The Beat

Palin: “Just Trying to Give Tina Fey More Material"

posted by John Nichols on 10/05/2008 @ 11:31pm

The surreal satire of a political campaign that is Sarah Palin's quest for the vice presidency touched down Sunday in Nebraska, a state that has reliably backed Republicans presidential tickets in every national election since 1968.

Why Nebraska?

Palin said she was just in an Omaha kind of mood.

"The pundits today on TV --- one of them was saying, check out the vice president's schedule, check out where she's going -- she's going to Nebraska," Palin told an enthusiastic (New York Times booing) crowd at her rally in the largest city of one of the reddest states.

"But the pundit was saying the only reason she'd be going there is ‘cause they're scared, so they gotta go there and shore up votes. And I so wanted to reach into that TV and say no, I'm going to Nebraska because I want to go to Nebraska," the Republican contender chirped.

Palin claimed that she has personally organized the trek.

"And you can ask -- and probably the reporters will ask -- the top dogs in our campaign why am I in Nebraska, and it's truly because I asked to come to the heartland of America today," the Alaskan governor announced.

The governor is, of course, lying.

Palin was in Nebraska because it is one of two states (Maine is the other) where electoral votes are allocated to national tickets based on the count in individual congressional districts. Republican strategists are worried that the McCain-Palin ticket could lose the Omaha-based 2nd district, where the Democratic campaign of Barack Obama and Joe Biden is making a serious push.

Hence, Palin was in Nebraska not because the heartland was tugging at her heartstrings, and certainly not because she is charting her own campaign schedule.

This was troubled campaign's desperation dispatch of a candidate who has become something of a political punchline -- as she herself admitted on Sunday.

Palin now makes regular references on the campaign trail to what she described as a "less than successful" series of interviews with CBS News Anchor Katie Couric.

At one point, Palin said she stumbled through the interview because she "annoyed" and "impatient" by Couric's failure to ask enough questions about energy independence.

In Omaha, Palin referenced Tina Fey's devastating parodies of her on NBC's "Saturday Night Live" program, saying of her flubbed interviews: "I was just trying to give Tina Fey more material -- job security for Saturday Night Live."

As if to confirm her commitment to keeping the comedy material coming, Palin on Sunday offered another of her "I-can-see-Russia-from-my-house" geopolitical surveys.

The woman who says she wants to be a more powerful vice president than Dick Cheney told backers that U.S. troops are "fighting terrorism and protecting us and our democratic values" in Afghanistan.

Then, she added, "They are also building schools for the Afghan children so that there is hope and opportunity in our neighboring country of Afghanistan."

Comments (179)

  1. sarah palin - almost as mushmouthed as king mushmouth...

    palin, quacking happily in colorado, said this...

    "We see America as the greatest force for good in this world. If we can be that beacon of light and hope for others who seek freedom and democracy and can live in a country that would allow intolerance in the equal rights that again our military men and women fight for and die for all of us."

    ok...lets see here...

    We see America as the greatest force for good in this world."

    so far so good. complete sentence...subject and verb with properly placed direct object...solid...

    but then there's this gem...

    "If we can be that beacon of light and hope for others who seek freedom and democracy"...

    still solid...but then there's this...

    "and can live in a country that would allow intolerance in the equal rights that again our military men and women fight for and die for all of us."

    what???? whats that supposed to mean? wow...is this what miss south carolina sounds like when she's all growed up and barracudaized???

    later, attempting to attack obama by association to former radical and now education professor bill ayers, she made sure to note that not only does she read the new york times (that would have been a newspaper she could have quoted to katie couric...but not if she only started "reading" it after the couric debacle when handlers started shoving newspapers in her face and telling her which parts of them to read and quack about) but she gives that liberal bastion quite a compliment...

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/05/2008 @ 11:43pm

  2. Uhh...nah it's too easy.

    Posted by yutsano at 10/05/2008 @ 11:45pm

  3. "Well, I was reading my copy of today's New York Times and I was interested to read about Barack's friends from Chicago," Ms. Palin said at the fund-raiser in Englewood, Colo. "Turns out one of Barack's earliest supporters is a man who, according to The New York Times, and they are hardly ever wrong, was a domestic terrorist and part of a group that, quote, launched a campaign of bombings that would target the Pentagon and U.S. Capitol. Wow. These are the same guys who think patriotism is paying higher taxes."

    WOW INDEED! crazy what ya learn once ya start readin them fancy shmansy newspapers!!!

    really mrs mooseburger?

    sorry for the repst from other thread, but i thought it really belonged here...

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/05/2008 @ 11:47pm

  4. "Some of his comments that he has made about the war that I think may -- in my world – disqualifies someone from consideration as the next commander in chief."

    ooooooh! nice one mrs mooseburger...

    some of his comments that he has made (as opposed to those comments he has not made) about the war that i think may - in my world - disqualifies someone from consideration...

    WHAT? what the hell is that supposed to MEAN?

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/05/2008 @ 11:54pm

  5. If merely being an idiot disqualied a person to be president.....

    It's amazing there aren't earthquakes all over the east coast just from Jefferson, Adams, Franklin, Washington, Madison et al spinning in their graves.

    Posted by Pogge at 10/06/2008 @ 12:00am

  6. The woman is coming completely unhinged. The more she talks, the bigger nutcase she becomes.

    Her whackjob pastor needs to perform another exorcism or something. Maybe find the witch who is responsible for casting a 'looney' spell over her and run that witch out of town like he did in Africa.

    Posted by Lillian at 10/06/2008 @ 12:11am

  7. You know, after they pulled Palin out of...left field...and the hardcore wingnuts defended her like she was the next coming of Saint Ronny, it became obvious to me that, had McCain selected Elmer Fudd as his running mate, they'd all be crowing about how 'hunting wasksally wabbits' was a great qualification to be commander in chief.

    Now, it's beginning to look like they would have been better off selecting Mr. Fudd as McCain's VP.

    At least he's more articulate...and sounds more intelligent...

    ...and appears to be more sane.

    Posted by Lillian at 10/06/2008 @ 12:17am

  8. As a woman I find her repellent. She represents everything I hate, a weak intellect, a mean spirit and a complete lack of introspection.

    I pray she goes back to Alaska and takes a good sized chunk of the Wingers with her. Maybe she could take ALL of the Wingers with her(it's a big state!). They could join up with the secessionist outfit her hubby used to belong to, secede and really start worrying about Russia.

    Posted by Pogge at 10/06/2008 @ 12:29am

  9. The woman is a complete fake. The Reps can market almost anything but this is an offense to the intellect of Americans. Is it all about image and zero about genuine, real ideas?

    I wonder -if that duet gets elected - how will our foreign relations go with Spain, Russia, Iran, Afghanistan, and... all of the above? We could eventually exceed the gaffes of this administration with unthinkable consequences.

    Posted by Frank42 at 10/06/2008 @ 01:14am

  10. I wonder if anyone can help me here. I am a lifelong Democrat, and I planned to vote for Barack. But I just learned this weekend that Mr. Obama spent 5 years in Chicago in the late 90's contributing to a domestic terrorist named William Ayers! Is this true? Apparently, Mr. Ayers was part of a group of domestic terrorists who tried, and in some cases succeeded, in killing Americans in the late 60's for political reasons. All of this I might have forgiven Barack for, but apparently, Mr. Ayers is still not sorry for what he did and actually is proud that he got off on a technicality even though he admitted that he was guilty.

    I'm sorry, but I don't think I can vote for Mr. Obama after this.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:03am

  11. I wonder if anyone can help me here. I am a lifelong Democrat, and I planned to vote for Barack.

    I'm sorry, but I don't think I can vote for Mr. Obama after this.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:03am | ignore this person | warn this person

    lol - you are neither a lifelong democrat nor were you voing for obama.

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 08:12am

  12. Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 08:12am

    "lol - you are neither a lifelong democrat nor were you voing for obama."

    So, it's true that Mr. Obama has been working with domestic terrorists in Chicago? Do you think Mr. Obama would put Mr. Ayers in charge of something important if Barack were elected? Goodness, that's scary!

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:18am

  13. On a clear day, she can see any country she wants from Alaska. Those are very special glasses. Fred

    Posted by ffeldman at 10/06/2008 @ 08:22am

  14. So, it's true that Mr. Obama has been working with domestic terrorists in Chicago? Do you think Mr. Obama would put Mr. Ayers in charge of something important if Barack were elected? Goodness, that's scary!

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:18am | ignore this person | warn this person

    oh my! lets add this into the formula...FORMER domestic terorist, CURRENT education professor...

    lets add something else left out by mrs. palin and the soundbyte smear engine. the association appears to be tenuous, based upon serving as appointees on the same commision, and...thats about it...

    but as we see now, the obama campaign has begun pointing out some of mr. mccain's former casual and not so casual aquaintances...like the keating 5 boys...

    hmmm...

    nice try, ponty. don't think it will work, though, but keep tryinig...

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 08:23am

  15. Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 08:23am

    Well, no, actually I read this weekend that Mr. Ayers is not sorry for what he did as a domestic terrorist, and even though he's currently an 'education professor' he's actually quite proud that he got away with it, even though he admitted he's guilty. Did you hear that too, or do you only read the New York Times?

    "lets add something else left out by mrs. palin and the soundbyte smear engine. the association appears to be tenuous, based upon serving as appointees on the same commision, and...thats about it... "

    Oh, no, that's not what I heard. Apparently, Barack directed millions of dollars towards the 'Annenberg Challenge', which was run by Mr. Ayers, to indoctrinate school children in far left wing views. Didn't you hear that, too? I can provide a link if you need it, I realize this is often left out of stories written by the New York Times, so I'm happy to help. As we all know, the motto of the New York Times is 'all the news that fits, we print', and this news apparently didn't fit.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:28am

  16. by Couric's failure to ask enough questions about energy independence.

    this is impossible.

    THE SUN. IT'S HOT!

    that is the only way.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 08:45am

  17. "So, it's true that Mr. Obama has been working with domestic terrorists in Chicago? Do you think Mr. Obama would put Mr. Ayers in charge of something important if Barack were elected? Goodness, that's scary!"

