was caught with over 100,000 dollars in his freezer.
I'm currently a Democrat, but, to be fair, shouldn't we fire this guy as well? He actually got re-elected. All the back room dealers should be dealt with. I'm not a fan of conservatives, in general, but it's clear that they are not the only politicians making mistakes by taking bribes.
To have total credibility and a strong upper hand we need to be totally consistent with our responses to criminal behavior in the halls of government.
Posted by ficheye at 11/19/2008 @ 1:09pm
Posted by Benchrest at 11/19/2008 @ 12:42pm
"Ain't no need to watch where I'm goin'; just need to know where I've been."
Mater, Cars
Posted by Mask at 11/19/2008 @ 1:58pm
"Felon Senator "
A whole new category of titles for ex-congress critters? I like the sound of that one...Felon Senator Stevens. Supported by the bible belt of Alaska.
Felon Mayor Kilpatrick.
I think that should become standard in news stories hencforth.
Darin you big fat greedy propaganda eatin propaganda spreadin cockroach humpin troll you.... why do you think the bible belt of AK went for a convicted felon?
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 2:14pm
Posted by ficheye at 11/19/2008 @ 1:09p
agreed, in principle. The difference now is that Stevens, member of the Family Values GOP, is CONVICTED. Jefferson is indicted. Even after 7 1/2 years of ChimpCo rule, most people are still considered innocent until proven guilty.
Unless one has been declared an "enemy combatant", a nepharious ephemeral term that means what they want it to mean. So far I have little hope that the change sold to us weeks ago will result in much change of chum-talk on the GWOT.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 2:19pm
Posted by jmusolino at 11/19/2008 @ 12:33am
I wasn't talking about Stevens. I'm glad he's gone, good riddance to him.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 4:52pm
Glad to know Stevens has gone and good riddance to the horrible looking man...I guess Sarah will have to think of something else to run for now.
Posted by Caj at 11/19/2008 @ 4:58pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/18/2008 @ 11:27pm
The successful person I was speaking of was Sarah Palin. I assumed that's who C3 was putting down by calling Alaska (particularly the Governor) "stupid". It gets pretty tiring after a while when those of us who haven't learned fiscal responsibility (metaphorically speaking), feel we can bash others who have the intelligence to do so.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:00pm
Whats your defination of sucessful?
Posted by Truthman at 11/19/2008 @ 07:32am
Dreaming big and making it happen. That's the difference between white collar and blue collar.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:12pm
why do you think the bible belt of AK went for a convicted felon?
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 2:14pm
I think most of them voted straight Republican ticket knowing that (barring an aquittal on apeal, which aint gonna happen) he would be replaced by the Republican Governor.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 6:10pm
Whether the Democrats have a functioning fillibuter proof majority or not, this is a great victory and restores my faith in the electorate.
And at least we don't have to worry about the likes of Sarah Palin rearing her ugly head anytime soon in the U.S. Senate.
Keep whatever you cross crossed for the next two..
Posted by chaoszen at 11/19/2008 @ 6:18pm
I'm a Scorpio so I keep my balls crossed as a matter of Astrological necessity.
Posted by chaoszen at 11/19/2008 @ 6:19pm
It just so happens that Alaska was represented by stupid recently.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/18/2008 @ 9:34pm
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think.
Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
I've been meaning to weigh in on this one because it is one of my pet peeves: that is people who think that one's values are a result of intelligence.
I'm reading a book titled, "Fooled by Randomness" by Nasim Taleb. It's very good. He talks a lot about behavioral psychology and traders. It seems we aren't as rational as we would like to believe and emerging scientific inquiry is demonstrating that.
In fact, during our formative years, we subconsciously internalize hueristics to "speed up" our decision making process. As a demonstrations rank the following in order:
Status; health; power; beauty; intelligence; speed; humor; generosity
All of these characteristics have the ability to create a Darwinian survival advantage given a particular set of environmental circumstances. An intelligent person can use reason to order these given a set of circumstances; however, in the abstract, intelligence is useless in ordering them.
However, these heuristics are subconscious biases that give us "short cuts" for deciding the order.
If you are equidistant for a glass of water and a sandwich, and you are hungry and thirsty, the purly rational person would die as there is nothing to "tip the scale" as to which way to go first. The person would die of endless dithering. These subconscious biases created preferences that are not based on reason, but give us a survival advantage when action is needed quickly.
long story short: Your values are not based on reason. You are not smarter than us.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 6:23pm
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 6:23pm
O.K. Darin, whatever you say. Glad to see you are reading. But am a bit concerned about your weight now that in your new incarnation you are a Big_Fat_Troll.
Overeating due to stress or depression can put an undue strain on your heart..
