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RedditPresident Bush has made it clear that he does not read newspapers. And there is little reason to believe that the chief executive spends much time viewing serious news programs before his twilight bedtime.
So it is a bit surprising that he has kept up with the controversy surrounding the MoveOn.org advertisement in the New York Times that urged General David Petraeus, the U.S. commander in Iraq, to put aside administration talking points and speak blunt and necessary truths when he briefed Congress last week.
It is even more surprising that the commander-in-chief would in an official setting take the extraordinary step of attacking the advertisement and the group that placed it.
But so Bush did on Thursday in what will rank as one of the more remarkable -- and politically petty -- moments of a remarkable and politically-petty presidency.
In the New York Times advertisement, MoveOn proposed the anything-but-radical notion that a failure of frankness on the general's part would be a betrayal of the troops and the country. That's hardly an unreasonable suggestion, coming as it does at a critical stage in the occupation when young men and women from the United States are dying at a rate of one every ten hours and when $200 million is removed from the federal treasury each day to maintain what is so obviously a failed mission.
But the president was upset, and he showed it. Tossed a typical soft-ball question at a presidential press conference Thursday morning, Bush responded by saying, "I thought that the ad was disgusting. I felt like the ad was an attack, not only on General Petraeus, but on the U.S. military. And I was disappointed that not more leaders in the Democrat Party spoke out strongly against that kind of ad. That leads me to come to this conclusion: that most Democrats are afraid of irritating a left-wing group like MoveOn.org -- are more afraid of irritating them than they are of irritating the United States military. That was a sorry deal. And it's one thing to attack me. It's another thing to attack somebody like General Petraeus."
Bush's obviously prepared statement was a clumsy attempt to attack Democratic presidential candidates and congressional leaders. But it created an opening for an unprecedented back-and-forth between the most powerful man in the world and his most aggressive critics. It was hardly necessary on the day when Senate Republicans were engineering a symbolic 72-25 vote rebuking the MoveOn ad that referred to Petraeus as "Betray Us." Had Bush simply offered the standard "I'm not going to get into these political fights" line, or even a pithier "I think the Senate will have something appropriate to say about that," he would have mastered the moment.
Instead, the president handed the loudest microphone in the land to MoveOn. And MoveOn.org Political Action Committee executive director Eli Pariser grabbed it with gusto.
"What's disgusting is that the President has more interest in political attacks than developing an exit strategy to get our troops out of Iraq and end this awful war," said Pariser, who argued that, "The President has no credibility on Iraq: he lied repeatedly to the American people to get us into the war. Most Americans oppose the war and want us to get out. Right now, there are about 168,000 American soldiers in Iraq, caught in the crossfire of that country's unwinnable civil war, and the President has betrayed their trust and the trust of the American people."
MoveOn's leaders would be the first to acknowledge that they are not perfect strategists. Like any high-profile activist group, MoveOn makes mistakes that even supporters second guess. Reasonable people can and will question whether the "Betray Us" ad delivered the right message at the right time.
But there is no way that provoking a president to attack your organization's message -- and in so doing to emphasize that leading figures on the national political stage remain resolutely allied with you -- can be counted as anything but a masterstroke.
While the fiercest partisans -- and Fox personalities -- may choose to try and portray the president's outburst as a bold gesture, a show of resolve, a rallying cry or whatever other spin comes to mind, sincere supporter of the president or his war cannot be comfortable with what has transpired. And honest observers, no matter what their political bent, will acknowledge that MoveOn just won a major round.
Anytime a grassroots political group is mentioned by the president of the United States, it gains attention and status as a prime player in the national debate. Add to this simple reality of the political process the fact that Bush is one of the most unpopular presidents in history, and that his declining circumstance is so closely linked with the war, and it is nothing short of amazing that he has chosen to emphasize his morass by getting into a shoving match with MoveOn.
The president's reckless decision to engage in this sort of political infighting at the same time that he and his aides are busy complaining about an increasingly bitter and partisan debate about the occupation makes this a particularly bad day for a president who only yesterday was battered by polling data that confirmed the Petraeus ploy had done nothing to alter anti-war sentiment among the American people.
Presumably, an urgent call will be going out to a certain retired White House political czar. After all, even an electoral street fighter like Karl Rove knows that you don't let a president climb down from his bully pulpit and start wrestling with his loudest critics -- especially a president whose credibility has been stretched beyond he breaking point.
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John Nichols' latest book is THE GENIUS OF IMPEACHMENT: The Founders' Cure for Royalism. Rolling Stone's Tim Dickinson hails it as a "nervy, acerbic, passionately argued history-cum-polemic [that] combines a rich examination of the parliamentary roots and past use of the 'heroic medicine' that is impeachment with a call for Democratic leaders to 'reclaim and reuse the most vital tool handed to us by the founders for the defense of our most basic liberties.'"
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Mr Nichols....I think you missed part of the story.
Bush WASN'T ALONE in attacking the ad....not alone at all-
WASHINGTON (AP) - The Senate voted Thursday to condemn an advertisement by the liberal anti-war group MoveOn.org that accused the top military commander in Iraq of betrayal.
The 72-25 vote (my bolds) condemned the full-page ad that appeared in The New York Times last week as Gen. David Petraeus, the top military commander in Iraq, testified on Capitol Hill. The ad was headlined: "General Petraeus or General Betray Us? Cooking the books for the White House."
Posted by Mask at 09/20/2007 @ 4:24pm
Just labeling the organization as "stalinist", "leftist", "extremist", or any other smear associated with liberalism the right can come up with will be ineffective these days since people are beginning to see through that rhetorical bullshit and joining the "looney lefty" ranks!
Posted by MATTMAN at 09/20/2007 @ 4:28pm
to suggest that petraeus is immune from criticism because he is a soft-spoken GENERAL is simply ridiculous. his report was PHONY, and everyone knows that. anbar, anbar, anbar. that's all these people talk about. the "success" in anbar began long before the surge, but petraeus failed to mention it. is this NOT a form of betrayal, when the GENERAL testifies to PROTECT THE WHITE HOUSE FROM CRITICISM?
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 4:29pm
mask, the democratic congress is IRRELEVANT, they too have joined the ranks of the fascists on the other side of the aisle.