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:18am

    Ponti - 1st of all, Obama wasn't working with Ayers when he was a member of the Weather Underground - a radicalized version of the SDS. Check the dates of their activities and you'll see that Obama was in grade school at the time. Secondly, many of the members of the WU have since renounced the more extreme actions of their group. They were never attempting to kill anyone, although they did plan the destruction of buildings that housed pieces of the establishment they were rallying against.

    The WU were reacting to what they felt was misrepresentation of the American voice, namely the aggression of our military abroad (Vietnam, Cambodia, etc.) The SDS did mobilize a huge antiwar movement in the United States and exposed the FBI's Cointelpro - an early version of domestic spying, which is again bearing fruit under the cover of the Patriot Act.

    So whether you condone the actions of the Weather Underground or not (I do not), put things in context and judge based on the facts. One could argue that the Students for a Democratic Society were just as instrumental in advancing the cause of Civil Rights in America as any other liberal group in America at the time, but the fringe group of the SDS, or the Weather Underground, were generally acting on their own, without the approval of the leadership inside the SDS.

    Obama's relationship to Ayers is uncertain, but the link to "domestic terrorism" is completely bogus and this guilt by association line is getting stale.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 08:49am

  18. Well, first....Tina Fey just nailed Caribou Barbie AGAIN Saturday night.

    Couple of my fave lines were:

    1. The outing of the REAL reason the real Palin asked Joe Biden "if she could call him Joe"...no, not friendliness..."because I practiced a few zingers where I call you Joe!"

    2. The gay marriage question where "Palin" (Fey) said "I believe that marriage is a sacred institution which should be limited to unwilling teenagers!"

    3. On global warming "Nobody knows if this climate change whosit whatsit is man-made, or just a natural effect of the end of days!"

    Ignorning PONTI and LVIB (who frankly couldn't care if Palin's only actual "regular periodical" is the TV Guide)....the polls aren't good.

    CBS and CNN both had Biden winning it, with Palin trailing badly. And a new AP-IPSO poll shows that INDEPENDENTS who "leaned McCain" 56-44% before the debate..

    now "lean Obama" 52-48%.

    She can "pitbull it" and go out and try to sound like "Hannity in a skirt"....but that's only red meat for the PONTI/LVLIB base....nobody else.

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 09:06am

  19. Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 08:49am

    "Ponti - 1st of all, Obama wasn't working with Ayers when he was a member of the Weather Underground - a radicalized version of the SDS. Check the dates of their activities and you'll see that Obama was in grade school at the time."

    Yes, I hear this talking point regularly regurgitated by Obama supporters and dutifully parroted in the media. The problem for you and Obama is, Ayers says to this day that he is proud of what he did, that he is guilty as sin, and free as a bird. So, regardless of when the acts occurred, Ayers remains an unrepentant terrorist and as culpable of terrorist acts as the day he committed them, despite the fact that he got off on a technicality. And anyone who associates with this domestic terrorist does so, rightfully, at risk to their own reputation, and such associations are extremely pertinent as the attest to the judgement, character, and political views of people like Michelle and Barack Obama.

    Now, as far as the Annenberg Challenge goes, we all know that was a well-funded attempt by an unrepentant terrorist to indoctrinate children in hatred and far-left views. Barack worked extensively with Ayers on the Annenberg Challenge, it's a part of the public record. You folks need to make up your mind whether you're defending that or minimizing it.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:09am

  20. Yawn

    Posted by CHIP THORNTON at 10/06/2008 @ 09:11am

  21. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 09:06am

    MASK, until you can learn to intelligently discuss issues, rather than simply wear your cheerleader outfit and wave your pom-poms, you're irrelevant.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:11am

  22. I wonder if anyone can help me

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:03am

    http://www.phone-sex-psychologist.com/

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 09:13am

  23. Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 09:13am

    Does it work for you? I would say....not.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:16am

  24. Let's not forget that the islamic terrorism we are so adamantly against in the world is RIGHT-WING in nature, a radicalized incarnation of the social conservatism many in the United States adhere to every Sunday in the mega-churches spread out across the country. I have no doubt that these groups would act out violently (abortion clnic bombings, for instance) if their views were marginalized. Fanaticism rears its ugly head when desperation replaces rationality.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:17am

  25. I hope everybody is ready for future Palin campaigns for the Presidency. Even if they lose badly, it's not the last you've seen of her.

    Ignorance combined with arrogance worked the last two times, so there's no real reason why it might not work again this time or in the future.

    Posted by mikecope at 10/06/2008 @ 09:20am

  26. scratch, ponti, scratch..

    http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3081/2914876415_c366c97da5_o.png

    "candidate net favorability ratings"

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 09:21am

  27. ponty...i just think this one will fly with the electorate about as well as mr hughes's greay goose.

    people's priorities are changing and now that their pensions and savings are jeopardized they seem to be focusing on reality and issues and forgetting about smears and talking point "truths".

    again, if every pol were to be disqualified for office as a result of having associated in the course of their career with someone sketchy...

    there would be no politicians...you cant go through a political life WITHOUT such associations. look at mccain!!!!

    silly talking point faux patriotism faux shock bullshit, ponty.

    c'mon, ponty..admit it...

    beginning to regret the selection of mrs. mooseburger yet????

    hmmm????

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:21am

  28. Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:17am | ignore this person | warn this person

    uh huh...

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:23am

  29. Does it work for you? I would say....not.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:16am

    i haven't ask for help.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 09:31am

  30. Cuba 'accepts dialogue' with EU

    The lifting of sanctions against Cuba was seen as a success for Raul Castro Cuba has conditionally accepted the resumption of formal political dialogue with the European Union. The offer was made by the EU in June when sanctions were lifted against the Communist-run island state. The Cuban foreign ministry said it would accept the proposal "once the foundations and bases are established by joint agreement", Reuters reported.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 09:31am

  31. Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 09:31am

    "i haven't ask for help."

    And there's the tragedy.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:38am

  32. Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:17a

    The tragedy of the 20th Century was the rebirth of the religious zealot as the political activist. To call Islamic Fundamentalists 'right wing' is ridiculously Americentric. Besides being not even close, it betrays a highly provincial outlook.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:40am

  33. "Now, as far as the Annenberg Challenge goes, we all know that was a well-funded attempt by an unrepentant terrorist to indoctrinate children in hatred and far-left views."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:09am

    Since you used the term "we all know", and I didn't, I just finished a little fact finding mission about the Annenberg Foundation. I was trying to find the hatred and far-left views. First of all, Ayers didn't start the foundation, Walter Annenberg did - Ayers and Obama were members of the board to apply some of the funding to Chicago schools. I didn't find anything radical or left-wing or terroristic in nature. The foundation is trying to improve the quality of PUBLIC education in urban and rural areas, areas where public education lacks the funding of regions with higher property tax values. As far as I can tell, one would really only have a problem with the foundation if they were pushing full privatization of education.

    It looks like the foundation in Chicago did little to improve the public schools which were to benefit from the funding, but the reasons for this failure were not clear, perhaps I'll have to do a bit more research.

    Anyway, can we move on now? This is such a non-issue.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:49am

  34. Ponti, do you know that Bush has been seen with a known convicted felon? Actually several convicted felons. Do you know that Bush has killed more children than Ayers? (Bush playing God?

    Do you know that he is CLOSE friends with members of the House Saud, a known supporter of Islamic Fascism and Islamic terrorism? Did you know that Prince Bandar is sometimes referred to as Bandar Bush, a reference to their close ties? That Bandar Bush has admitted that his regime is corrupt? That he is from the same country as 15 of the people that brought down the Twin Towers and that each week the Mullahs of this country speak hatred toward you and your country?

    Did you know that many right wingers gather on Sundays, and sometime 2-3 times a week, to indoctrinate their children into a practice that shares the same roots as Islam? Were you aware that Sarah Palin belongs to one of those groups, and that members of her cult speak "in tongues"? Did you know that Palins minister wants God to PUNISH America?

    Did you know that Gov Palins husband wanted to SECEDE from your blessed USA!? I mean, in order to want to do that one must really HATE AMERICA! Why else would he want to SECEDE from the USA?

    do you know what flavor you are being fed this week? Do you dare speak of the wars, the economy, infrastructure repair, healthcare for kids or other issues that matter to your fellow citizens, or would you rather play childish games set up by the kool-aid mixers at the RNC? Or maybe you would like to go back a few years to The Old Play Book where we can talk about candidates FAMILY VALUES. Then we could discuss teen pregnancy in the VP residence, divorce and adultery and the $300,000 worht of baubles that Cindy (I'm not an elitist trophy wife!) McCain wore at the Peoples Inauguration of Pali

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 09:53am

  35. Hysterical:

    http://www.whitehouse.org/ask/bandar.asp

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 09:57am

  36. Posted by Darin_the_Troll at 10/06/2008 @ 09:58am | ignore this person | warn this person

    in all fairness i gotta agree. the diction and grammar and talkingpoint babblespeak are what i can't get over. an occaisional gaffe is one thing, but difficulty saying complete sentences and such just reminds me way too much of W...

    Posted by dexter666 at 10/06/2008 @ 10:01am

  37. The tragedy of the 20th Century was the rebirth of the religious zealot as the political activist."- FLOGIC whipped to a creamy froth.

    Really? At what point do you draw this line?

    The zealots brought us Prohibition, but then they brought us Womens Sufferage.

    They brought the "Negro" the right to eat at your lunch counter and the right to receive an education in White Schools.

    In some cases they cleaned up toxic waste and established safe houses for battered women.

    They also blew up the Olympics in Atlanta, shot doctors, blew up clinics and called for a Jihad against their fellow religious nuts.

    Looks like "your side" has some Ayers on it.

    Just like you have a Frist of Santorum on your lip.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:02am

  38. Posted by Darin_the_Troll at 10/06/2008 @ 09:58am

    I bet Palin learned that from watching FDR on TV in '28!

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:04am

  39. "The tragedy of the 20th Century was the rebirth of the religious zealot as the political activist. To call Islamic Fundamentalists 'right wing' is ridiculously Americentric. Besides being not even close, it betrays a highly provincial outlook."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:40am

    1st, I agree with your first sentence to the letter. Kudos.