Posted by chaoszen at 11/19/2008 @ 6:30pm
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:00pm | ignore this person | warn this person
well...after having heard her speak off the cuff...i'm not so sure she's all that after all.
for years a-political masses, ignorant of history, economics, sociology. science, marched off to polls and voted for anyone who told them what they wanted to hear, swallowed half baked aynrandian economic theory, and voted for prepackaged, heavily handled and coached straw men and women, often because of some vague and bloated hypocritical claims of moral superiority.
like caribou barbie.
furthermore until it became painfully obvious that the rightwing did not in any way represent anything resembling competance (sometime around 05 or 06)nor the moral superiority it crowed about, the media largely failed to do its job and ask politicians any tougher questions than "did she blow you" and played along with the scripted talkingpointspeak assumptions of the top rightwing aynrandian thinktanks.
but the truth finally came out and the american people could no longer keep swallowing the bullshit.
bullshit like...
keep spending more and more and more despite the fact you don't get paid more and more and more - unless you are a corporate CEO...
the gop is the party of values!!! yeah, but what kind? cheating and scamming and sleazy bathroom hypocrisy?
geez, ACOOK - looking at the results, seems like ALL SORTS OF IDIOTS found themselves in positions of high power!!!
and not just trust fund wonders, but those supported by the MONEY OF IDIOTIC TRUST FUND WONDERS AS WELL!!!
and until 2006 american idol marching moron anti-intellectual, cult of stupidity amuhrukuh GULPED IT ALL DOWN AND BEGGED FOR MORE!!!
THE DYSTOPIC FUTURE IS NOW!!!! LOL
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 6:35pm
You shouldn't judge others who are more successful than you. They're a lot smarter then you think. Posted by ACook at 11/18/2008 @ 11:08pm
Success doesn't prove intelligence just like lack of success doesn't prove a lack of intelligence. There are models who make millions of dollars. Does that mean they are intelligent? No it means they have something people want to see.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:45pm
It gets pretty tiring after a while when those of us who haven't learned fiscal responsibility (metaphorically speaking), feel we can bash others who have the intelligence to do so. Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:00pm
Oh I'm fiscally responsible. I have zero debt. I pay off everything on time. If that's success then I must be doing really well.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:49pm
If you are equidistant for a glass of water and a sandwich, and you are hungry and thirsty, the purly rational person would die as there is nothing to "tip the scale" as to which way to go first. The person would die of endless dithering. These subconscious biases created preferences that are not based on reason, but give us a survival advantage when action is needed quickly.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 6:23pm
Bad example. The intelligent person would go for the water.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:52pm
Whats your defination of sucessful?
Posted by Truthman at 11/19/2008 @ 07:32am
Dreaming big and making it happen. That's the difference between white collar and blue collar.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:12pm | ignore this person | warn this person
you know i luv ya, ACOOK, but this is where i see the root of the problem with pre-second great depression america.
it reminds me of the worst teachers i had who carelessly and sarcastically told children of janitors if they didn't do well in school they'd end up a janitor.
why do we on the one hand extol the virtue of work while insulting the hard working blue collar and petty white collar proletariat? and then wonder why, in a world, an economy of scarcity, that non genius kids end up joining gangs and selling drugs rather than...
work the kind of jobs so disparaged by the big dreamers whose big dreams are built on the hard work and sweat of janitors, carpenters, check out clerks, and all other such humble, hard working non big shots.
and for decades now the cult of rightwing stupidity has flourished by pitting struggling lower level professionals (like you and me) against their less fortunate fellows, and big dreaming, struggling, so-so achieving schmuks have deluded themselves with champagne dreams and caviar visions...
and contempt for those less fortunate than themselves.
success? how about happiness? happiness has a lot more to do with security than vast wealth for most.
and while a few have accumulated vast fortunes, most have become less and less secure.
the great reality check reckoning is under way NOW. people can no longer hide from reality. they cant aford it. the credit cards are all maxed out!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 6:55pm
Money and Power do not equal intelligence ACook. There have been plenty of stupid people who are rich. Also on top of that Sarah Palin isn't rich as I recall so if that is your barometer of success, judging by your fiscal responsibility comment, then she is far from successful. Bush Jr. is plenty wealthy but everything he touches falls apart. He's sunk so many companies he should have been permanently unemployed. He just happened to have connections. I see people in my business make it all the time who are talentless an unintelligent. They make because they are conniving and shallow. Intelligence can often be an impediment to success if it is coupled with morality. That's why there are many scientists out there who make barely anything.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:57pm
success? how about happiness? happiness has a lot more to do with security than vast wealth for most. and while a few have accumulated vast fortunes, most have become less and less secure.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 6:55pm
Actually I have to agree with you fully on everything and expound upon one point. If we judge success through happiness often times those with the most money and power are the least happy therefore the least successful. I have seen many families who's parents are rich but their families are in shambles and there lives are all but meaningless.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:59pm
universal health care, affordable education for those smart and motivated enough to benefit from it, living wage, retirement security =
happiness for most people...
striving for more and more and never satisfied with what one has, living in fear of living on the street through little fault of their own, feeling shame for not being boss bigshot buzillionaire yet working hard =
the last 30 years of our history...
which not only does not = happiness, but...