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 4:30pm
all over the news, it is BAD news. everywhere i look, i see sleepwalking americans bow to their fascist leaders. i see young, passionate college kids getting tasered for SPEAKING LOUDLY. i see congressional figures supporting wiretapping, and endless war. i see the media suck it up like whores. i see tax cuts ruining this country. this country is OVER. DONE.
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 4:32pm
Karl Rove wasn't there to tell him what to say.
Pretty simple really.
Bush is a strategic moron.
Posted by plunger at 09/20/2007 @ 4:33pm
and that we have people that REFUSE to restore habeas corpus?! WTF?!
and people who REFUSE to support longer rests for the troops?!
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 4:33pm
mask, the democratic congress is IRRELEVANT, they too have joined the ranks of the fascists on the other side of the aisle. ----Posted by DARLADOON 09/20/2007 @ 4:30pm
Do you make an exception for Nancy Pelosi?
Posted by Mask at 09/20/2007 @ 4:35pm
With oil and gold both hitting all time highs, the dollar hitting all time lows, it's time for Americans to GET FOCUSED on who the culprits really are:
They have brought you Stagflation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stagflation
And the new version of the Weimar Republic: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weimer_republic
Note the picture with this caption: Inflation 1923–24: a woman feeds her tiled stove with money. At the time, burning money was less expensive than buying firewood.
And what followed the Weimer Republic? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler
All of this has been BY DESIGN in a grand conspiracy decades in the planning, by men like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_hw_bush http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Rockefeller
All to enrich themselves at your expense, while creating this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eretz_Israel
Rather than protest against the war, protest against the cause of the war: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aipac http://killtown.blogspot.com/2005/11/dancing-israelis-on-911.html
It's time to name names and hold the co-conspirators responsible for briber, blackmail, fraud and treason.
Posted by plunger at 09/20/2007 @ 4:39pm
Mr. Palast:
Reveal the role of South Florida's Mel Sembler in the vote counting fraud, about torturing teenagers, and why he was involved in the Niger Forgery that led to war, was the Head of Scooter Libby's Defense Fund, AND held a fundraiser for Joe Lieberman, despite being a lifelong Republican.
Got Zionist Conspiracy?
Mel Sembler heads up Scooter Libby's Legal defense Fund. Mel is a lifelong Republican with a very checkered past:
http://alternet.org/story/27725/ http://www.thestraights.com/index.htm
"In February 1989, President George H.W. Bush appointed Sembler United States Ambassador to Australia and Nauru"
"In 1998 Sembler and his wife went to Israel with George and Laura Bush. Sembler has close personal ties to both George W. and Jeb Bush. Sembler's wife Betty was a fundraiser for Jeb's gubernatorial campaign. Jeb declared August 8, 2000 "Betty Sembler Day" in Florida." (Why did Jeb declare Martial Law 6 days PRIOR to 9/11?)
http://www.thestraights.com/news/charlie-crist.htm
Mel just happened to be the Ambassador to Italy at the same time that Ledeen makes a trip to Rome to meet with him and others - then magically - the purported Niger Yellow Cake document appears in Italy.
Even more interesting, when Lieberman loses to Lamont in the DEMOCRATIC primary, it is Republican Sembler who hosts a fundraiser for Lieberman to run as an Independent (with the full encouragement of the White House). Note that Lieberman's job now is to protect Israeli AGENT CHERTOFF.
Rove orders-up the fake London Terror Scare the next day, to change the subject in the mainstream media. During that fake terror hype, the story of US Spy for Israel, Ariel Joseph Weinmann slips out into the ether, under the radar.
Of Swallows and Ravens http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=2189
Israeli Sexpionage in the McGreevey, Condit and Clinton Affairs http://www.the7thfire.com/new_world_order/zionism/mossad/israeli_sexpion age.htm
If you always keep the PNAC in mind, and remember the AGENDA that is being pursued on Israel's behalf, it becomes very clear that a massive conspiracy to SELL THE INVASION OF IRAQ was in play.
The only explanation is that GHW Bush and the agents of Israel (including Lieberman) formed a CONSPIRACY (each for their own reasons) to work together to take down Clinton with Sexpionage (and that alliance continued through 9/11 and the invasion of the Middle East):
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=2189
Posted by plunger at 09/20/2007 @ 4:39pm
The 72-25 vote (my bolds) condemned the full-page ad that appeared in The New York Times last week as Gen. David Petraeus, the top military commander in Iraq, testified on Capitol Hill. The ad was headlined: "General Petraeus or General Betray Us? Cooking the books for the White House."
Posted by MASK
You would think the Senate would have much more important things to do than suck up to all the fools that fell for the bs rhetoric the Repubs employed to discredit the message. After all the lies, misconduct how can people still be gullible enough to fall for this kind of cheap tactic?
Posted by mtspence05 at 09/20/2007 @ 4:49pm
Chimpy's diatribe constitutes the usual tactics of a schoolyard bully, or more accurately, the punk-ass kid that leads the pack of goons on the playground.
Typical stuff for the Shrub - he trammels himself up in righteous indignation on behalf of a military in which he declined to fully participate when he is in actuality peeved that someone dared to openly challenge him.
The only term that I can think of to describe this man and his (an)administration is one I learned the first time I read Ivanhoe, by Sir Walter Scott.
The word - Niddering - comes from Anglo Saxon, and conveys a sense of abject worthlessness.
And this is how I shall I think of himself - The Niddering - now and always.
Posted by skeletonman at 09/20/2007 @ 4:58pm
The Senate voted Thursday to condemn an advertisement by the liberal anti-war group MoveOn.org that accused the top military commander in Iraq of betrayal. Posted by MASK 09/20/2007 @ 4:24pm
Our tax dollars, hard at work!
Posted by habiba at 09/20/2007 @ 5:16pm
I think you meant $200 million a day, not $200 billion a day.
Posted by garygrossman at 09/20/2007 @ 5:27pm
"when $200 billion is removed from the federal treasury each day".
Is that right? Over four years that works out to ~292 trillion dollars. Please clarify.
Posted by imadane at 09/20/2007 @ 5:36pm
We need a fairness doctrine to combat and equalize,or at least neutralise those animals over at Moveon.shit.. ..
..wasn't Moveon a Clinton organization? Frank, come out from under Hillarys skirt and find out, Ok ?