    2nd, when placed on the political spectrum of conservatism and liberalism, how can religious fundamentalism, be it islamic fundamentalism, christian fundamentalism, or even zionism be called anything but right-wing? Provincial? Americentric? Hardly.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 10:07am

  40. MASK, until you can learn to intelligently discuss issues, rather than simply wear your cheerleader outfit and wave your pom-poms, you're irrelevant.----Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 09:11am

    It wasn't always such with PONTI--

    "MASK, you have got WAYYY too much common sense to be hanging out with these people..."---Posted by PONTIFICUS 12/05/2007 @ 05:53am

    LOL

    And I don't see you denying those polls, PONTI!?!??!!?

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 10:09am

  41. BTW, since Gov. Palin now reads the NY Times....here's part of John Harwood's column in it--

    "Strategists in both parties see similar effects on Congressional races. Mr. Cook rates just one Democratic Senate seat at risk, compared with 10 for Republicans.

    House Democrats once considered the padding of their 235-seat majority by 10 optimistic. Now House Republicans say they would consider losing only 10 a success.

    Nor do they fear Mr. McCain's defeat. His "maverick" stance has long left Republican regulars ambivalent. As Republicans in Congress learned under Bill Clinton, and Democrats under Mr. Bush, opposing a president of the other party can help legislative minorities refocus message and agenda.

    "They are resigned to a probable Obama victory," observed Jim L. Brulte, a prominent California Republican who once led his party's caucus in both the state Assembly and Senate. Republicans, he added, "understand that that is a necessity in order to set the stage to retake the majority."

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 10:17am

  42. "Speaking of fairness... Hannity's hatchet job on Obama last night was the opposite of fair.

    I think Hannity opened himself up to charges of poisoning the well."-----Posted by Darin_the_Troll at 10/06/2008 @ 10:11am

    And who's out there trying to sound like "Sean in a skirt", Darin?

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 10:19am

  43. HAL, a brief PontiFlogic primer:

    Black is up.

    White is blue.

    A convicted republican does not mean the republican did anything wrong.

    All people that disagree with Chimpy McFlightsuit are kool-aid drinkers, but those that KNOW Saddam had wmd's are critical thinkers.

    Laws are for little people and do not apply to Ponti or those he votes for.

    We have won in Iraq. If it were not for people like the mean Ms. Couric, the troops would have returned home years ago.

    He will come here for a year whining about a democratic witch hunt, but be completely unable to name a single democrat that was involved, while ignoring that the republicans appointed or hired everyone involved in the Plame debacle.

    good luck.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:23am

  44. Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/06/2008

    "The tragedy of the 20th Century was the rebirth of the religious zealot as the political activist. "

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:44am

  45. Face it cons, Tina Fey should send Palin a check weekly. Fey has Palin down!

    Palin is a featherweight in waaaayy over her head. You guys are agog that she could remember her pre-arranged answers to certain questions. She has no deeper understanding of the issues than a junior high civics class.

    what she has is a connection to

    God

    Guns.

    Why am I not seeing any more adds about "experience" on the telly? Why don't the cons talk about Family Values anymore?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:48am

  46. Larry, have you been asked to officiate the union of Bristol and Levi?

    Maybe Jesus can keep them together better than he kept the sperm apart form the egg.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:51am

  47. "from"

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:52am

  48. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:23am

    Thanks for the primer. I'd actually been reading these posts for awhile before I finally felt the urge to call these bastards on their bullshit.

    Strange though, I feel dirty when I argue with them...Always seems like a good venue for debate, but rarely do I see anything here that doesn't turn into more of the same party-line divisions. I imagine that this is what its like to have sex with a prostitute.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 10:56am

  49. Whoops, I see Ponti has been scared off again. Isn't it "funny" how he always disappears when his crap is shown to have a foul odor?

    PONTI, Oct 13 approaches. Do you know what that means? Here is a primer written so that you can follow along:

    http://www.kidzworld.com/article/2614-

    canadian-thanksgiving

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 10:58am

  50. I imagine that this is what its like to have sex with a prostitute. Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 10:56am

    HAL: Just what do you think you're doing, Dave?

    ----- Dave Bowman: Open the pod bay doors, HAL. HAL: I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. Dave Bowman: What's the problem?

    ---

    sorry, could not resist.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 11:12am

  51. Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 09:49am

    Try not to confuse the Annenberg Challenge run by Bill Ayers and Barack Obama with the Annenberg Foundation. The Annenberg Foundation is a respectable, reputable foundation, generally, that does good work. The Annenberg Challenge (probably named in order to foster your sort of confusion) is something far different, and being that it was run by an unrepentant domestic terrorist whose views of the US are well outside the mainstream, its efforts should be closely scrutinized, researched, and exposed. Basically, Ayers' purpose as an 'education reformer' amounted to an attempt to engineer an educational curriculum which de-emphasised basic educational skills in favor of left-wing ideological indoctrination.

    People may agree or disagree with Ayers' goals, but I think what we all can or should agree on is that Palin is bringing up critical issues for debate. What the left needs to decide is whether they want to continue dissembling and obscuring this debate by attempting to discredit Palin for bringing it up.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 11:14am

  52. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 11:14am

    BOO!

    Maybe if you ask Frosty nice, he will send you a Canadian Thanksgiving Horn of Plenty to display next to the NYT article on the nationalization of the banking industry in the USA. (Kind of like Cuba or Venezuela.) You can put it next to your Cub Scout uniform, while you rant about indoctrination.

    hehe ------

    Tune in to Dianne Rehm.... NOW!!

    -------

    TTFN.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 11:25am

  53. Ah the Vino's been in the cellar WAY! too long.

    Posted by CHIP THORNTON at 10/06/2008 @ 11:27am

  54. "Try not to confuse the Annenberg Challenge run by Bill Ayers and Barack Obama with the Annenberg Foundation."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 11:14am

    I'm not confusing the two. The Annenberg Challenge is a part of the Foundation. This challenge is the metric the foundation uses to issue grants to communities in need. What's the problem here?

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 11:39am

  55. I imagine that this is what its like to have sex with a prostitute.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 10:56am

    that's why i wear condoms (non-lubricated) on each of my fingers while i type.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 11:41am

  56. "that's why i wear condoms (non-lubricated) on each of my fingers while i type."

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 11:41am

    I've been wearing ribbed. My computer seems to be more responsive.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 11:46am

  57. Wow. My ignore list is getting so large there are hardly any posters left. Ta Ta Pontificus (latest addition to my ignore list)

    Posted by Stevebremne at 10/06/2008 @ 11:53am

  58. Apparently, Mr. Ayers was part of a group of domestic terrorists who tried, and in some cases succeeded, in killing Americans in the late 60's for political reasons. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 08:03am

    The only Americans that were ever killed by the The Weather Underground were members of The Weather Underground. When Ted Gold, Terry Robbins and Ayers girlfriend Diana Oughton blew themselves up in a Greenwich village townhouse. When Obama was 8 years old.

    As far as Obama's association with Bill Ayer's who is now a distinguished professor at the University of Illinois, they worked together on education reform and were both members of an Anti-Poverty group. Since they live about 3 blocks apart they are neighbors and have had some professional interaction.

    So what? Since what guilt by association could even occur between two people who never even knew each other at the time these events occured. Silly Repubs.

    Posted by chaoszen at 10/06/2008 @ 11:57am

  59. Posted by chaoszen at 10/06/2008 @ 11:57am

    "So what? Since what guilt by association could even occur between two people who never even knew each other at the time these events occured. Silly Repubs."

    I think you're confused. 'Guilt by association' is a legal term. It means you can't be put in jail for association with known terrorists, for example, unless you are part of a conspiracy.

    On the other hand, 'guilt by association' is perfectly acceptable when it comes to assessing a person's judgment and inclinations. If you hang out with drug dealers, it calls your judgment into question. If you attend Ku Klux Klan rallies, your judgment and political inclinations are rightfully called into question. If you consort with unrepentant domestic terrrorists and attend church for 20 years where the pastor urges people to sing 'God Damn America', it rightfully calls your judgment into question.

    Do you see the difference?

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:03pm

  60. scratch, ponti, scratch.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:07pm

  61. What Did Barack Obama Know, and When Did He Know It?

    Sarah Palin's calling out of Barack Obama over the Bill Ayers connection has finally caused some mainstream outlets to report the story (albeit generally in misleading fashion) and has compelled the Obama campaign to respond. That response is surprising, to say the least: Obama now claims that he didn't know about Bill Ayers' terrorist past through all the years when he worked with Ayers in Chicago!

    Ed Morrissey has a report. Here is Obama campaign manager David Axelrod explaining Obama's association with Ayers on CNN:

    JIM ACOSTA: Now a college professor in Chicago, Ayers and Obama served together several years on a nonprofit board. And in 1995 Ayers hosted a coffee for Obama when the young community organizer was making his first run for the State Senate. At this point looking back, should he not have done that?

    DAVID AXELROD: Well I mean, when he went, he certainly -- he didn't know the history.

    ACOSTA: The Democratic nominee's chief strategist David Axelrod maintains Obama at that time had no idea about Ayers' violent past.

    Obama spokesman Robert Gibbs seconded Axelrod, but seemingly without much conviction:

    Look, if that's what David said, that is true.

    This strikes me as a rather stunning development. Obama appears to be admitting that if he knew about Ayers' terrorist history, and the fact that he still takes pride in that history and despises America, it would be an error in judgment to form a close association with him.

    But it is inconceivable that Barack Obama knew Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn well enough to kick off his first political campaign in their living room, but didn't know that Ayers and Dohrn were Communists who led the Weatherman faction of SDS, urged young people to "kil

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:07pm

  62. But it is inconceivable that Barack Obama knew Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn well enough to kick off his first political campaign in their living room, but didn't know that Ayers and Dohrn were Communists who led the Weatherman faction of SDS, urged young people to "kill your parents," carried out approximately 30 bombings, including New York City's police headquarters, the Capitol and the Pentagon, celebrated the Charles Manson murders, spent years living underground to avoid criminal prosecution, and continued to express their lifelong hatred for the United States in books, magazine articles, and public speeches. This is rather like a person claiming that he had worked closely with Arnold Schwarzenegger for years, but had no idea that he was once a bodybuilder and movie actor. Ayers' and Dohrn's radical past is their only claim to fame.