has gone farther to destroy families and morality AND ironically led to the erosion of competitiveness and efficiency we need to compete successfully on the global stage.
we have abandoned the way of the ant in favor of the way of the grasshopper and now comes winter...we have become the hare when we should have been the tortise (slower, steadier, sustainable growth) all because of...
our crazy, silly, childish, BIG CHAMPAGNE DREAMS AND CAVIAR VISIONS!
not everyone can be a chief, and every cheif needs his indians at LEAST as much as they need him, but in our nation of BIG DREAMERS, NOBODY WANTED TO ADMIT THEY WERE A LOWLY INDIAN AND EVERYBODY STRUTTED ABOUT LEVERAGED TO THE MAX PRETENDING TO BE KING AND QUEEN OF AMERICA!
until their credit ran out, their job dissapeared and or the bank took their mcmansion back...
and aynrandian rightwing ideological snake oil salesmen all too often aided and abetted by sleazy DINO sellouts who gulped their koolaid every bit as heartily as schmuko the marching moron non buzillionaire values voter rightwing clown...encouraged this wicked, stupid, self destruction and irresponsibility EVERY SYEP OF THE SAD, PATHETIC WAY.
socialism? sure! i'll take a swig of that! how much worse can it be than the poison of the last 30+ years?
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 7:20pm
<i>Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:59pm</i>
I think you're absolutely right on this. Though I think that being financially careful, etc. is an important thing, I don't understand why we should measure success by the amount of stuff you have by the time you die. From many philosophical and religious positions, not the least of which being Christianity, this position is completely absurd. If anything, slavish devotion to the continued pursuit of wealth is the antithesis of success because it misses the things in life that really matter, like a concern for the other and a willingness to engage in meaningful relationships with other people.
<i>Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 6:23pm </i>
I'm not entirely sure I follow your argument here. The most you establish is that some of our prioritization systems can't be rationally justified (though the next question should of course be "why continue using them? If they're rational for reasons we don't understand, keep using them, but if they're not rational...let's not"). I don't, though, understand why this entails a complete value skepticism. Even if it isn't clear whether you go for a sandwich or a cup of water (which it is, as pointed out; lack of water will kill you faster), that doesn't mean that when your choices are "kick a puppy" and "kill 6 million Jews," that the choice involved is completely arbitrary. I understand that this may be specific to moral values, but if your argument wasn't intended to implicate morality, what other part of the thread was it responding to exactly?
Posted by Thrawn at 11/19/2008 @ 7:25pm
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:52pm
I would have gone for the sandwich first and wolfed it down. Then I would have washed it down with the water. Drinking the water first would have left me thirsty again after eating the sandwich.
My I.Q. has been measured at 147-148 a number of times. Maybe not high enough to proceed to "endless dithering".
Posted by chaoszen at 11/19/2008 @ 7:39pm
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:59pm | ignore this person | warn this person
great minds think alike, ccom...i'm on a roll man...feeling the spirit here...
yer soooo right. i've had the opportunity to see it all...
stupid poor folk of less than genius intelligence and/or motivation who refused to get an honest job because they were ashamed to do necesary work that was disparaged by the boss bigshots of the middle class...
rich people, often inheritors of great wealth but often possessed of not half the common sense, intelligence, nor decency of half the janitors and mechanics i've known...
and stupid middle class schmukos stuck in an economic vise grip of insecurity and striving, ever fearful of economic ruin (and therefore hateful to those below) and living beyond their means in worshipful, envious admiration of those more fortunate than them to the point that they leverage themselves into a hellishly doomed form of debt slavery...
but of course decent, reality addicted folk of all economic levels have tried to talk sense to these hungry ghosts all along.
to no avail...until reality slammed into fantasy...
oh well...action, reaction. here's to a brighter, realistic future.
lower expectations - the secret of happiness, and ironically enough, real prosperity (through slower, saner, sustainable growth).
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 7:43pm
WHOA NELLY!!
What's this? I can find only copies of the same short story. Anybody clued into this story?
FOX News:
RAYMONDVILLE, Texas -- A Texas judge has set an arraignment for Vice President Dick Cheney, former Attorney General Alberto Gonzales and other officials accused of involvement in prisoner abuse.
Presiding Judge Manuel Banales said Wednesday he will allow them to waive arraignment or have attorneys present rather than appear in person Friday.
Banales also said he would issue summonses, not warrants. That allows them to avoid arrest and the need to post bond.
Willacy County District Attorney Juan Guerra accuses Cheney, Gonzales, a state senator and others of involvement in prisoner abuse at a federal detention center in south Texas.
Defense attorney Tony Canales accuses Guerra of "prosecutorial vindictiveness" and not following procedure.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 8:00pm
hmmm... dig, dig, scrape...
[The grand jury in Willacy County, in the Rio Grande Valley near the U.S.-Mexico border, said Cheney is "profiteering from depriving human beings of their liberty," according to a copy of the indictment obtained by Reuters.
The indictment cites a "money trail" of Cheney's ownership in prison-related enterprises including the Vanguard Group, which owns an interest in private prisons in south Texas.