Posted by john maasch at 09/20/2007 @ 5:37pm
bush responding like that...lame. reminds me of comodus strapping on the armor to fight maximus in front of rome...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/20/2007 @ 5:40pm
Where was all this contempt, outrage when the Swiftboat liars impugned the service of a man that actually went to Vietnam?
Posted by mtspence05 at 09/20/2007 @ 5:41pm
Where was all this contempt, outrage when the Swiftboat liars impugned the service of a man that actually went to Vietnam?
Posted by MTSPENCE05 09/20/2007 @ 5:41pm
Cowering in the corner, right there with the wingnut chickenhawks who failed to suit up when their time came?
Posted by skeletonman at 09/20/2007 @ 5:44pm
Posted by SKELETONMAN
Exactly. Jr, Cheney, and the old fool Maasch. Now they want to walk around with the little flag pins in their lapels and talk of how much they support the troops.
Posted by mtspence05 at 09/20/2007 @ 5:47pm
Mr Nichols....I think you missed part of the story.
Bush WASN'T ALONE in attacking the ad....not alone at all-
WASHINGTON (AP) - The Senate voted Thursday to condemn an advertisement by the liberal anti-war group MoveOn.org that accused the top military commander in Iraq of betrayal.
The 72-25 vote (my bolds) condemned the full-page ad that appeared in The New York Times last week as Gen. David Petraeus, the top military commander in Iraq, testified on Capitol Hill. The ad was headlined: "General Petraeus or General Betray Us? Cooking the books for the White House."
Posted by MASK 09/20/2007 @ 4:24pm
A Frita trasparent straw dildo? Er, 7th paragraph down:
"Bush's obviously prepared statement was a clumsy attempt to attack Democratic presidential candidates and congressional leaders. But it created an opening for an unprecedented back-and-forth between the most powerful man in the world and his most aggressive critics. It was hardly necessary on the day when Senate Republicans were engineering a symbolic 72-25 vote (My bolds) rebuking the MoveOn ad that referred to Petraeus as "Betray Us." Had Bush simply offered the standard "I'm not going to get into these political fights" line, or even a pithier "I think the Senate will have something appropriate to say about that," he would have mastered the moment."
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 5:52pm
Where was all this contempt, outrage when the Swiftboat liars impugned the service of a man that actually went to Vietnam?
Posted by MTSPENCE05 09/20/2007 @ 5:41pm
Cowering in the corner, right there with the wingnut chickenhawks who failed to suit up when their time came?
Posted by SKELETONMAN 09/20/2007 @ 5:44pm
Hiding behind their momma's skirts.
Posted by Dr Decibels at 09/20/2007 @ 5:59pm
MTS, SM,
Don't forget that at least Thompson couldn't remember Terri Shiavo 'details', has 'no opinion'!
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 6:00pm
Dumb goes a long way sometimes...
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 6:02pm
Does anyone remember another military hero who was SWIFTBOATED?
Posted by FRANKGRITS 09/20/2007 @ 6:06pm
Max Cleland.
Posted by Dr Decibels at 09/20/2007 @ 6:10pm
And they gave us Saxby Chambliss.... a real walking talking turd.
Posted by Dr Decibels at 09/20/2007 @ 6:11pm
Frank, Dr.,
http://tinyurl.com/2jsswh
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 6:12pm
I read that. There's no end to the perfidy of these people.
Posted by Dr Decibels at 09/20/2007 @ 6:19pm
We need a fairness doctrine to combat and equalize,or at least neutralise those animals over at Moveon.shit.. ..
..wasn't Moveon a Clinton organization? Frank, come out from under Hillarys skirt and find out, Ok ?
moveon is actually the most evolved form of political activism, as it requires little action on the part of millions of americans. do you see people in the streets? no. but you do see them donating a few dollars while doing internet. simple, easy, effective.
the moveon ad was, at worst, honest. christ, the white house said that they would instead write the report, and not petraeus, all the while claiming that patreaus would provide the most honest, independent assessment of the mess that is iraq.
anbar, schmanbar. deaths are UP. WAY up! it is so fucking bad that......whatever.
maasch, you are moronic sometimes. you need to smoke weed, dude. serious! smoke some weed!
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 6:23pm
here is another ridiculous republican problem:
support the troops! they twist ANY good-natured argument from the left side of the aisle, and claim "you don't support the troops"! and yet jim webb just proposed a bill (which failed) to lengthen troops home stay between tours of duty.
WTF?
these people are SICK. physically sick. they are the reason most earthlings HATE us!
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 6:25pm
fact: most earthlings DESPISE the united states BECAUSE of bush.
"most" is the key word
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 6:26pm
"maasch, you are moronic sometimes. you need to smoke weed, dude. serious! smoke some weed!
Posted by DARLADOON 09/20/2007 @ 6:23pm
This is a perfect post...
When I grew up and saw the world as it really is and how it works,...and did what most all responsible thinking adults do... I gave up weed and many other childish things and beliefs...including and especially liberalism.
Posted by john maasch at 09/20/2007 @ 6:33pm
Uhmmm, GOP front-runners don't want to deal with a debate concerning ethnicity or minority issues and then 3 false reports:
Whoopi "defended" Vick's actions -- not true and denied by the individual in question.
Oprah was leaving $30 million to her dogs -- also not true and denied by the individual in question.
Jackson said Obama was "acting white" -- likewise not true and denied by the individual in question.
Anybody remember the 'Office of Disinformation/Office of Strategic Influence', created by hsuB/cHeney admin right after 9/11? Considering what they've done to the DoJ...
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 6:33pm
Yep, 'our' tax dollars at work.
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 6:40pm
I gave up weed and many other childish things and beliefs...including and especially liberalism.
of course, weed is the problem! i knew it all along! alcohol, however. totally fine! totally fucking fine! wars? hell, no problem!
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 6:42pm
is maasch's personal relationship with marijuana the issue here?
i thought the topic was, uh, "bush is a moron"
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 6:43pm
I think figuring out how to open the eyes of the willfully blind new con supporters, servicers of dic'tator philosophy, in order that they can see truth, is a taunting task.
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/20/2007 @ 6:51pm
"i thought the topic was, uh, "bush is a moron"
Posted by DARLADOON 09/20/2007 @ 6:43pm "
The topic is Moveon.shit and how then have turned off America..