    There must be a great many people who can attest that Obama was well aware of Ayers' and Dohrn's history. It will be interesting to see whether any of them are willing to blow the whistle on Obama's latest evasion.

    PAUL adds: A defense that Obama didn't knew in the 1990s that Ayers was unrepentant would be plausible. However, the campaign must have concluded that this defense isn't good enough.. A defense that Obama didn't know about any of the underlying terrorism is preposterous.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:10pm

  63. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:03pm

    Anybody remember a lot of posts from PONTI calling for Donald Rumsfeld's resignation between 2001-2006?

    I mean DR was SHAKING HANDS and SMILING at Saddam Hussein back in the 80s?!!????

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 12:11pm

  64. Posted by madlib at 10/06/2008 @ 12:03pm

    "No real point in doing anything other than laughing at him as you point to the polls.At least he'll have something to bitch about until 2013."

    Hey, if the American people are willing to elect Obama despite his associations with unrepentant domestic terrorists and his lifelong membership in a church where people are encouraged to sing 'God Damn America', so be it. I just agree with Gov. Palin that people should be allowed to know these things about Barack Obama before the election, and not let it all be covered up by the media and those like yourself who want to wish it away.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:17pm

  65. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 12:11pm

    MASK, please try to stay on topic. This thread is about the left's attempt to discredit Gov. Palin due to her pointing out Obama's association with unrepentant domestic terrorists. It's not about what you imagine to have happened with Donald Rumsfeld.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:23pm

  66. ponti and sarah sitting in a tree,

    s-c-r-a-t-c-h-i-n-g!

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:27pm

  67. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:23pm

    I'm sorry....did I IMAGINE the photo of him shaking hands and smiling at Saddam Hussein?!?!?!??!

    As for Palin, I'm ENCOURAGING her to go out there and sound like the "first hour monologue" of Rush, PONTI.

    It'll play with her base (aka "you") and get you all "fired up"....

    but re-hashing stories from the PRIMARIES, that didn't even help Hillary Clinton....can only be a good thing.

    Plus (and of course, you'd NEVER believe this) it looks to most of the rest of the electorate as ...well...what it is...

    sheer desperation by a campaign that's slipping in the polls, with a McCain who tries stunts (like his "suspended campaign") and a Palin who Tina Fey only has to add a smidge of satire, to make her seem like a cartoon.

    I'm in agreement with you....Attagirl, Sarah....you go girl...keep it up!

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 12:27pm

  68. mooooo!

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:28pm

  69. not you, ML.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:29pm

  70. ZNFX, cyrnfr gel gb fgnl ba gbcvp. Guvf guernq vf nobhg gur yrsg'f nggrzcg gb qvfperqvg Tbi. Cnyva qhr gb ure cbvagvat bhg Bonzn'f nffbpvngvba jvgu haercragnag qbzrfgvp greebevfgf. Vg'f abg nobhg jung lbh vzntvar gb unir unccrarq jvgu Qbanyq Ehzfsryq.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:23pm

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:30pm

  71. "Hey, if the American people are willing to elect Obama despite his associations with unrepentant domestic terrorists and his lifelong membership in a church where people are encouraged to sing 'God Damn America', so be it. I just agree with Gov. Palin that people should be allowed to know these things about Barack Obama before the election, and not let it all be covered up by the media and those like yourself who want to wish it away."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:17pm

    1st. The media is not covering this up, they're all over it and if they're not drooling over it like the folks at FOX, they're trying to discover the truth.

    2nd. Sarah Palin didn't bring up this issue, Hillary Clinton did - months ago. The McCain camp was just waiting for a slump to bring it up again.

    3rd. Stop with the unrepentant line. Ayers said he was proud of what he did - he was referring to his work in the antiwar, pro democracy movements. He has renounced the bombings.

    4th. In regard to our foreign policy regarding the Middle East, yes, "God Damn America".

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 12:31pm

  72. that's your best post ever, ponti!

    you betcha!

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:31pm

  73. HAL9000,

    it's not <i>YOUR</i> foreign policy.

    i take no responsibility for mr. harper's nonsense, for example.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:33pm

  74. THIS is why PONTI and the Gang are panicking....spelled out in blue and red-

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/maps/obama_vs_mccain/?map=10

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 12:35pm

  75. That's what your mother said last night, Trebek!

    Posted by madlib at 10/06/2008 @ 12:31pm

    no comprendero

    the mooo was for planti.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:35pm

  76. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 12:27pm

    "I'm in agreement with you....Attagirl, Sarah....you go girl...keep it up!"

    See? We DO agree on something!

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 12:36pm

  77. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 12:35pm

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_peyir6NMWXE/SOkwZsU-

    FbI/AAAAAAAAAG4/zNbx7vF3LVU/S1600-R/1005_mainchart.png

    this is what nate and sean say.......

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:38pm

  78. I could understand "guilt by association" if Obama was a member of the WU when Ayers was involved with the group. Since Obama was in Hawaii when Ayers was with WU , I don't see the connection. Also, his decision to accept money from a professor of English at the University of Illinois is well within his rights. I have family members who used to do drugs. They don't anymore. Every time I describe them to others I could bring up their past but I don't. That's not who they are anymore. If Ayers was still an activist to the extent he was in the '60's, I could understand the fear. If Obama's tangential connection to Ayers is supposed to scare me, it's not working. I'm more worried about the economic conditions and whether or not I'm gonna have a job in 9 months due to downsizing. The Republicans are gonna have to try harder to scare me. Nice try, though.

    Posted by k330k at 10/06/2008 @ 12:38pm

  79. "HAL9000,

    it's not <i>YOUR</i> foreign policy.

    i take no responsibility for mr. harper's nonsense, for example."

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 12:33pm

    Point taken.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 12:39pm

  80. Relax, folks, it's over The GOP is getting creamed. Palin will be a footnote, alongside Ferraro.

    Now let's talk about how an Obama/Biden govt are going to deal with the highly poisoned chalice they'll be inheriting from Thieves & Liars Inc. At home & abroad.

    Meanwhile, if you're ever wondering whence came the inspiration for the last 8 years of US foreign policy, this has got to be it, DeNiro plays car salesman, the influence on US diplomacy undeniable:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaNYOeeNY7M&feature=related

    Posted by sloper at 10/06/2008 @ 12:43pm

  81. Stop with the unrepentant line. Ayers said he was proud of what he did - he was referring to his work in the antiwar, pro democracy movements. He has renounced the bombings.Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 12:31pm

    That's what happens when people take things out of context. Bill Ayers said he was proud of the work he did in the Anti-War movement. Not in the bombings. He also said he wished he and others had done more for the Anti-War movement. But the wingers always change that into "He said he wished he had done more bombing."

    Like you said, he renounced the bombings.

    Posted by chaoszen at 10/06/2008 @ 12:58pm

  82. Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/06/2008 @ 12:48pm

    Bill Ayers is free to donate to whomever he wishes. Just like you are. And I believe by last count Ayers donated the huge amount of $200.

    So are we to take every contributor to a campaign and give them a through bacground check. So we can turn around and say something like "McCain got 20 contributions from convicted child molesters! That must mean he is a child molester!"

    Posted by chaoszen at 10/06/2008 @ 1:03pm

  83. BTW, here's ANOTHER reason I stick with original policy on Palin...i.e. "Keep Her Talking"---

    Segment---"It also found that Palin's performance in the debate did nothing to clinch undecided votes for her running mate, Arizona Sen. John McCain. Before the debate, those same undecided voters were leaning 56 percent to 44 percent for McCain. The day after the debate, the numbers tilted 52 percent to 48 percent for Illinois Sen. Barack Obama.

    "It's suggesting an overall tendency of undecideds toward Obama, so it is significant," said Clifford Young, a senior vice president at Ipsos Public Affairs. "We're catching an underlying trend that's going on."

    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/53475.html

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 1:11pm

  84. Posted by chaoszen at 10/06/2008 @ 12:58pm

    "Like you said, he renounced the bombings."

    Since you guys are so good at interpreting Bill Ayers, perhaps you can explain what he meant when he said 'Guilty as sin, free as a bird, is this a great country or what?'

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 1:12pm

  85. Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/06/2008 @ 12:48pm

    Yes, have to agree with madlib...

    LOL!

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 1:13pm

  86. Federal Election Commission records show that Assad Kalasho, a businessman from West Bloomfield, Michigan, donated €1,950 to Bush's campaign in July 2003.

    The Detroit Free Press reported yesterday that Kalasho negotiated a €15m deal with the Iraqi government in 2000, when international sanctions prohibited most business dealings with Iraq.

    The Republican National Committee was returning a €24,000 cheque it received from Kalasho in May, spokeswoman Heather Layman said. And Senator Debbie Stabenow, a Michigan Democrat, said she would donate the €978 she received last year from Kalasho to "an appropriate charity".

    Smith said Kalasho understood the decisions and would continue to support the president.

    "We're happy to take the cheque back and take care of everything on the home front," Smith said. "We're not going to allow the campaign to be dragged down into a local issue that has no merit."

    --http://archives.tcm.ie/breakingnews/

    2004/07/17/story157448.asp

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 1:20pm

  87. "perhaps you can explain what he meant when he said 'Guilty as sin, free as a bird, is this a great country or what?'"

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 1:12pm

    Was he talking about Bush? Cheney? Maybe Tom DeLay or Albert Gonzales or Karl Rove?

    Don't know - haven't seen the quote. And I wasn't interpreting Ayers, I was qouting his response to the backlash of his "pride" in his past.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 1:28pm

  88. Washington Post June 23, 2001

    During last year's presidential campaign, Richard B. Cheney acknowledged that the oil-field supply corporation he headed, Halliburton Co., did business with Libya and Iran through foreign subsidiaries. But he insisted that he had imposed a "firm policy" against trading with Iraq.

    "Iraq's different," he said.

    According to oil industry executives and confidential United Nations records, however, Halliburton held stakes in two firms that signed contracts to sell more than $73 million in oil production equipment and spare parts to Iraq while Cheney was chairman and chief executive officer of the Dallas-based company.

    ...The Halliburton subsidiaries joined dozens of American and foreign oil supply companies that helped Iraq increase its crude exports from $4 billion in 1997 to nearly $18 billion in 2000. Since the program began, Iraq has exported oil worth more than $40 billion.