Former attorney general Gonzales used his position to "stop the investigations as to the wrong doings" into assaults in county prisons, the indictment said.]
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 8:06pm
It's Texas all right...
[The seven indictments issued on Tuesday in Willacy County -- a place of bizarre legal and political battles under the outgoing prosecutor --included some targeting of public officials connected to District Attorney Juan Angel Guerra's own legal battles.
Regarding those indictments, Guerra said, "the grand jury is the one that made those decisions, not me."
Guerra was under indictment for more than a year and a half until a judge dismissed the indictments last month. Guerra's tenure ends this year after nearly two decades in office. He lost in a Democratic primary in March.]
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 8:15pm
Dreaming big and making it happen. That's the difference between white collar and blue collar.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:12pm |
Dumbest comment this week.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 8:17pm
Wonder if Uncle Ted will get a job with CH2M HILL (purchaser of Veco) as a lobbyist after he gets out of jail. I hear Sarah has a big pipeline project looking for federal money and CH2M HILL is looking for construction contracts.
Posted by OneVote at 11/19/2008 @ 9:04pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 6:55pm
I can agree with you on most of your post, but the bigger problems stem from a dsyfunctional home/family life.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:04pm
Dumbest comment this week.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 8:17pm | ignore this person | warn this person
yer blue collar, right? thought you would like that one, crabs...lol...
acook is a nurse...
for some reason i have a soft spot for her despite the enfuriating things she sometimes says. guess she reminds me of my ex...
show me a masochist and i'll show you a happy man!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:10pm
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:04pm | ignore this person | warn this person
LOL - was thinkin about ya (see above)...
luv ya, A...
;)
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:11pm
Oh I'm fiscally responsible. I have zero debt. I pay off everything on time. If that's success then I must be doing really well.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 6:49pm
No dear, the "fiscal" part was only a metaphore I was using to make a point that successful/smart people take advantage of every opportunity. They are the ones who can think quickly on their feet and stay ahead of the game (or curve) while they're putting their plans into action. They are the one who can get people to believe in their ideas.
Sarah Palin is smart in that sense because she got the people of Alaska to believe in her ideas and how best she could serve them.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:16pm
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:04pm | ignore this person | warn this person
but sure...in an imperfect world there always have been, always will be shammers, scammers, bullshitters and excuse makers...
and blaming all of one's problems on external factors is indeed a dangerous, fruitless rabbit hole down which to dive.
but mental illness is passed on from generation to generation. not necesarily by genes, but by socialization. a rough cycle from which to escape...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:18pm
show me a masochist and i'll show you a happy man!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:11pm
(LOL) I see you met my husband. You should see the studded collar I got him last Christmas.... ;-)
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:20pm
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:20pm | ignore this person | warn this person
oh baby! i love you!
lol...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:23pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:23pm
(LOL)... :-)
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:25pm
You should see the studded collar I got him last Christmas.... ;-)
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:20pm | ignore this person | warn this person
more of that and i'd still be married...
har har har...
unfortunately we were both really sadists at heart. lol...
so how bout it, A...
you can't be that down about barry o'bama's election, can you?
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:31pm
Darin, excellent input on reasoning. That's the Black Swan author right? Bloody brilliant Brit. Same vein, awesome author, recommending- Antonio Damasio.
Posted by winyahn at 11/19/2008 @ 9:43pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/19/2008 @ 9:31pm
Naw, but I'm not optimistic about it either. But somebody had to get elected I suppose. Lord knows I prayed for a much better candidate other than the Mad Hatter and Willie Wonka.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:47pm
Sarah Palin is smart in that sense because she got the people of Alaska to believe in her ideas and how best she could serve them. Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:16pm
Hitler was an absolute success then. He was a genius as well. You don't have to be intelligent to get people to follow you. You have to have one of many things. Force get's people to follow you to.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/19/2008 @ 9:57pm
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 9:47pm
This post has denigrated to the point incomprehensible drivel. Kind of like a chatroom at 3.00 AM...
Posted by chaoszen at 11/19/2008 @ 9:59pm
And the smell of tuna in the air...
Posted by chaoszen at 11/19/2008 @ 10:07pm
No Franken and No Martin?
Four words to keep in mind...
"Olympia"
"Snowe"
"Susan"
"Collins"
Posted by Mask at 11/19/2008 @ 10:19pm
Get your ass to Georgia Obama and do some politickin'!
Posted by bleedingheart at 11/19/2008 @ 11:06pm
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/19/2008 @ 08:11am
HEY YOU!
Yea you, you big fat troll.
I guess it's not too bad that they banned you. It is their blog and all.
But, retrogresively erasing you is kinda creepy... revisionist. (is unjournalistic a word?)
Anyway, good to see you're back. You big fat troll. (You still suck).