Posted by john maasch at 09/20/2007 @ 6:58pm
git him DARLA!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/20/2007 @ 6:59pm
rippin' into that poor man like a pit bull into a poodle at michael vick's.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/20/2007 @ 7:01pm
The topic is Moveon.shit and how then have turned off America..
uh, moveon is actually to the right of mainstream US opinion, according to all the recent polls. it is the mainstream media which has failed the american people to such a degree that people like maasch continue to exist within the political discourse. either that or people like maasch are just inherently stupid, which is a distinct possibility, judging that they tend to live in and/or migrate to the most god awful places on earth.
and would you like to talk about the iraqi polls? what, 82% want us out? and 64% want anyone to kick the shit out of us?
Posted by darladoon at 09/20/2007 @ 7:05pm
Mr. Nichols makes a good point that I hadn't considered. It really should be beneath the dignity of a President to respond to such matters. But I'd long ceased to equate Bush with any semblance of dignity, so I missed this one.
I know we're not supposed to stray off topic, but that's already happened several times in this thread, so what the heck. I want to respond to an earlier comment by JOHN MAASCH -- no, not about the weed (and be careful, because that really is my name) -- but about growing up and seeing "the world as it really is and how it works". I've always been fascinated by this reaction to the world, and I think it's central to our differences of perspective.
I see the world as it really is, and I believe we can do better, and I want to change it. Others see the world as it is, and adapt. That makes me somewhat maladjusted, I suppose, but I wish I had a deeper understanding of what seems a bitter acquiescence to brutal circumstance.
It's not a new idea, but I think the problem really is that some of us believe that humans are basically a trashy lot, sinful to the core and in need of controlled supervision. I believe that one man's trash is another's treasure, and the disrespectful pantsing of our Daddy General is a cry for the respect and attention we've been denied. That it's succeeded in getting the attention of Big Daddy himself is guaranteed to send the message that these methods pay big dividends.
Respect breeds respect. And vice versa.
Posted by Donald Weed at 09/20/2007 @ 7:56pm
Posted by Donald Weed at 09/20/2007 @ 7:57pm
Gen. David Petreus is an " ass kissing little chicken shit ". This is a quote from CENTCOM Commander Admiral William Fallon. I guess he is unpatriotic too! I don't remember the censure of Swift Boaters, after they slandered Kerry, unlike MoveOn, which pointed out some inconvenient truths! We are truly in an alternate reality.
Posted by waters at 09/20/2007 @ 7:58pm
I think you mean #200 million each day.
Posted by tnac.1 at 09/20/2007 @ 8:07pm
Posted by HSUBFOOLS 09/20/2007 @ 5:52pm
HSUB, I know you continue to think that the Senate (as well as the House) are playing some "trick" by which they only SEEM to be caving (hence your faith that impeachment is only 6 weeks away)....
but the point was Mr Nichols tried to make this is some Bush solo craziness....but the Senate joined in that craziness.
A courageous Senate, a politically savvy Senate wouldn't have caved on such idiocy...but they did, and not just Repubs, but some TWENTY-SIX Democrats did too.
And yet these are the same guys who are going to impeach him and Cheney?!?!??
Posted by Mask at 09/20/2007 @ 8:14pm
I think you meant $200 million a day, not $200 billion a day.
Posted by GARYGROSSMAN 09/20/2007 @ 5:27pm
Typical NICHOLS.....just take his usual shit and drop 3 000s (not you, ZERO) to get its real worth!!!
Posted by Happy at 09/20/2007 @ 8:32pm
25 Democrats with no guts to stand up to Moveon.org----they should be ashamed. Go ahead---attach yourself to the far left-you can still lose a Presidential election that everyone thinks is a lock.---tie yourself to groups like Moveon and watch the tide turn. Go for it. I am sure that Little Johnny the socialist whore was happy with the add from Moveon---but Little Johnny the socialist whore never saw anything Anti American Military that he didn't like----why? Because he is a socialist whore who puts world socialism ahead of the sovereignty and safety of his own country. Does that make him a traitor--NO--not in this country where free speech is cherished--it makes him a socialist whore.
Posted by Len Mosse at 09/20/2007 @ 8:37pm
here is another ridiculous republican problem:
support the troops! they twist ANY good-natured argument from the left side of the aisle, and claim "you don't support the troops"! and yet jim webb just proposed a bill (which failed) to lengthen troops home stay between tours of duty.
WTF?
these people are SICK. physically sick. they are the reason most earthlings HATE us!
Posted by DARLADOON 09/20/2007 @ 6:25pm | ignore this person
The Republican opposition to the Webb amendment mandating the troops have more time to rest, before being shipped back to the front lines is further evidence of Republican dominance over public airwaves. The Democrats (those not gorging themselves in the corporate cash trough) have no ability to effectively communicate or compete with the conservative blather chamber.
Democrats reflexively back down during civil liberty, constitutional battles, due to their fears of being slimed and Swift-boated during the campaign season, whereas, Republicans can self-righteously, arrogantly feel free and safe enough to effectively, legislatively urinate on the troops by voting against an amendment which fairly, grants equal time rest for the same amount of time spent in war-zone combat-duty. And yet, Republicans pierce the public areas with screeching tantrums proclaiming that private corporate media, which draws the vast majority of revenue from commercial advertising--thus leg-chained to a form of economic self-censorship (can't bite the rank, predatory hand that feeds you)--that the media is monopolized by a sinister, secret liberal power center bent on reaping the lucrative riches guaranteed to those speaking on behalf of the voiceless, dispirited and impoverished masses.
Posted by Oustbush at 09/20/2007 @ 9:09pm
It really should be beneath the dignity of a President to respond to such matters. But I'd long ceased to equate Bush with any semblance of dignity, so I missed this one.
Just a few problems with this statement:
1.) So a 527 Democrat organization has no baseline for dignity? After all, it wasn't like what they did was a response to anything...they PRE-EMPTED the General's testimony. Not very ethical (or smart, for that matter).
2.) Does the 1st amendment apply to everyone except the POTUS? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. And since when is a response to an accusation considered an attack?
Posted by Sliver at 09/20/2007 @ 9:11pm
Interesting points, friends, not all of them, sorry, read. But the fact I was in Gainesville, Florida, this morning and the non-unionized, predominantly African-American service employees at UF were called to a meeting and presumably alerted to "stay the course" of conscientious obeisance(sp?) to the "average," read apolitical student, in the same location where Andrew Meyer was tazed at the close of a John Kerry speech, is exceedingly ironic and informative. Indeed, the times they are a changin'. (Don't taze me bro'!!)