    The proceeds funded a sharp increase in the country's nutritional standards, nearly doubling the food rations distributed to Iraq's poor.

    But U.S. and European officials acknowledged that the expanded production also increased Saddam Hussein's capacity to siphon off money for weapons, luxury goods and palaces. Security Council diplomats estimate that Iraq may be skimming off as much as 10 percent of the proceeds from the oil-for-food program.

    Cheney has offered contradictory accounts of how much he knew about Halliburton's dealings with Iraq. In a July 30, 2000, interview on ABC-TV's "This Week," he denied that Halliburton or its subsidiaries traded with Baghdad.

    "I had a firm policy that we wouldn't do anything in Iraq, even arrangements that were supposedly legal," he said. "We've not done any business in Iraq since U.N. sanctions were imposed on Iraq in 1990

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 1:44pm

  89. [Was he talking about Bush? Cheney? Maybe Tom DeLay or Albert Gonzales or Karl Rove?]-HAL

    Terrorist fist bump, HAL!

    Boy! Did you guys see the terrorist fist bump spectacular on display at the Rider Cup? Those "golfers" should be on their way to GITMO.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 1:50pm

  90. Ponti, what about Palins husband wanting to take YOUR oil and secede from the USA?

    I want to see the difference.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 1:53pm

  91. "Terrorist fist bump, HAL!"

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 1:50pm

    Right back at ya, my brother from another mother!

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 2:04pm

  92. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 1:53pm

    "Ponti, what about Palins husband wanting to take YOUR oil and secede from the USA?I want to see the difference."

    Well, let me be the first to say, that I don't endorse Gov. Palin's husband for any elected office.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:06pm

  93. "Try not to confuse the Annenberg Challenge run by Bill Ayers and Barack Obama with the Annenberg Foundation."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 11:14am

    The Chicago Annenberg Challenge CAC was a $49.2 million grant by the Annenberg Foundation to to be matched by public and private funds. The purpose was to improve inner-city education. in Chicago.

    See

    http://www.brown.edu/Administration/News_Bureau/1987-95/94-084.html

    Annenberg was a wealthy publisher (Philadelphia Inquirer, TV Guide, Seventeen, etc.) who was Nixon's Ambassador to Britain and received the Presidential Freedom Medal from Reagan. Hardly a sponsor of terrorists.

    By the time of the CAC and Obama's association with Ayers, Ayers was already 30 years post-Weather Underground and a professor of education at the University of Illinois at Chicago. McCain's unoriginal and foolish attempt at guilt by association would be answered by two words: Keating Five. If we want to drag up thirty-year-old sins, we should note that we have already forgiven W's youthful cocaine addiction, draft dodging, desertion from the military and drunkenness. Time to forgive Ayers, I think.

    Posted by jread_21205 at 10/06/2008 @ 2:08pm

  94. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:06pm

    Who here endorses Ayers for any office? YOU and Mrs. MaveriK are the ones writing and talking about "associations", Ponti.

    ---

    HAL, here you will see one of PontiFlogics favorite ploys, moving the goal posts he set up out into the parking lot. Next up, after he has written up Rush's talking points, he will accuse us of drinking Kool-aid. Then will come a reference to Cuba, slaves and Bill Clinton.

    Wait for it.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:14pm

  95. "perhaps you can explain what he meant when he said 'Guilty as sin, free as a bird, is this a great country or what?'"-----Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 1:12pm

    Quoting Scooter Libby, Cheney's #2?

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 2:16pm

  96. Posted by jread_21205 at 10/06/2008 @ 2:08pm

    "By the time of the CAC and Obama's association with Ayers, Ayers was already 30 years post-Weather Underground and a professor of education at the University of Illinois at Chicago."

    All of which is moot, of course, since Bill Ayers is unrepentant to this day regarding his activities as a domestic terrorist, and although he no longer aspires to kill people as part of his political interests, he does aspire to indoctrinate schoolchildren into far left victimology.

    "McCain's unoriginal and foolish attempt at guilt by association would be answered by two words: Keating Five. "

    This is a foolish argument. If McCain was found to have secretly attend Ku Klux Klan rallies, it would still have no bearing on Obama's judgement and character.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:17pm

  97. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 2:16pm

    "Quoting Scooter Libby, Cheney's #2?"

    Cute, and as usual, wholly imaginary, but I've come to expect no more from you.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:19pm

  98. indoctrination?

    I, (say your name), promise to DO MY BEST To do my DUTY to GOD And my Country To HELP other people, and To OBEY the LAW of the Pack

    Law of the Pack

    The Cub Scout follows Akela. The Cub Scout helps the pack go. The pack helps the Cub Scout grow. The Cub Scout gives goodwill.

    ---

    So the cub scouts follow the wolf from Kiplings Mowgli stories? Does that take preference over Duty to (insert one of 200 versions of christian Gods).

    Phfew! Good thing no right wingers would EVER indoctrinate their kids! Never!

    "Bless this our daily bread...."

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:20pm

  99. Maybe that should read :

    "... follow the LAW of the FLOCK."

    Bahhh..... bahhh... bahhh.

    BOO!

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:22pm

  100. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:19pm

    I asked a question, PONTI.

    Here's another...why WOULDN'T that phrase apply to Scooter Libby?!??!!???

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 2:23pm

  101. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:20pm

    You see, crabbie, this is the crux of your problem. You really can't tell the difference between, say, a Cub Scout creed which tells people to, say, do a daily good deed, and on the other hand, a far left screed that tells people they if they fail in life, it's the fault of big evil corporations. You are so far gone, my friend, it's sad.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:26pm

  102. Well, about time for a spanking and a nap.

    Maybe PontiFLogic could change tunes just slightly. Let's talk about another of Palins talking points; corruption and greed in Washington DC. Tell us Pontiflogic, who in the world would she be talking about? Bush has run the place since 2000, repubs had power in congress for most of the last 10 years. Are those folks just incapable of overpowering the lazy leftists in congress? Is it that they were too weak to stand up to the hundreds of communists in the USA?

    Or is it that they actually perfected the greed and corruption that Palin/McCain are running against?

    do enlighten us Ponti. We want to see the difference.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:27pm

  103. "McCain's unoriginal and foolish attempt at guilt by association would be answered by two words: Keating Five. "

    This is a foolish argument. If McCain was found to have secretly attend Ku Klux Klan rallies, it would still have no bearing on Obama's judgement and character.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:17pm |

    Huh? I was talking about McCain's judgement and character, and comparing his lapse with Obama's non-lapse in the case of his association with Ayers during the time of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge.

    What are you smoking?

    Posted by jread_21205 at 10/06/2008 @ 2:27pm

  104. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 2:23pm

    "Here's another...why WOULDN'T that phrase apply to Scooter Libby?!??!!???"

    Because Ayers proudly pronounced his guilt, while Libby did not?

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:29pm

  105. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:26pm

    that's what I was waiting for!!

    See, if Ponti thinks it's good, then it is not "indoctrination". Or, if it is, then it is GOOD indoctrination.

    whereas the rest of us in America do NOT have the right to teach kids anything other than "Follow the wolf from Mowgli stories." and "God hates fags!".

    Or maybe Ponti is comfortable with a marble monument inscribed with the Ten Suggestions being mounted in City Hall of Wasilla, while Sarah "I'm protected from demoNcratic witch hunts" Palin tells lies and brings false witness about her fellow christians.

    See the difference?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:33pm

  106. "Just the bear stearns necessities...

    Simple bear stearns necessities."- Mowgli wisdom.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:38pm

  107. Ponti, come on... admit it...

    you covet Palins ass.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:40pm

  108. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:33pm

    "See the difference?"

    Again, CRABBIE, you show your moral bankruptcy. You see no difference between teaching kids basic morality and teaching them that they should consider themselves victims of society, with a right to a permanent grievance and a presumption of entitlement. That's your problem in a nutshell.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:42pm

  109. DOW drops below 10,000...

    Stock markets around the world drop

    banks are going belly up

    employers begin laying off in huge numbers due to the economic policies of the free marketeers.

    Ponti wants to talk about the 1960's.

    Why would he want to do that?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:42pm

  110. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:33pm

    You should spend some time listening to one of the products of your educational system, chaoszen, who claims that he considers free health care to be a basic right of his under his interpretation of the Constitution. He's a perfect example of the type of product yours and Bill Ayers' educational system produces. A sense of entitlement, i.e., a presumption that the world owes you something simply because you exist. And you see nothing wrong with that. That's exactly where you're so messed up, my friend.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:46pm

  111. Maybe we will get to see the Palin family morals on display that Bristols and Levis wedding nuptials.

    We have seen McCain family values on display on his second wifes non-eliteist couturier. Especially when she goes around saying she is an only child.

    Do you follow Akela Ponti?

    woof woof.

    (butt sniff) Fred! didn't recognize you with the new haircut! Smelling good, bud!

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:46pm

  112. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:42pm

    "Why would he want to do that?"

    A better question would be, why are you lefties always so happy when things go bad for America?

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:47pm

  113. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:46pm

    got your checkbook out Guantonamouse?

    Seems the "free marketeers" think they are "entitled" to $700,000,000,000.

    And the Iraqis are "entitled" to more of your tax dollars.

    But of course you don't want to pay for any of this, you will pass it on to the next generation.

    Careful Ponti! Some wayward leftist might wish you "Peace on Earth" or offer to have "God Bless you". Then you will have to sit the poor wretch down and explain indoctrination to him.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:51pm

  114. A better question would be, why are you lefties always so happy when things go bad for America? Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:47pm

    why do you insist that 2+2= basket weaving of the early 14th century?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:53pm

  115. I'm a conspiricy theorist. I think that Cindy McCain slipped to much Viagra into old John's coffee and it back fired. What if these two characters should win and end up with their finger on the nuclear, "nucelar" trigger? Dear god I hope she learns to pronounce the word.

    Posted by lachatte at 10/06/2008 @ 3:26pm

  116. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:29pm

    Was Libby guilty?

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 3:27pm

  117. "A better question would be, why are you lefties always so happy when things go bad for America?"