Eric
Posted by Malcontent at 11/19/2008 @ 8:39pm
Posted by Malcontent at 11/20/2008 @ 01:17am
"yer blue collar, right? ..."-ibble
Well, not really and maybe. That is part of the problem with ACOOKS stupid comment. My "real" job is middle management, I oversee about 40 contractors, but I also repair and install equipment. My business is kind of blue collar, I forge high end architectural items. Within that realm I am blacksmith, electrician, plumber, carpenter, fabricator, machinist, painter and occasionally stone mason. Those tasks would probably get labeled "blue collar". Then I am also designer, sales, accountant, collections and supervisor. those would be labeled "white collar".
What about "Joe the (not really) Plumber. Usually blue collar, but if he wants to own the company he becomes white collar, till someone calls in sick then he needs to be blue again.
Another insipid part of ACOOKS comment is the assumption that blue collar folk lack ambition and the ability to progress in their lives and careers. That is nonsense. She also said that white collars "make it happen". Depending on the industry they could not "make it happen" without skilled hands to do the work. It also leaves out millions of people that own their own blue collar type businesses, auto mechanics, electricians yes...plumbers (isn't it funny how they latch onto a symbol one minute then deride him the next?).
ibble, you were spot on when you wrote about the disdain that many have for blue collar workers, then again they have disdain for "elites" too. Basically they hate Americans that don't fit their ideals, which is most of us.
so, I stand by MY comment, ACOOKS comment was the dumbest comment of the week, bar none.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 07:53am
Anyway, good to see you're back. You big fat troll. (You still suck).
Posted by Malcontent at 11/20/2008 @ 01:17am
I love you too, Eric.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 07:53am
Dreaming big and making it happen. That's the difference between white collar and blue collar.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:12pm |
Dumbest comment this week.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/19/2008 @ 8:17pm
Given the 1800 character limit, I think we have to allow for the fact that not every idea can be adequately epressed in every post. I know I struggle with this.
Besides, Acook, your a nurse, right? I thought nurses fell into the category of pink-collar.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 07:58am
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 07:53am | ignore this person | warn this person
lol - as an educator i have seen a lot of silly crap in my time, including unrealistic notions of the value of a four year liberal arts degree.
i also question the assumption that education can "fix all the problems", by the way. i'm all for an educated populace, but beyond a certain point of development question whether more formal, traditional, education improves the economy or whether an improved economy makes it more likely to have a more formally educated populace...
i also question a lot more, in terms of formal education, the assumptions underlying such, and the way we allocate resources...from pre-school to post secondary...
kinda on a tangent, i know, but its early...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 08:02am
As we can see from the campaign, Palin is not successful due to any abilities other than shiny bauble. she took five colleges to land a journalism degree, she was appointed to the job in the oversight of oil revenue without ANY experience in that field. She ran up huge debt as mayor, built a building with no clear title and managed to get a paltry amount of votes to become gov'ner. As AK's bible belt has shown us, felon or incompetence are no hindrance to holding elected office for them. I doubt she will get reelected.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 08:03am
Get your ass to Georgia Obama and do some politickin'!
Posted by bleedingheart at 11/19/2008 @ 11:06pm
Too risky.
There's at least a 75% chance Chamblis will win Georgia with or without Obama's campaigning. If Obama suffers a political defeat before he even takes office it will impact his momentum.
Besides, one extra Senator won't make a difference in what Obama can accomplish. And even if he thinks it will, he would be well advises to follow Mask's advice quietly behind the scenes trying to turn Collins and Snowe. Less press attention if he fails but also a much greater chance of success.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:03am
"unrealistic notions of the value of a four year liberal arts degree."
now you are writing about my wife. Art History degree.
She does nothing related to that to earn, but... I could not produce the fine art I do without her eye and knowledge, so it works out in the end.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 08:07am
Dreaming big and making it happen. That's the difference between white collar and blue collar.
Posted by ACook at 11/19/2008 @ 5:12pm
Survival is the difference between white collar and blue collar. Also the definition of white collar and blue collar positions is changing rapidly.
The only white collar jobs left these days are wall street brokers (the ones left), investment gurus, attorneys (only some really fit the white collar status), Senior management of large corporations (mostly defense industry but also banking, pharmaceutical and insurance), and the final white collar position is the inherited wealth passed down from generation to generation....these are the well connected business folks calling the shots.
Many people posting here would like to believe themselves to be in that upper echolon or bracket, but aren't. If you have to work just to pay your mortage and living expenses, you probably don't have one of these white collar jobs I'm referring to.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 11/20/2008 @ 08:11am
A nurse would be "blue collar" plain and simple. because they don't make anything "happen". They just heal and care.
Stereotypes save time.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 08:12am
While I am on my soapbox...
Why do offices of lawyers and doctors get labeled "professional buildings" or "professional parks" while plumbers, builders and electricians offices don't? Are they not as professional as the "over educated elites"? I made money playing volleyball as a beachbum, I was a "pro". Shouldn't my beach chair/umbrella have been a "professional office park"?
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 08:20am
I understand that this may be specific to moral values, but if your argument wasn't intended to implicate morality, what other part of the thread was it responding to exactly?