Posted by lewwelge at 09/20/2007 @ 9:22pm
Does that make him a traitor--NO--not in this country where free speech is cherished--it makes him a socialist whore.
Posted by LEN MOSSE 09/20/2007 @ 8:37pm | ignore this person
You're really getting creepy with this "little Johnny the whore" taunting. Are you and your chicken-shit-hawk Republican legislators traitors to those soldiers sweating and dying in the war zone, while you rest in lethargy, anchored to your laziboy recliner, essentially cracking the whip against the already raw, weary flesh of the troops to "get your whiny asses back on the battlefield!"?
Posted by Oustbush at 09/20/2007 @ 9:27pm
Hello Lew, good to see you and your dignified presence here. Must run off to do some work. Strange incident, the Tazering event. I'm not terribly shocked (though it could happpen someday-yikes!), because we really do go overboard for that law and order stuff in this country.
Posted by Oustbush at 09/20/2007 @ 9:42pm
"days since people are beginning to see through that rhetorical bullshit and joining the "looney lefty" ranks!"
Not everyone....
Keep up the good job Bush. Continue to keep our troops in Iraq. There's more terrorists to kill.
Todd
Posted by Oksportsguy at 09/20/2007 @ 9:49pm
Speaking of Rudi Giulianni of New York ... Well, Hillary is right. In the policy term, the guy isn't even worth talking about. His baggage of experience is mostly with his personal life: Multiple love affairs, multiple marriages, ... I'm glad I'm not a conservative. Read this.
---------- Top Hillary Clinton backer rips Rudy Giuliani's personal life Thursday, September 20th 2007, 4:00 AM Hillary Clinton has avoided taking potshots at Rudy Giuliani's personal life - but one of her top boosters last night showed no such restraint.
Former Iowa Gov. Tom Vilsack went off on Rudy Giuliani's family foibles in a televised interview, saying Giuliani has "lots of issues" voters may not know about - yet.
"I can't even get into the number of marriages, [and] the relationship he has with his children," Vilsack said on New York 1, describing the ex-mayor's past as "interesting."
Vilsack, who joined Team Clinton after abandoning his own presidential aspirations, was to appear at a Manhattan fund-raiser for Clinton last night.
Posted by Helen DAO at 09/20/2007 @ 9:54pm
I'm curious, do most of you put RESE on your ignore list? There are pages of stuff. Should I actually attempt to read this stuff? If it makes a contribution to the tread, ok. But I get the impression that some conspiracy theory gene has mutated.
Posted by sntauri at 09/20/2007 @ 10:02pm
Posted by SNTAURI 09/20/2007 @ 10:02pm |
sleestak...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/20/2007 @ 10:41pm
Posted by SNTAURI 09/20/2007 @ 10:02pm
She's a nut. Obsessive and clinically paranoid. So bad in fact, that she's driven "Nation" writers to ask her to stop spamming their threads with her nuttiness.
Posted by Mask at 09/20/2007 @ 10:43pm
Vilsack, who joined Team Clinton after abandoning his own presidential aspirations, was to appear at a Manhattan fund-raiser for Clinton last night.----Posted by HELEN DAO 09/20/2007 @ 9:54pm
HELEN, you didn't REALLY think Tom Vilsack was actually running, did you? That was a trick, to boost Hillary's chances in Iowa!
Posted by Mask at 09/20/2007 @ 10:44pm
Blackwater, USA America Uncle Sam Democracy Freedom Christianity Capitalism United States, Good Guys. WHAT A FARCE.
Conservatives, LOOK at what YOU have done.
Condoleeza Rice: "Iraqi Government, how dare you try to kick foreign murderers and criminals out of your country. Bad Sovereign Govt. How dare you. When America orders you to host killers and murderers and criminals in your country, you better do it, or we'll kill you".
Posted by conshame at 09/20/2007 @ 11:31pm
but the point was Mr Nichols tried to make this is some Bush solo craziness....but the Senate joined in that craziness.
Posted by MASK 09/20/2007 @ 8:14pm
Frita, stop with playing with your straw dildos-- they're rendering you daft. JN mentioned the senate vote very clearly. He just didn't put your desperate 'flag-burning-legislation-means-something' spin on it.
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/21/2007 @ 12:32am
BY RIO BRAVO
Bush spoke to the sentiments of the majority of the American people,
---it seems while people support the personnel in your military as human beings, the majority also have grown tired of the carnage, and have realized they can't hide at the mall.------
He seems to be learning much from the spin and hat tricks practiced by his dads new friend WJC!
----well, there's something to make anybody proud----
Republican opposition and conservative Americans everywhere!
-----this is an oxymoron. a quintillion dollar deficit is hardly what i call conserving anything--------
Anti-Military and Anti-Americanism
----again another oxymoron (and bad parallel structure). despite all the killing that has been done in your name, most americans abhor violence (just like any sane person) and view the military as a DEFENCE force, not an ATTACK force. that is the noble american spirit----------
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 12:44am
Simple: Bush is energizing the Republican base.
The more MoveOn.org attacks (gives solid ground), the more Bush can use this to excite his base (push off the solid ground)
MoveOn.org, please design better ads that get to the Republican base; you already have the liberals.
Posted by invidious at 09/21/2007 @ 12:53am
Just heard that hsuB got so flustered or was blitzed enough at today's press conference, that he forgot to his western folksie accent, fell back on his new england yale accent. Anyone find the clip?
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/21/2007 @ 12:54am
Posted by HSUBFOOLS 09/21/2007 @ 12:54am
ta-da! i found it all the way from canada, eh?
gonna watch this right now [youtube.com]
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 01:15am
gonna watch this right now [youtube.com]
Posted by FROSTY ZOOM 09/21/2007 @ 01:15am
damn! does anybody know a way i can unwatch this?
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 01:18am
hsuB's accent was even more missing if possible when he responded about not responding about Israel's bombing...
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/21/2007 @ 01:53am
"Does anyone remember another military hero who was SWIFTBOATED?