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 2:47pm

    I wouldn't say I'm happy about things going bad in America, but there is a certain Schadenfreud in watching your party crash and burn after all the bullshit we "lefties" predicted would happen with your policies actually happens. Admit it, the only tool left at your disposal is propaganda. You have no footing on economy, morality, social justice or foreign policy. Give it up. The party is over.

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 3:50pm

  118. Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @

    Posted by HAL9000 at 10/06/2008 @ 2:04pm

    uh, that's fellow goose from a different (michi)gander!

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 3:55pm

  119. god bless you pontificus.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 4:01pm

  120. But of course you don't want to pay for any of this, you will pass it on to the next generation.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 2:51pm

    "No generation has a right to contract debts greater than can be paid off during the course of its own existence"

    tommy j.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/06/2008 @ 4:04pm

  121. "Well, I was reading my copy of today's New York Times and I was interested to read about Barack's friends from Chicago," Ms. Palin said at the fund-raiser in Englewood, Colo. "Turns out one of Barack's earliest supporters is a man who, according to The New York Times, and they are hardly ever wrong, was a domestic terrorist and part of a group that, quote, launched a campaign of bombings that would target the Pentagon and U.S. Capitol."

    Wow.

    1) She said this on the 4th. I didn't see ANY articles in the Times about Ayers on the 4th, although there was one on the 3rd. But she specifically stated "today's." Maybe I need reading glasses.

    2) So the NYT is "hardly ever wrong." I guess the article last Feb about McCain's extra-marital activities was most likely correct, huh?

    Posted by FLaim at 10/06/2008 @ 4:19pm

  122. Ponti pontificated: "Now, as far as the Annenberg Challenge goes, we all know that was a well-funded attempt by an unrepentant terrorist to indoctrinate children in hatred and far-left views. Barack worked extensively with Ayers on the Annenberg Challenge, it's a part of the public record. You folks need to make up your mind whether you're defending that or minimizing it."

    Oh my. I bet PBS is in on this too, huh Ponti? But let's look at Fox News, the John Birch Society, the KKK, the Alaska Independence Party - these folks really are indoctrinating children in hatred but you probably agree with them since these groups espouse far-right views. Anyway, trying to have a rational and reasoned discussion with Ponti is a bit like trying to talk politico-geo philosophy with Palin. Small words, short sentences, long on winks and smirks - ya betcha!

    Posted by Greytdog at 10/06/2008 @ 4:21pm

  123. Barack Obama was not eight, but a 24-year-old community organizer in Chicago at the time of the Weathermen's last attacks, and 29 when many of the last remnants of the Underground in the offshoot May 19th Communist Organization were sentenced to prison in 1990. (Former Weatherman Elizabeth Ann Duke is still a fugitive and wanted by the FBI.)

    BarackObama.com, the campaign's official website, offers up a "fact check" that Obama was just eight years old when the Weathermen were active in 1969. The Obama campaign has tried to use the founding date of the Weathermen as a touchstone, claiming that the acts of the group were something that happened "40 years ago" when Obama was a child. Far closer to the truth is the December 6, 1990, sentencing date of Weathermen Susan Rosenberg and Linda Sue Evans, when the last of the Weathermen were sentenced for their role in a string of bombings in the mid-1980s, including bombs that detonated at the National War College, the Washington Navy Yard Computing Center, the Washington Navy Yard Officers' Club, New York City's Patrolmen's Benevolent Association, the Israeli Aircraft Industries Building, New York City's South African Consulate, and the United States Capitol Building.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:33pm

  124. Barack Obama's ties to the Weathermen aren't ties that were 40 years removed from a child's experiences, but the conscious decision of a young radical to establish a relationship to an infamous terrorist because of shared ideology and interests.

    Barack Obama never set any bombs. But he's never had problems with associating with those who did.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:36pm

  125. Here's one of the reasons Palin's now a "pitbull" and less a "hockey mom"...and why PONTI is hysterical on his Limbaugh/Hannity talking point--

    Obama Leads McCain in New Va. Poll

    A new poll by Suffolk University shows Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) with a double-digit lead over GOP nominee John McCain in Virginia.

    Obama draws 51 percent to McCain's 39 percent, although the poll's sample skews heavily toward the Democrats, which may be inflating Obama's margin.

    "Barack Obama has built a coalition of suburban DC area progressives from the north, African-American voters from the south, and young voters statewide," said David Paleologos, director of the Political Research Center at Suffolk University in Boston. "That broad-based support suggests a 44-year Republican run in the Old Dominion State, dating back to Lyndon Johnson's victory in 1964, is in jeopardy."

    The poll conflicts with one last week by Mason Dixon that showed McCain leading Obama by 3 points in Virginia.

    The Suffolk poll also shows Democratic Senate candidate Mark R. Warner beating GOP candidate James S. Gilmore by 33 points, similar to the advantage Warner held in the Mason-Dixon poll.

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 4:38pm

  126. Barack Obama never set any bombs. But he's never had problems with associating with those who did.----Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:36pm

    Donald Rumsfeld never oppressed the Iraqi people...

    but in the 1980s, he never had problems associating with the guy who did!

    LOL

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 4:40pm

  127. Barack Obama's association with domestic terrorists is well-documented. As I said, Obama supporters need to decide whether they are going to minimize those associations or defend them, because Sarah Palin is going to ensure that we have this debate, and God Bless her for it.

    As far as the economy goes, it is certainly going through tough times. It's interesting to note, however, that the European economies are having an even tougher time than we are, so how all of this gets tied to Republican policies is a tough case to make. It would be easier to tie this meltdown to policies of people like Barney Frank, who insisted on pushing credit on non-creditworthy people as a means of using the government for social engineering. And yes, McCain was in on this, but Obama was in on it far worse (check out relative contributions from FNMA and Freddie Mac). Voting for Obama in the hope that he knows how to improve things is like grabbing for an anchor rather than a life preserver when the ship is going down.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:41pm

  128. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 4:40pm

    Dow down another 450 today. Looks like it's pricing in an Obama victory.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:49pm

  129. Sarah Palin never seceded from Pontis beloved USA, but she never had problems associating with those that wanted to.

    "Dow plunges as much as 800 points in new record for one-day point drop."

    "Congress hears Lehman steered millions to executives"

    "Registration gains favor democrats"

    "After change in Tax Law, Wachovia swoops in"

    "Doubts linger about Palin"

    "Interior Dept Sex Scandal"

    These are the headlines in the real world.

    Ponti wants to talk about the 1960's and Rev Wright.

    Is it because the left controls the media giants NBC and VIACOM?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 4:50pm

  130. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:41pm

    Here ya go sheep...

    http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/

    contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=n00006424

    VS

    http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/

    contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00009638

    That is how a system with 100% more political parties than Cuba works.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 4:55pm

  131. Dick Cheney never held Americans hostage for 300 + days...

    But he had no problem associating with those that did.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 4:59pm

  132. Dow down another 450 today. Looks like it's pricing in an Obama victory. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:49pm

    but Ponti, Palin/McCain were up in the polls just last week! Surely their victory is just around the corner.

    Maybe what they need is for a bunch of sheep to attack John Kerrys medals given to him by the Dept of Navy?

    OOP,s wrong distraction at the wrong time.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/06/2008 @ 5:03pm

  133. Posted by pontificus at 10/06/2008 @ 4:49pm

    See? I KNEW it wasn't Bush's fault for his brilliant bail-out plan....

    that dang Market just won't listen since they (like you, PONTI) have now given up on Maverick and Glacier Gidget!

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 8:23pm

  134. Stirring up dumbed down paranoid inbreeding, Glacier Gidget appears to be vying for the 2030 election.

    Posted by winyahn at 10/06/2008 @ 9:21pm

  135. "Barack Obama's association with domestic terrorists is well-documented. As I said, Obama supporters need to decide whether they are going to minimize those associations or defend them, because Sarah Palin is going to ensure that we have this debate, and God Bless her for it."

    You are a very well paid Republican agent with the mission of introducing this garbage into a liberal blog. We reject your agenda of not discussing the real problems of the country but smearing a person just because he was a community organizer that met several people in the left. By the way, we need to interact sort of intellectually with people like you but that does not necessarily make us mentally deficient.

    Posted by Frank42 at 10/07/2008 @ 01:45am

  136. Here's one of the reasons Palin's now a "pitbull" and less a "hockey mom"

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/06/2008 @ 4:38pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    .

    Pitbull? I don't think so.

    More like the 'Wasilla chihuahua'. Basically, just annoying yap...and no real bite.

    Posted by Lillian at 10/07/2008 @ 02:03am

  137. Posted by Frank42 at 10/07/2008 @ 01:45am

    "You are a very well paid Republican agent with the mission of introducing this garbage into a liberal blog. We reject your agenda of not discussing the real problems of the country but smearing a person just because he was a community organizer that met several people in the left."

    Thank you for the latest demonstration of cultist groupthink, FRANK. Let's see, you're incapable of actually discussing issues because, since I disagree with you and your cult so strongly, I must be a 'well-paid Republican operative'. Nice!

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 07:16am

  138. Ponti, "group think"? Is that anything like the collectivist Cub Scouts following The Pack?

    Or would it be more like a bunch of anti-freedom parents standing on a corner with their kids holding "God hates Fags" signs?

    neither of which is indoctrination, BTW.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:26am

  139. "Soon after the book controversy, Bess found himself again at odds with Palin and her fellow evangelicals. In 1996, evangelical churches mounted a vigorous campaign to take over the local hospital's community board and ban abortion from the valley. When they succeeded, Bess and Dr. Susan, a Palmer OB-GYN, fought back, filing suit on behalf of a local woman who had been forced to travel to Seattle for an abortion. The case was finally decided by the Alaska Supreme Court, which ruled that the hospital must provide valley women with the abortion option. At one point during the hospital battle, passions ran so hot that local antiabortion activists organized a boisterous picket line outside Dr. Lemagie's office, in an unassuming professional building across from Palmer's Little League field. According to Bess and another community activist, among the protesters trying to disrupt the physician's practice that day was Sarah Palin. Another valley activist, Philip Munger, says that Palin also helped push the evangelical drive to take over the Mat-Su Borough school board. "She wanted to get people who believed in creationism on the board," said Munger, a music composer and teacher. "I bumped into her once after my band played at a graduation ceremony at the Assembly of God. I said, 'Sarah, how can you believe in creationism -- your father's a science teacher.' And she said, 'We don't have to agree on everything.' "I pushed her on the earth's creation, whether it was really less than 7,000 years old and whether dinosaurs and humans walked the earth at the same time. And she said yes, she'd seen images somewhere of dinosaur fossils with human footprints in them." Munger also asked Palin if she truly believed in the End of Days, the doomsday scenario when the Messiah will return. "S

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:30am

  140. Ponti, do you think that parents have the right to refuse medical treatment for their children if the parents think God will cure the kids of a terminal illness?

    would that be group think or collectivist thought in your world?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:36am

  141. Ponti, which has more of an impact on your ability to judge a candidates judgement:

    A man that does good deeds with another guy that did bad things 30 years ago

    or

    A women that thinks the Earth is 7,000 years old and dinos and men walked the Earth at the same time?