Posted by Thrawn at 11/19/2008 @ 7:25pm
Damn you 1800 character limit!
There's no way I can communicate this adequately, but I'm talking about (primarily) three books: "Fooled by Randomness" by Nassim Taleb, "The Bell Curve" by Herstein and Murray; and "The Mismeasure of Man" by Stephen Jay Gould. (Also check out "The Black Swan" by Taleb (as winyahn mentions although I beleive he is Lebanese, not British), perhaps you were thinking of the author of "The Tipping Point", Malcom Gladwell, who has a new book coming out addressing this topic called, "Outliers: The Story of Success". He seeks to debunk the myth of the "self-made man".)
Anyhow, I'm talking about the idea that drove Einstein crazy: that the nature of the universe INVOLVES randomness. (This is at the heart of quantum physics. Einstein proposed this and then said, "God does not play dice with the universe" and tried to "walk it back" but never succeeded.)
Now, I capitalize "involves" because that is not the same as "saying that everything is random". Perhaps it's more accurate to say that objects are governed by probabilities.
Now, don't be an extremist! You cannot extrapolate this statement to say that Bill Gates success was completely random.
I need another 1800 characters to explain why.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:44am
I'm a Lutheran. Offical Lutheran doctrine "believes" in "pre-destination". This was explained thusly:
A father was a grand champion chess player and he was teaching his 9-year old daughter to play. And he said, "When I play my daughter today, I'm going to win. I can't tell you that the winning move will be queen to rook's 5. I can't tell you how many moves it will take. But the proability that I will win today is so close to 1 that we can talk of it being a certainty. Now, next month she many be beat me, but today it is inconceivable."
Taleb writes about the randomness of life in "Fooled by Randomness" and he is right.
In "The Mismeasure of Man" Gould "debunks" the notion of genetic determinism, but concedes that genetics do play a major role in intelligence. In-so-far as one accepts the fact that objects are governed by probabilities, any kind of "determinism" is automatically debunked.
Herstein and Murray did not write about determinism as many misunderstood, they wrote about correlations: IQ is highly correlated with financial "success".
So, many of you have called me stupid for not supporting Obama, or supporting single payor healthcare, or supporting a much steeper progressivity in the income tax.
Intelligence has nothing to do with it. I came to see the wisdom in my Mother's often repeated quote that, "Unless you earn it, it won't mean anything to you." And I've seen people who've become bitter and have had their lives consumed with self-pity over the fact that others have more than they do and they are entitled to more. (I'm talking about millionaires here, not the poor.)
Anyway, I'm out of characters again.
To sum up, my values are not a result of stupidity any you'd be wise to understand that.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:44am
as an educator i have seen a lot of silly crap in my time, including unrealistic notions of the value of a four year liberal arts degree.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 08:02am
I agree. This is like saying people who drive $80k BMWs make more money than people who drive Geo Metros, so go buy an $80k BMW and wait for the cash to start rolling in.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:51am
Finally,
I define success as propigating your genetic code.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:59am
Yeah, I'm a hopelss romantic. So sue me.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 09:00am
Finally,
I define success as propigating your genetic code.-----Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:59am
My son has none of my genetic code...yet he defines my success.
Posted by Mask at 11/20/2008 @ 09:19am
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:51am | ignore this person | warn this person
heehee - you know what has happened to high school graduation rates since ww2?
basically...nothing. they have gone up and down over the years, but once one adjusts for butt covering manipulation of statistics, one is awestruck with just how little has changed...
and yet year after year, instead of facing reality and admitting that until we start genetically altering our species to create superhumans, people basically remain people (some succeed, some get by, some fail) people with phd's and "eed's" in education will insist upon justifying their salaries and jobs by torturing classroom teachers with one magical "fix all the problems" educababbling snake oil remedy after another...
unfortunately when education is seen by the educated and their parents as a right instead of a privilidge, it is also viewed by far too many as primarily someone else's responsibility, an attitude which inherently devalues the process and he sense of value of an education.
a privilidge is something one strives for - in modern america, a right is taken for granted.
its one of those ironies - the more we obsess with all the horrible awful terrible problems of education and rip our hair out trying to "leave no child behind" (jeez!) and listen to overeducated education professionals (like bill ayers, lol) the worse the "problem" will become.
oh well...so much for my soap box!!! lol...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 09:19am
I know you're a cynicist Mask.
no, a cynic
someone posted that Palin is not rich. when she released her tax returns recently, they revealed assets of two million $.
that a whole thread can be devoted to a stupid comment by that stupid poster acook does not bode well for this blog.
like bad money will drive out good, stupid posters will drive out intelligent ones.
I don't believe acook is a nurse, I believe he/she is a plant.
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 09:21am
I define success as propigating your genetic code.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 08:59am
Bristol and Levi are successes!!!!
Pretty low expectations there, Cockroach. That makes thousands of crack whores succesful business entrepeneurs.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 09:24am
My son has none of my genetic code...yet he defines my success.