Posted by FRANKGRITS 09/20/2007 @ 6:06pm
Oliver North, who was correct on Bin Laden when ALGORE had never heard of him, apparently through out the 8 years when he was the most "hard working VP the nation ever had...
Posted by john maasch at 09/21/2007 @ 01:59am
when he was the most "hard working VP the nation ever had...
Posted by JOHN MAASCH 09/21/2007 @ 01:59am
well that honour has been usurped.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 02:04am
AHMADINEJAD SAYS HE WILL NOT PUSH TO VISIT GROUND ZERO; 'AMAZED' GESTURE WOULD INSULT AMERICANS Thu Sept 20 2007 16:11:22 ET
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad will not press his plan -- just denied by New York City Police for security reasons -- to visit Ground Zero in New York City, he tells 60 MINUTES' Scott Pelley in an exclusive interview conducted today in Iran. The Iranian leader says he's "amazed" and skeptical that most Americans view his visit there as insulting as his intention was only to show respect. The interview will be broadcast on 60 MINUTES, Sunday Sept. 23 (7:00-8:00 PM, ET/PT) on the CBS television Network.
An excerpt from the interview follows:
Wow. conscience of a Muslim! Well, you just wonder why with no pr guys/girls like Karl Rove or Bill Kristol or Condi Rice or Karen Hughes or even that guy Scooter Libby in prison now, the Muslims still win pr war one after another. Maybe our taxpayers' money should not fund Dubya's propoganda machine anymore? An where's freedom in this land if we don't allow an Iranian guy to visit the ground zero? Maybe he sees it and he woukd pay us$ billions for the victims? I just don't know, but the guy look sincerer than any of our politicians. Read this. ------------
PELLEY: Mr. President, do you intend to press your request to visit the World Trade Center site?
AHMADINEJAD: Well, it was included in my program. If we have the time and the conditions are conducive, I will try to do that.
Posted by Helen DAO at 09/21/2007 @ 03:06am
Well, Moveon and the likes of Jerryy Falwell, Dick Cheney, Abramoff, Karl Rove, John McCain, Tom Delay, ... are all extremists. And you know extremists are losers nowadays. But those are small fish, you should be more concerned with news like this Dubya, Dubai, ...
----------
Sheikdom shakedown: Dubai moves on Nasdaq Arab ownership of U.S. stock exchange raises flag in Congress By Jerome R. Corsi © 2007 WorldNetDaily.com
In a complex set of transactions, Dubai is moving to acquire 19.9 percent of the Nasdaq in New York, placing the Arab government in an ownership position of the key U.S. stock exchange and raising concerns in Congress.
Posted by Helen DAO at 09/21/2007 @ 03:15am
Wow. conscience of a Muslim! Well, you just wonder why with no pr guys/girls like Karl Rove or Bill Kristol or Condi Rice or Karen Hughes or even that guy Scooter Libby in prison now, the Muslims still win pr war one after another. Maybe our taxpayers' money should not fund Dubya's propoganda machine anymore? An where's freedom in this land if we don't allow an Iranian guy to visit the ground zero? Maybe he sees it and he woukd pay us$ billions for the victims? I just don't know, but the guy look sincerer than any of our politicians. Read this. ------------
PELLEY: Mr. President, do you intend to press your request to visit the World Trade Center site?
AHMADINEJAD: Well, it was included in my program. If we have the time and the conditions are conducive, I will try to do that.
Posted by HELEN DAO 09/21/2007 @ 03:06am
prepare to have venom spat upon thee,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 04:09am
Posted by MARYBRETBRAD 09/21/2007 @ 08:19am
actually a microphone amplifies nothing. that is done by the PUBLIC ADDRESS SYSTEM or PA
alas, even with the best PA system can be plagued with shrill feedback.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 08:23am
Hey OustBush! Thanks for the "props."
And Rese, thanks for giving me the link which I'll check here in a minute, re the missing(!!) nuke.
Feliz "Fall" ya'll. Autumn's in, friends.
Posted by lewwelge at 09/21/2007 @ 09:11am
Posted by LEWWELGE 09/21/2007 @ 09:11am
not yet. the autumnal equinox usually happens on the 22nd of september.
Equinoxes And Solstices: 1992-2012
Source: U.S. Naval Observatory
Autumnal Equinox Sep 23 2007 09:51 UT
that's 05:51 eastern daylight time
**the mayans had there own astrology. different animals for each of there different 20 day months. people born on solstices and equinoxes [+/- 1 day] were special. they were "jaguars" and were considered to be superior to the rest of the menagerie.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 09:50am
Think MOVEON.SHIT will run an ad regarding Armyjihad? Then the question becomes, will it support Armejihad or with the cesspool come out against him visiting Ground Zero, or even having him on US soil? A toss up at best.
Posted by john maasch at 09/21/2007 @ 09:57am
Posted by JOHN MAASCH 09/21/2007 @ 09:57am
left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right left right
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 10:14am
"Remember how right after the invasion and the WMD's failed to appear, and after the "No more Rape Rooms" story because tragically ironic, all the right-wing had was this..."Saddam stole nearly $10 billion in the UN Oil-for-Food program!!!"
Sadly, the world we've created:
At least US$10 billion has been embezzled, according to Iraq's Commission on Public Integrity, which is itself underfunded (12 of its members have been murdered). After a U.S. report surfaced detailing how the prime minister blocked the commission's investigations of corrupt officials, Maliki accused the head of the commission of corruption and threatened him with arrest. Luckily the man was already out of the country. Corruption in the Oil Ministry--Iraq's nationalized energy sector is its only real source of revenue--has resulted in shortages that have only increased the long lineups for gasoline in a country brimming with oil. Senior Iraqi army officers complain that when they organize raids on Shia militias, they are stopped on orders from the prime minister's office. Iraq was a disaster under Saddam, but it has turned into Nigeria.
And about the deaths being down in Baghdad, this is an old theme here, but it's true:
Instead of polls and data mining, the governing Shia parties have taken control by using militias to "sectarian cleanse" Baghdad, a retaliation against al-Qaeda's spectacular car bombing campaign. By one estimate, Baghdad was once 65 per cent Sunni; today it is 75 per cent Shia. Deaths from sectarian killings are reportedly down, in large measure because there are few mixed neighbourhoods left. Almost the entire Sunni middle class lives in Jordan or Syria. If you are named Omar, a traditional Sunni name, chances are you are dead or living abroad. Under Saddam, no one on the streets of the capital ever uttered the word mukhabarat, mean ing the feared security police. Today, no one says maktab, meaning "office," but in fact referring to radical Shia cleric Muqtada al-Sadr's Mahdi Army's bases from which members control neighbourhoods. Their preferred method of torture is the electric drill.