    Or does the fact that I ask this question point to my moral bankruptcy?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:40am

  142. "She looked in my eyes and said, 'Yes, I think I will see Jesus come back to earth in my lifetime.'"

    Jeezus gonna be here

    gonna be here soon

    Well I've been faithful

    And I've been so good

    Except for drinking

    But he new that I would

    I'm gonna leave this place better

    Than the way I found it - Saint Tom Waits

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:47am

  143. Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:30am

    What's interesting is in both her zeal to win (and the zeal of her friends in the Religious Right), she is now DENYING her previous beliefs in creationism so as to not appear as an extremist.

    Apparently, her "faith" is convenient to turn off and on, depending on political fortunes and circumstances....and nobody among her fellows seems to care, as long as she wins.

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 09:05am

  144. Pontificus...

    There is just so much to comment on regarding the ignorant posts you spew- but I will only touch on a few:

    In your rationalization of "guilt by association" it could then be said that...we should question McCain's judgment for those he involved himself with durring Keating 5- much closer ties than that of Ayers and Obama... hell their families vacationed together in the Bahamas. Or Palin should be questioned on her judgement for her husbands association with a secessionist party- whoms leader has all but damned the US and all it stands for- oh that sounds like Country first to me...he only left that part in 02- whats that 6 years ago- conveniently when his wife began her run at politics.

    Furthermore- in regards to Ayers- EVERYONE except for Sean Hannity and McCain/Palin have conceded that Ayers and Obama's connections were no more than work related in the sense that they served on the same charitable boards together- he was not "recruited" by Ayers as claimed and did not launch his political career in his living room as claimed. See in truth it has nothing to do with Ayers- because John McCain has palled around with those tied to extreme right wing groups that are known for their anti-semite beliefs...so it is the opportunity they took to use Obama's name and the word "terrorist" in the same sentence- b/c they know dam well Joe six pack does not know the difference between the attackers from 9/11 and a anti war revolutionist group durring the 60's within our own country.

    McCain follows suit with BUSH- Weapons of Mass Distraction--- and you my friend are simply a ploy in their game.

    Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 09:12am

  145. Furthermore rather than rallying the scare tactics... why can't someone debunk Obama's economic policy plans- OR just throw out some McCain policy plans... OHHH thats right because he has none! I liked this one his campaign mentioned yesterday...cutting Medicare and Medicaid by 1 Trillion dollars- oh now thats a good one... yes lets not only make current health care benefits worse but lets take it away from the elderly and less fortunate... GREAT idea! Wonder why he isnt bragging about that wopper of an idea in Florida- or New Mexico?? See this is what makes me laugh is Repugs can throw mudd like its nobodies business but when it comes to actual facts- actual PLANS...actual ACTION... you got nothing, nada, zip, zilch!! It is clear as Obama's poll numbers rise- and McCain scrambles to throw anything on the wall to see what sticks... they have nothing! They can only insite fear- but America saw this game before in 00 and 04- he is preaching to his base but disgusting Independents and Dems... without them he cant win... case closed!

    Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 09:19am

  146. Pontificus...

    There is just so much to comment on regarding the ignorant posts you spew-

    Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 09:12am

    naw..........

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 09:46am

  147. "She looked in my eyes and said, 'Yes, I think I will see Jesus come back to earth in my lifetime.'"

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 08:47am

    ESTRAGON: If we parted? That might be better for us.

    VLADIMIR: We'll hang ourselves tomorrow. (Pause.) Unless Godot comes.

    ESTRAGON: And if he comes?

    VLADIMIR: We'll be saved. [Vladimir takes off his hat (Lucky's), peers inside it, feels about inside it, shakes it, knocks on the crown, puts it on again.]

    ESTRAGON: Well? Shall we go?

    VLADIMIR: Pull on your trousers.

    ESTRAGON: What?

    VLADIMIR: Pull on your trousers.

    ESTRAGON: You want me to pull off my trousers?

    VLADIMIR: Pull ON your trousers.

    ESTRAGON: (realizing his trousers are down). True. He pulls up his trousers.

    VLADIMIR: Well? Shall we go?

    ESTRAGON: Yes, let's go.

    [They do not move.]

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 09:50am

  148. HEY CRAB,

    "- but the fact is, if we went in on the ground into Baghdad that's the only way I know of that the Arab world could turn Saddam Hussein from the bum that he is into the hero that Nasser was, number one.

    Number two is I don't think you could do it with air power. Unbeknownst to a lot of people, we tried bombing- We weren't trying to kill him, but we were just trying to bomb every place we thought he might be or could possibly be.

    Third of all, I'm not sure that if we did go in on the ground we could tell a Shiite from a Sunni, even from a Kurd. And who is it that we'd be fighting and battling against on the streets of Baghdad? And, if we got into Baghdad, we would lose all of our military supremacy and we would take casualties. . ."

    guess who...........

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 09:52am

  149. Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 09:52am

    hmmm...

    Not Snoopy...

    Probably not Opus....

    think think think think

    nope, not Pooh Bear...

    Lets see, it has to be someone with experience and good judgement...

    Maybe winston Churchill.... nah, not eloquent enough..

    Cheney in 1992?... no... that does not "feel" right...

    How about.... The Original Maverik?

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 10:16am

  150. maver-icky right!

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 11:01am

  151. Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 09:12am

    Dana, I have addressed all of your points in previous posts. Read through them and get back to me if you really want to discuss issues rather than regurgitate factually incorrect talking points as so many other here do.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:02am

  152. Oh, and this is timely:

    FDR's Policies Prolonged Depression by 7 Years, UCLA Economists Calculate By Meg Sullivan | 8/10/2004 12:23:12 PM

    Two UCLA economists say they have figured out why the Great Depression dragged on for almost 15 years, and they blame a suspect previously thought to be beyond reproach: President Franklin D. Roosevelt.

    After scrutinizing Roosevelt's record for four years, Harold L. Cole and Lee E. Ohanian conclude in a new study that New Deal policies signed into law 71 years ago thwarted economic recovery for seven long years.

    "Why the Great Depression lasted so long has always been a great mystery, and because we never really knew the reason, we have always worried whether we would have another 10- to 15-year economic slump," said Ohanian, vice chair of UCLA's Department of Economics. "We found that a relapse isn't likely unless lawmakers gum up a recovery with ill-conceived stimulus policies."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:03am

  153. Gee, Obama's plan sounds pretty much like FDR's plan:

    "In an article in the August issue of the Journal of Political Economy, Ohanian and Cole blame specific anti-competition and pro-labor measures that Roosevelt promoted and signed into law June 16, 1933.

    "President Roosevelt believed that excessive competition was responsible for the Depression by reducing prices and wages, and by extension reducing employment and demand for goods and services," said Cole, also a UCLA professor of economics. "So he came up with a recovery package that would be unimaginable today, allowing businesses in every industry to collude without the threat of antitrust prosecution and workers to demand salaries about 25 percent above where they ought to have been, given market forces. The economy was poised for a beautiful recovery, but that recovery was stalled by these misguided policies.""

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:04am

  154. The mainstream media are of course collaborating with Barack Obama in his efforts to downplay his relationship with Bill Ayers, to cooperate with Obama in his efforts to dissociate himself from Ayers and to portray Ayers as a former radical turned respectable. Thus Tom Brokaw referred to Ayers this past Sunday on Meet the Press as an educational reformer.

    Sol Stern will have none of it. In "The bomber as school reformer," Stern writes:

    Calling Bill Ayers a school reformer is a bit like calling Joseph Stalin an agricultural reformer. (If you find the metaphor strained, consider that Walter Duranty, the infamous New York Times reporter covering the Soviet Union in the 1930s, did, in fact, depict Stalin as a great land reformer who created happy, productive collective farms.) For instance, at a November 2006 education forum in Caracas, Venezuela, with President Hugo Chávez at his side, Ayers proclaimed his support for "the profound educational reforms under way here in Venezuela under the leadership of President Chávez. We share the belief that education is the motor-force of revolution. . . . I look forward to seeing how you continue to overcome the failings of capitalist education as you seek to create something truly new and deeply humane." Ayers concluded his speech by declaring that "Venezuela is poised to offer the world a new model of education--a humanizing and revolutionary model whose twin missions are enlightenment and liberation," and then, as in days of old, raised his fist and chanted: "Viva Presidente Chávez! Viva la Revolucion Bolivariana! Hasta la Victoria Siempre!"

    Stern reminds us that Ayers was a revolutionary driven by hatred of the United States when he was planting bombs in the 1970's and he is a revolutionary driven by hatred of the United St

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:09am

  155. PontiFlogic, you addressed nothing. You never do.

    Well, anywhooo...

    Enjoy Canadian Thanksgiving, even though in your mind it does not exist.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:10am

  156. Oh, cheer up, PONTI...

    McCain can still win the debate tonight and re-tighten the race.

    His real problem, since you brough up economics, is a CBS poll showing that only 15%!!!!!! have confidence in McCain on economic issues....and the economy is the #1 issue!

    BTW 44% (nearly half) have NO confidence in Maverick John.

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 11:10am

  157. United States now. The intervening years include the period of his alliance with his young Chicago friend Barack Obama. Stern drily observes: "For the first time in his life, Ayers seems to be observing Democratic Party discipline and won't be talking until after November 4."

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:12am

  158. Now Ponti is using some "over-educated elites" to make some sort of case. Gee, Ponti, I thought over-educated elites were to be derided in public, not used as foils for your ideology?