Posted by Mask at 11/20/2008 @ 09:19am
You are propigating your moral code.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 09:34am
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 09:21am | ignore this person | warn this person
once the responses approach the century mark the quality/relevance of the commentary invariably declines. nuthin' new.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 09:35am
Pretty low expectations there, Cockroach.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 09:24am
By aiming low I greatly diminish my disappointments.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 09:39am
By aiming low I greatly diminish my disappointments.
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 09:39am | ignore this person | warn this person
there ya go! lol...
lose weight, troll boy. we care about you despite your politics (of which i've certainly seen worse, i have to say).
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 09:42am
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 09:21am
I'm not sure where I mentioned Palin's money situation?!??!?
As for ACOOK, she MAY be exactly what she claims. But it's a pretty RARE demographic...i.e. African-American female who's a vehement conservative Republican who supports Dubya.
Posted by Mask at 11/20/2008 @ 10:18am
Posted by Darin_the_Big_Fat_Troll at 11/20/2008 @ 09:34am
Well, which is it, Darin?
"genetic codes" or "moral codes" that define success???
Posted by Mask at 11/20/2008 @ 10:19am
unfortunately when education is seen by the educated and their parents as a right instead of a privilidge,
I refuse to take seriously a post about education from someone who cannot spell privilege, but that's just me.
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 10:41am
Speaking of big fat trolls...
I am concerned about JOMAMA. I would like to think that he just fled after the nationalization of his beloved Wall Street, but I fear that he may have succumbed to his weight problem. Anybody know what happened to the fella?
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 10:47am
I'm sure Maasch appreciates your concern. he is on hiatus, temporary one suspects.
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 10:50am
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 10:41am | ignore this person | warn this person
indeed...
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 10:47am | ignore this person | warn this person
speaking of intelligent poor spellers, same here.
Posted by Mask at 11/20/2008 @ 10:18am | ignore this person | warn this person
i'll take her at her word. takes all types to make a world. who knows, eh?
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 10:52am
Did we give him a haitul hernia by making him hold up capitalism via socialized bailout?
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 10:55am
senators of both parties a breathing a sigh of relief, that the felon Stevens was not reelected. now they don't have to vote to boot him out.
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 11:29am
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 10:55am | ignore this person | warn this person
he is in real estate, is he not? hope his ticker held out.
its a funny feeling to be a lefty these days...after predicting financial doom for years, what a hollow victory! sux when you wish you were wrong...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 11:33am
and i wish the congress would tone down the grandstanding a bit in regard to the big three talks and think about the real impact of whatever they decide to do. raking the execs over the coals is all fine and dandy, but i hope more is going on in the heads of our elected reps than vengeance and/or photo ops/sound bytes...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 11:37am
Where was the same raking over the colas with AIG and other heads of banks and ivestment firms?
The cons are viewing this as a chance to attack unions, they have no idea of the incredible loss that will take place if the little 3 go under. Something like 10% of employment in the USA is tied to the auto industry. Like the Iraq war, and resitance to a universal health care system, they are willing to throw the whole country down the tubes for ideology. While accusing us of drinking cool refreshing sugary beverages.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 11:42am
Where was the same raking over the colas with AIG and other heads of banks and ivestment firms?
there is one big difference between the banks and the automakers. the banks hold OUR money. when they go down the tubes, we and our money goes with them.
I like "raking over the colas"
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 11:50am
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 10:52am
Hey, ya never know. I'm sure SOMEWHERE out there has to be a right-wing African-American woman who loves George Bush.....there ARE after all 300,000,000 people in the country.
If the odds were 300,000,000:1 for one existing...it could explain ACOOK!
LOL
Posted by Mask at 11/20/2008 @ 11:51am
A nurse would be "blue collar" plain and simple. because they don't make anything "happen". They just heal and care.
Stereotypes save time.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 08:12am
Well Crabbie, I see you settled few things. But, since we nurses "don't make anything happen", there would be no need for us to monitor your vital signs, insert your IVs and catheters, give you the right meds, prep and assist the surgeon with your surgery, work in your poorer communities, help treat the mentally ill, the elderly, those who are incarcerated, write public health policies, do research, or even become doctors ourselves. You wouldn't need us to manage your pain to make you more comfortable or hold your hand while the last hours of your life slip way. I guess there's a whole host of things that you don't need from nursing community afterall.
So again, you're right, there's so much that "we don't make happen".
Posted by ACook at 11/20/2008 @ 1:05pm
Posted by ACook at 11/20/2008 @ 1:05pm
Your criteria, not mine. See what happens when you make stupid comments? They come back to haunt you.
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 1:14pm
I have a high opinion of the nursing profession. I think they are, in general, underpaid and underappreciated. Underappreciated by doctors and the public that have not encountered loving caregivers.
But, they are not considered "white collar". They don't "make it happen" under the definition of the free marketeers. They don't create wealth, they don't create jobs...they are "takers" according to the JOMAMAMa types. And worst of all, they have UNIONS!!!