And then there is this:
Remember how right after the invasion and the WMD's failed to appear, and after the "No more Rape Rooms" story because tragically ironic, all the right-wing had was this..."Saddam stole nearly $10 billion in the UN Oil-for-Food program!!!"
Sadly, the world we've created:
At least US$10 billion has been embezzled, according to Iraq's Commission on Public Integrity, which is itself underfunded (12 of its members have been murdered). After a U.S. report surfaced detailing how the prime minister blocked the commission's investigations of corrupt officials, Maliki accused the head of the commission of corruption and threatened him with arrest. Luckily the man was already out of the country. Corruption in the Oil Ministry--Iraq's nationalized energy sector is its only real source of revenue--has resulted in shortages that have only increased the long lineups for gasoline in a country brimming with oil. Senior Iraqi army officers complain that when they organize raids on Shia militias, they are stopped on orders from the prime minister's office. Iraq was a disaster under Saddam, but it has turned into Nigeria.
And about the deaths being down in Baghdad, this is an old theme here, but it's true:
Instead of polls and data mining, the governing Shia parties have taken control by using militias to "sectarian cleanse" Baghdad, a retaliation against al-Qaeda's spectacular car bombing campaign. By one estimate, Baghdad was once 65 per cent Sunni; today it is 75 per cent Shia. Deaths from sectarian killings are reportedly down, in large measure because there are few mixed neighbourhoods left. Almost the entire Sunni middle class lives in Jordan or Syria. If you are named Omar, a traditional Sunni name, chances are you are dead or living abroad. Under Saddam, no one on the streets of the capital ever uttered the word mukhabarat, meaning the feared security police. Today, no one says maktab, meaning "office," but in fact referring to radical Shia cleric Muqtada al-Sadr's Mahdi Army's bases from which members control neighbourhoods. Their preferred method of torture is the electric drill."
http://rising-hegemon.blogspot.com/2007/09/read-this.html
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/21/2007 @ 11:40am
Ooops sorry for the double post. My finger may have hit the key twice....
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/21/2007 @ 11:44am
Posted by OKSPORTSGUY 09/20/2007 @ 9:49pm | ignore this person
grrr, kill, kill
same old Todd.
Posted by johannesrolf at 09/21/2007 @ 12:08pm
No one believes anything the hsuB/cHeney admin says or anyone it sends out to Betrayus.
CBS News Poll. Sept. 14-16, 2007. N=706 adults nationwide. MoE ± 4.
"Do you approve or disapprove of the way George W. Bush is handling the situation with Iraq?"
Date_____________Approve ___Disapprove ___Unsure
9/14-16/07__________25 ________70 _________5
"Do you approve or disapprove of the way Democrats in Congress are handling the situation with Iraq?"
Date_____________Approve ___Disapprove ___Unsure
9/14-16/07_________31 __________57 ________12
"Looking back, do you think the United States did the right thing in taking military action against Iraq, or should the U.S. have stayed out?"
Date__________Right Thing ___Stayed Out ___Unsure
9/14-16/07________39 __________53 _________8
"From what you know about the U.S. involvement in Iraq, how much longer would you be willing to have large numbers of U.S. troops remain in Iraq: less than a year, one to two years, two to five years or longer than five years?"
Date_______Less Than A Year__1 to 2 Years__2 to 5 Years__Longer__Unsure
9/14-16/07________49__________23________12_________5______11
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/21/2007 @ 12:09pm
actually a microphone amplifies nothing. that is done by the PUBLIC ADDRESS SYSTEM or PA
er, no. here you are treading on my professional sphere. if a mike did not amplify, why would it need a battery or phantom power, as most do?
Posted by johannesrolf at 09/21/2007 @ 12:12pm
Can anybody help me out?
I recall in one of the Kerry/Bush debates that Bush was asked to repudiate the Kerry attacks by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, but Bush dodged by saying something along the lines of "Well, they're entitled to their opinion and I won't denounce them."
I cannot, however, find a reference to the debates that includes the SWVFT. Can anybody point me to a link that contains this exchange, where Bush saw no problem with smearing a member of the military?
Posted by nathanhale at 09/21/2007 @ 1:23pm
I HATE TO SAY IT...
1) The Dems definitely lost this one because they let themselves be bullied by the usual "support to the troops" Bush/Cheney bullshit.
2) The MoveOn ad was right on but the caption wasn't. The whole brouhaha was all about the caption which many, even on the left will agree, I think, was at the least, shall we say, ill-advised, given the opening that it provided the right. "Petraeus or Betray Us" is the kind of thing you can post with impunity on the Internet of course. What else is new? But it is definitely not the kind of thing the Mainstream Media are ready for. (Granted, Fox gets away with this sort of thing against progressives all the time, but that's because the Dems don't call them on it -- as they should.)
3) It is, of course, (or should be) a total non-issue but the neocons MADE it an issue (as they are wont to do) and basically used it as a club to beat the Dems into submission (again.)
4) Hillary at least voted AGAINST the Senate resolution to condemn MoveOn (Obama abstained). You've gotta give her credit for that. (I know, I know, she said positive things about Petraeus to counterbalance her vote but still....)
Posted by w_m_bear at 09/21/2007 @ 1:59pm
Posted by MARYBRETBRAD 09/21/2007 @ 2:08pm
Mary - nice try, but MoveOn's ad said nothing disparaging about the troops.
I really wish all you neo-cons could get as fired up about the loss of life abroad and our liberties here at home as you do over an advertisement by an interest group.
Posted by Hman23 at 09/21/2007 @ 2:38pm
.) Does the 1st amendment apply to everyone except the POTUS? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. And since when is a response to an accusation considered an attack?
Posted by
First of all, Sliver, my thought when I heard President Bush give his two cents on the MoveOn ad was "Doesn't he have anything more constructive to do, like come up with an Iraq exit strategy or renew the S-CHIP program?"
But secondly, Sliver, I ask you to do those of us who love, respect and study the First Amendment a big favor, please?