    Gotta love the contortions this guy will use to attempt to arrive at some sort of point!

    Which direction is brown today, Ponti? And could you give us a clue into where you will be placing the goal posts today, will they be in the stadium or down the street or maybe over in the Springfield Tire Fire?

    ---Off to do some indoctrination of todays youth....

    BOO!

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:15am

  159. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 11:10am

    Actually, MASK, I am pretty cheery this morning. McCain/Palin are finally figuring out that the only way to get past the media hacks that are covering for Obama is to go straight to the people with the truth. Seems to be working, Zogby only has B. Hussein up by 3 today.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:16am

  160. Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:15am

    Hey, CRABBIE, isn't it cool how 'education reformer' Bill Ayers, B. Hussein's buddy, is palling aroudn with Hugo Chavez, getting a hard-on about left-wing indoctrination of children? Gee, and we thought he was just an education reformer. And what about Ayers' wife, Bernardine Dohrn, know anything about her?

    Which is it today, CRABBIE? Minimize, or defend Obama's relationship with Ayers? Do tell! And no peeking at the New York Times for answers!

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:19am

  161. MAO mao

    ma ma mao

    ma ma mao, mama ma ma MAO

    well, the bird... bird.... bird is the word

    ---

    Hidden leftist propaganda?

    must be, there is no other explanation.

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:22am

  162. Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:22am

    You know, CRABBIE, incoherent babbling is quite an improvement for you.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:26am

  163. But Ponti, I am not endorsing Ayers for president.....

    god you are a hoot!!

    Here try some of this off brand mixed drink...

    Obama lusts after white women!! Cuz he is The One, The Muslim, The 'Merica Hater, The Celebrity, The Terrorist fist bumper, the White Women luster-er-er

    ciao!

    Peace on Earth

    Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:26am

  164. Posted by crabwalk at 10/07/2008 @ 11:26am

    "Obama lusts after white women!! Cuz he is The One, The Muslim, The 'Merica Hater, The Celebrity, The Terrorist fist bumper, the White Women luster-er-er"

    What are you, some kind of racist CRABBIE? I'm shocked.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:32am

  165. Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:16am

    Actually, I'm pretty cheery about it too...and from your same source.

    I heart Fritz Wenzel from Zogby on XM's POTUS '08 this monringand he pointed out that their data shows that (A) independent women will be the deciding factor in the election and (B) that IWs HATE mud-slinging and negative campaigning, otherwise known as "the new McCain strategy".

    See, this stuff works with the base (aka YOU) and McCain is still trying to shore it up (slipping in Virginia and North Carolina is a BAD sign for that).

    Later, they may try a more moderate tack, IF they can close the gap in the non-battlegrounds.

    Plus, the STRATEGIC problem is...McCain and his gal-pal unloaded BEFORE the debate tonight....thus telegraphing their punch and allowing Obama time to work up a good counter-response. They lost the element of surprise, which a reading of Sun Tzu will tell you is VITAL.

    So again, Maverick and Glacier Gidget?....go for it!

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 11:54am

  166. Well, I guess this shoots the hell out of the 'Bill Ayers? Why he's just a po' little old education reformer!' trope. What's next?

    "Calling Bill Ayers a school reformer is a bit like calling Joseph Stalin an agricultural reformer. (If you find the metaphor strained, consider that Walter Duranty, the infamous New York Times reporter covering the Soviet Union in the 1930s, did, in fact, depict Stalin as a great land reformer who created happy, productive collective farms.) For instance, at a November 2006 education forum in Caracas, Venezuela, with President Hugo Chávez at his side, Ayers proclaimed his support for "the profound educational reforms under way here in Venezuela under the leadership of President Chávez. We share the belief that education is the motor-force of revolution. . . . I look forward to seeing how you continue to overcome the failings of capitalist education as you seek to create something truly new and deeply humane." Ayers concluded his speech by declaring that "Venezuela is poised to offer the world a new model of education--a humanizing and revolutionary model whose twin missions are enlightenment and liberation," and then, as in days of old, raised his fist and chanted: "Viva Presidente Chávez! Viva la Revolucion Bolivariana! Hasta la Victoria Siempre!""

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 12:05pm

  167. Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 11:54am

    You know, MASK, it's cool that you take comfort in the polls, but the difference between me and you is, I don't like terrorists like Bill Ayers, and dictators like Hugo Chavez, or nutjobs like Reverend Wright, or the people that hang around with them. Regardless of who wins in November, you will still be a loser because these people are your compatriots. Good luck with them.

    Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 12:09pm

  168. "You know, MASK, it's cool that you take comfort in the polls...."---Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 12:09pm

    I'm sorry...short-term memory problems, PONTI????

    "Seems to be working, Zogby only has B. Hussein up by 3 today."----Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:16am

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 1:06pm

  169. LONG-term memory problems, too, I guess...

    " Obama's lead is melting....melting....melting.....

    and the media can't help him. The more people learn about Obama, the more it becomes obvious that the guy is not only an empty suit, but a huge fraud. He's the latest in a long line of left-wing losers. He's going to lose in a landslide."-----Posted by pontificus at 08/18/2008 @ 10:38pm

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 1:08pm

  170. no gloating, please.......

    karma's monkey wrench.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 2:16pm

  171. just glancing over these idiotic posts, it seems palin/mccain now try to link annenberg foundation with ayers whom obama knew when he was five??? isn't this the same foundation who donates all the money for public broadcasting such as NRP and where most americans now get objective news due to biased MSM???

    so would mccain and palin now just cut all funding to public news...right before making all broadcasts digital adversely affecting rural communities which depend on free news from antennas and cannot afford cable or subscriber television..

    this will produce an even greater exodus of small towns, similar to what is now going on in palin's home state of alaska, where small towns are literally disappearing and schools are too small to stay open, infrastructure unsustainable...etc...

    because of global warming and its' effects, LA and NY are buying up ever larger water rights, land, and building ever-larger reservoirs to protect drinking supply...even while Palin doesn't believe in it.....this is a major disconnect....

    if mccain/palin "win" this election, rural voters who in some cases are more "conservative" will end up being the biggest losers...rural voters who don't inform themselves will literally be screwing themselves and not just in the palin family free for all incestual way....

    Posted by jrs112 at 10/07/2008 @ 2:23pm

  172. Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 2:16pm

    I'm sorry, FROSTY...it's just TOO good with PONTI completely contradicts himself within the same thread on the SAME DAY! (and LESS THAN AN HOUR LATER!)

    I mean, really, he "takes comfort" in a Zogby poll at 11:16am...

    and then chastises me for "taking comfort in polls" at 12:09pm??!?!?!??!

    That's funny!

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 2:59pm

  173. That's funny!

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 2:59pm

    well, if it's at ponti's expense........

    LOL. (and shakin' my head..)

    Posted by frosty zoom at 10/07/2008 @ 3:12pm

  174. For those interested here are some informative facts- things to think about regarding John McCains "healthcare" plans that Palin was carring on about today, I work in the health insurance field so I speak on what I know!

    #1- John McCain has had "big government" health insurance his whole life between the military and being a senator- and now that he is a Senior he gets Medicare as well. You also have "big government" health insurance- paid for by me and all the other americans who pay their taxes. So why is it that our money can provide you and your family with top of the line health insurance but I cant get it for myself without paying additional??

    #2- John McCain does not tackle the biggest issue of all- PRE EXISTING CONDITIONS. For example lets say, Joe Smith who is 59, and has had cancer gets laid off from his job- he has 18 months of Cobra, if he can afford it and then........nothing! You know why? Pre Existing... no one will insure him on an individual policy- case closed.

    #3- Taxing Health Insurance... this unto itself is disgraceful. Example you make 40,000 per year and lets say your employer contributes about 7,000 of your health insurance premium per year. Normally you only pay income taxes on the 40,000...but now you will pay income taxes on 47,000. And that 5000 tax credit- yea that goes straight to the insurance company so you never see it- and it pretty much is a joke anyway- it doesnt make up for anything.

    Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 3:27pm

  175. #4- Opening the Insurance markets across state lines... better known as Deregulation of the Insurance Markets----potential DISASTER. Right now each state regulates the health insurance carriers sold within the state as well as the rates... if the insurance carriers were opened to unlimited states it would be a feeding frenzy- there would be know way to regulate the markets or the rates- and more people would be without health insurance- not less!

    Overall John McCain's entire theory on health insurance is dispicable at best... and just flat out non sensical! My question to McCain and Palin would go back to my #1...if big government health insurance is so bad... why dont you give up yours and pay for coverage like everyone else?? hmmmm bet ya no one thought about that before!

    Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 3:28pm

  176. Posted by DanaNY at 10/07/2008 @ 3:27pm

    Dana, are you aware that the government is essentially bankrupt already due to the costs of Social Security and Medicare? And that the 'health care plan' that you seem so in favor of is bound to cost trillions more that we don't have? When are you people going to face reality?

    Posted by pontificus at 10/08/2008 @ 07:59am

  177. Gee, PONTI, gotta say I'm surprised you came back to this thread after...

    "You know, MASK, it's cool that you take comfort in the polls...."---Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 12:09pm

    I'm sorry...short-term memory problems, PONTI????

    "Seems to be working, Zogby only has B. Hussein up by 3 today."----Posted by pontificus at 10/07/2008 @ 11:16am

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/07/2008 @ 1:06pm

    Posted by Maskdelta at 10/08/2008 @ 10:00am

  178. well i guess if you were a white man served on a board with a kkk member and he threw you a party to raise money, then a few years later you ran for president and they told that at the 5 oclock news you would be a racist I mean if you hang around those people thats what you would be because your supporting them indirectly anyway, so i guess switching kkk with terroist is not the same thing, well your canidate wants change, then why did he choose a man as vp that said himself on meet the press he believes that Obama cant run this country, wait thats right his meal ticket hillary didnt win so he has to change his mind thats why republicans win, because we put in flip floppers and choose a guy that talks good but has no record,

    Posted by politicsdoneit at 10/08/2008 @ 10:43am

  179. Anyone read the article in Rolling Stone on Uncle Fester? Even more of a scum-bag than expected!

    Posted by Truthman at 10/10/2008 @ 4:05pm

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