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 1:16pm
"Dreaming big and making it happen. That's the difference between white collar and blue collar."
"Your criteria, not mine. See what happens when you make stupid comments? They come back to haunt you."
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 1:14pm
My "dreaming big and making it happen" post was in reference to people like Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, T. Boone Pickens, and John D. Rockefeller - they are the ones who make/made things happen.
I have never said nor implied that my chosen profession is more than what it is.
Posted by ACook at 11/20/2008 @ 3:10pm
And worst of all, they have UNIONS!!! Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 1:16pm | ignore this person | warn this person
good point. if acook were a real nurse he/she would own up to the advantages union membership conveys on the workers.
as for blaming the unions for Detroit's troubles, may I point out that unions are much much more powerful in Germany and Japan, yet those folks are selling their cars just fine. that is until the "crash". you think Germany would let Mercedes Benz go under?
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 3:34pm
to go into the nurse profession one must have one quality above all, compassion. I have not see any of that from the poster acook. an' dat's why he/she is a phony
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 3:48pm
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 3:34pm | ignore this person | warn this person
those places also...
a) don't compensate their executives as absurdly as ours do and...
b) have socialized medicine so pay no insurance either...
thats not the entire explanaition, of course, but that awful horrible "socialism" actually makes life easier for german/japanese businesses of all types...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 4:18pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 4:18pm
America Hater!!!!!
Posted by crabwalk at 11/20/2008 @ 4:29pm
thats not the entire explanaition, of course, but that awful horrible "socialism" actually makes life easier for german/japanese businesses of all types... Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 4:18pm | ignore this person | warn this person
and for all residents of those countries, most other civilized nations. we are backward.
here's one that'll put a lump in your throat and mine. my mom was diagnosed, far too late, with colon cancer, which had spread to her liver. no liver transplant for her.
my uncle in Germany too was diagnosed with that illness, and here too the cancer had spread to the liver. HE got a liver transplant, and has a much longer life expectancy.
word to the wise, I'm keeping up with the colonoscopy thing.
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 5:13pm
Posted by ibbleblibble at 11/20/2008 @ 4:18pm
COMMERNIST!
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 11/20/2008 @ 6:29pm
"I believe he/she is a plant."
Posted by emile duBois at 11/20/2008 @ 09:21am
Damn!
Now, sure, I've as much as called acook dumb before. And I may have implied...not sure... that she's not my type of woman.
But, to call her a plant?!? And a trans-gender plant, apparently... geez...
(Nothing against trans-gender plants, of course. I smoke them all the time.)
Posted by Malcontent at 11/20/2008 @ 8:54pm
James A. Swanson, Los Altos, CA www.bushleagueofnations.com [For FREE download of entire book]
Seeing felon Stevens get kicked out of office is a joy. Thank you, Alaskans! I now have something nice to say about slightly more than half of you.
The rest of you Alaskans, however, "Palin comparison to" thoughtful homo sapiens. (Hey, lighten up, that's a joke!)
Two serious comments:
(1) Yes, 58 is better than 57, and 60 would be even better, but 60 is not an ironclad insurance policy.
The GOP wing of the Democratic Party--DINOs and Blue Dog Democrats--can be counted on for mischief.
In any case, whether 60 votes can be rounded up for a cloture vote depends heavily on the particular legislation.
(2) But here's the important question: Will the 58 or 59 or 60 "good guys" really fight for "us" and America and push legislation that is truly transforming and progressive?
Real progressive transformation of America must be driven from the grassroots up, not from the "top down" by business-as-usual career politicians.
I'm alarmed that Obama is appointing so many business-as-usual politicians. Time will tell if he has the will to withstand their toxic influence.
Also, Big Oil, Big Insurance, Big Pharma--the list goes on--and their lobbyists have not left town.
Electing Obama was the easy part. The real work begins today … and again tomorrow … and again every day thereafter.
We must stay engaged, take names, kick butt, and never give up.
We know what to expect from Neanderthals in the Republican Party. They are thus "reliable." As for our Democratic leaders, we trust them at our peril.
We must keep our friends close, our enemy closer, and our Democratic leaders closest.
Jim Swanson, Los Altos, CA www.bushleagueofnations.com
Posted by jswanson at 11/20/2008 @ 9:27pm
Mr. Nichols, just a small nit to pick with respect to your statement that the Democrats were "a minority player" but "could begin the new Congress with a filibuster-proof majority of 60."
As you point out, Democrats had a 51-49 edge going into the elections. Fifty-one is definitely not a minority. Now, that 51 includes Sanders and Lieberman (who, techinically, are independents, but they caucus and vote with the Democrats. Without them, the Democrats would have had 49, which is still not a minority since the Republicans only had 49, too. But you have to count them with the Democrats and, in fact, you did count them with the Democrats in your "filibuster-proof majority of 60."
So, while the Democrats did make some incredible gains this election, they did not go from a "minority" to possibly reaching a "filibuster-proof majority."
Posted by GBGB at 11/21/2008 @ 2:47pm