Never mention Bush in connection with it. Because he thinks that the entire Constitution, especially the First Amendment, is something that you wipe your ass with, you disrespect the document by putting him and it in the same sentence.
Besides, it seems like Bush and his ilk, (and unfortunately many of you speaking for the right on this blog) would like to see the First Amendment done away with.
Otherwise, there would be no explanation for your reasoning that MoveOn.org (which wasn't a "Clinton" organization, but actually an organization that thought Congress had better things to do with its time than to investigate who last gave head to the president)should be silenced.
My feeling is that if there's speech that you don't like going on, fight it with speech of your own. That's what MoveOn.org is doing and most of you on the right can't stand it.
Why? Because they've shown a willingness to hit as hard and play just as dirty as the right has for years. MoveOn has shown a willingness to go for the mattresses and take out the big guns to hit you with. While I haven't always agreed with their stands, I think that it's about time that there's an organization on the left that's got a set.
Besides, you on the right have no one but yourselves to blame for this one. If you righties had put Lee Atwater and Karl Rove, and their politics of character assasination, obfuscation, and out and out lies in check, MoveOn might not exist. If you think that they're playing dirty, you have no one but yourselves to blame because you taught them everything they know.
Now suck it up!
Posted by edwriter at 09/21/2007 @ 2:44pm
...MoveOn might not exist....
Posted by EDWRITER 09/21/2007 @ 2:44pm
But thankfully, MoveON DO exist....can't wait till it shoots the liberals in the groin, again! ROTFLMAO :))))))!
Posted by Happy at 09/21/2007 @ 2:57pm
Besides, it seems like Bush and his ilk, (and unfortunately many of you speaking for the right on this blog) would like to see the First Amendment done away with...
MoveOn has shown a willingness to go for the mattresses and take out the big guns
Posted by EDWRITER 09/21/2007 @ 2:44pm
Obviously, my allusion to "The Godfather" got missed here. When they "went for the mattresses" in that movie, they were getting the firearms that they saved for when "company" comes to call.
A little hyperbolic, don't you think? Besides, I thought we were going to stop talking about Clinton. (Unless you ment take it to the mat, as in wrestling mat.)
Posted by MARYBRETBRAD 09/21/2007 @ 2:58pm | ignore this person
I'll stop being hyperbolic when you do. Only thing is, I'm a writer. Words are my profession. What's your excuse?
But thankfully, MoveON DO exist....can't wait till it shoots the liberals in the groin, again! ROTFLMAO :))))))!
Posted by HAPPY 09/21/2007 @ 2:57pm | ignore this pers
And, almost on cue, my initial point is proven. The only reason that folks like Happy are so incensed with MoveOn, is because they occasionally reflect just how silly and shrill you sound.
Posted by edwriter at 09/21/2007 @ 3:08pm
"Fuck the troops!"
Posted by MARYBRETBRAD 09/21/2007 @ 2:08pm | ignore this person
this has been Bush's policy from the start. shitty equipment from lousy bodyarmor to unarmored Humvees. what will the survivors of the many dead troops say when they finally realize that this is the reason their loved ones were killed?
Posted by johannesrolf at 09/21/2007 @ 3:08pm
Posted by JOHANNESROLF 09/21/2007 @ 12:12pm
right. it's got a magnet.
the mike is half the beast.
and what is your profession?
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/21/2007 @ 5:08pm
The bottom line of this discussion is: was the General playing politics during his intervention in the Congress, or not? It is an axioma of democracy that whomever plays politics is subject to criticism. And making hyperboles and caricatures is common place in any democratic country (see by the way Britain and the royal family). It is part of the zeal of how the political sides defend their ideas. But watch out, one thing is giving names as this case was, another - pretty much more serious - is lying like the Kerry case was. Why did not President Bush stood on his feet that time and denounced the "swiftboat campaign"?
Why are we Americans so inclined to confuse patriotism with war? A man in uniform loves his country no doubt, but not necessarily that much more than a civilian. Loving a country is not just loving the land, the mountains and some icons like Statue of Liberty. Loving a country is first and foremost loving the people, therefore, the soldiers. For me, Ms. Sheehan is as much patriot as any one, because she has projected her immense grief for her lost, into a desperate attempt to save others from that fate. She is a real patriot but the right treats her much worse than what anyone said about General Petraeus.
Posted by Frank42 at 09/21/2007 @ 11:57pm
and what is your profession?
Posted by FROSTY ZOOM 09/21/2007 @ 5:08pm | ignore this person
I am a videographer, and have been for over 30 years. in the olden days we used an electrovoice mike that had no power. it was also so sturdy you could use it to hammer nails with it. if you forgot your headphones you could also listen to it, to check your sound. now I use mikes that are phantom powered by the camera, saving on buying batteries, and most of all running out of batteries. how 'bout you?
Posted by johannesrolf at 09/22/2007 @ 12:05pm
Frosty, I have consultd my audio engineer about the microphone issue. we are both right. it is a matter of language. a powered microphone does not amplify the signal, which is how amplification is commonly understood, as in power amplification. what the powered mike does is make it more sensitive. in this sense it "amplifies". the explanation was a lot more detailed, but I won't go into further detail.
Posted by johannesrolf at 09/22/2007 @ 12:52pm
and what is your profession?
Posted by FROSTY ZOOM 09/21/2007 @ 5:08pm | ignore this person
I am a videographer, and have been for over 30 years. in the olden days we used an electrovoice mike that had no power. it was also so sturdy you could use it to hammer nails with it. if you forgot your headphones you could also listen to it, to check your sound. now I use mikes that are phantom powered by the camera, saving on buying batteries, and most of all running out of batteries. how 'bout you?
Posted by JOHANNESROLF 09/22/2007 @ 12:05pm | ignore this person
Frosty, I have consultd my audio engineer about the microphone issue. we are both right. it is a matter of language. a powered microphone does not amplify the signal, which is how amplification is commonly understood, as in power amplification. what the powered mike does is make it more sensitive. in this sense it "amplifies". the explanation was a lot more detailed, but I won't go into further detail.
Posted by JOHANNESROLF 09/22/2007 @ 12:52pm | ignore this person
i'm a musician
i believe that is pre-amplification. my bass uses two nine-volts to send a more "controllable' signal to the amplifier.
electrons are cool.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/22/2007 @ 11:11pm