Buzzflash
del.icio.us
Digg
Facebook
Mixx it!
RedditAlaska Governor Sarah Palin says that she was "vindicated" by the report on her firing of Walter Monegan, the state's Public Safety Commissioner she removed after he refused to intervene on the governor's behalf to dismiss her brother-in-law as a state trooper.
"I'm very, very pleased to be cleared of any legal wrongdoing, any hint of any kind of unethical activity there. Very pleased to be cleared of any of that," Palin said after the Alaska Legislative Council released the 263-page report on the inquiry.
"If you read the report you'll see that there was nothing unlawful or unethical about replacing a cabinet member," she continued. "You gotta read the report."
Actually, if you read the report that the Republican-controlled Legislative Council unanimously approved for release, it says -- in the words of Stephen Branchflower, the veteran prosecutor who conducted the probe -- that:
Branchflower writes:
"I find that Governor Palin abused her power by violating Alaska Statute 39.52 110(a) of the Alaska Executive Branch Ethics Act. Alaska Statute 39.52 110(a) provides: The legislature affirms that each public officer holds office as a public trust, and any effort to benefit a personal or financial interest through official action is a violation of that trust."
So Palin is, um, well, lying.
But what kind of lie are we talking about here?
Alaska's largest newspaper, The Anchorage Daily News, says it's "Orwellian" in character.
The Daily News, a publication that has often (though not always) sided with the governor, and which has published the governor's columns over the years, is blunt in its dismissal of the "vindication" spin.
"Gov. Palin, read the report," the paper taunts. "It says you violated the ethics law."
Here's the full editorial from the Monday editions of the Daily News:
Palin vindicated? Governor offers Orwellian spin (10/13/08 22:02:58)Sarah Palin's reaction to the Legislature's Troopergate report is an embarrassment to Alaskans and the nation.
She claims the report "vindicates" her. She said that the investigation found "no unlawful or unethical activity on my part."
Her response is either astoundingly ignorant or downright Orwellian.
Page 8, Finding Number One of the report says: "I find that Governor Sarah Palin abused her power by violating Alaska Statute 39.52.110(a) of the Alaska Executive Branch Ethics Act."
In plain English, she did something "unlawful." She broke the state ethics law.
Perhaps Gov. Palin has been too busy to actually read the Troopergate report. Perhaps she is relying on briefings from McCain campaign spinmeisters.
That's the charitable interpretation.
Because if she had actually read it, she couldn't claim "vindication" with a straight face.
Palin asserted that the report found "there was no abuse of authority at all in trying to get Officer Wooten fired."
In fact, the report concluded that "impermissible pressure was placed on several subordinates in order to advance a personal agenda, to wit: to get Trooper Michael Wooten fired."
Palin's response is the kind of political "big lie" that George Orwell warned against. War is peace. Black is white. Up is down.
Gov. Palin and her camp trumpeted the report's second finding: that she was within her legal authority to fire Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan. But the report also said it's likely one of the reasons she fired him was his failure to get rid of her ex-brother-in-law trooper.
That's not "vindication," and surely Gov. Palin knows it.
Gov. Palin does have a defense. She could have said:
"I'm gratified that the report confirmed what I said all along, that I had the authority to terminate Walt Monegan as public safety commissioner.
"I absolutely disagree that I violated state ethics law. In repeatedly complaining about trooper Mike Wooten, Todd and I were not pursuing a personal vendetta. We were trying to protect the integrity of the Alaska State Troopers from having an arrogant, almost-out-of-control law-breaker in their ranks. Because the action we were seeking was in the public interest, not purely our personal interest, there is no ethics law violation."
Gov. Palin and her husband felt so passionately about Wooten because the case was so personal to them. Their passion blinded them to any other considerations.
They had no sense that the power of the governor's office carries a special responsibility not to use it to settle family scores. They had no sense that legal restrictions might prevent the troopers from firing Wooten. They had no sense that persistent queries from the governor's office might be perceived as pressure to bend state personnel laws.
Gov. Palin and her husband were obsessed with Wooten the way Capt. Ahab was obsessed with the Great White Whale. No Wooten, no peace.
Has Gov. Palin committed an impeachable offense? Hardly.
Is what she did indictable? No.
But it wasn't appropriate, especially for someone elected as an ethical reformer. And her Orwellian claims of "vindication" make this blemish on her record look even worse.
You asked us to hold you accountable, Gov. Palin. Did you mean it?
Bottom line: Gov. Palin, read the report. It says you violated the ethics law.
Share this article
- Atrios
- Arts and Letters Daily
- The Caucus
- Campus Progress
- Crooks and Liars
- The Daily Gotham
- Daily Kos
- Echidne of the Snakes
- Ezra Klein
- FAIR
- Feministe
- Feministing
- Firedoglake
- Glenn Greenwald
- Gothamist
- In these Times
- Hendrik Hertzberg
- Huffington Post
- Hullabaloo
- Matthew Yglesias
- Media Matters
- Mother Jones
- My DD
- New York Review of Books
- Openleft
- Pam's House Blend
- Pandagon
- Political Wire
- The Progressive
- RaceWire
- Real Clear Politics
- Roberto Lovato
- Romenesko
- Swing State Project
- Talking Points Memo
- Ta-Nehisi Coates
- Tapped
- Tech President
- Tompaine
- The Washington Note
- Utne Reader
- Wonkette
- ZNet
RSS
While I like the Orwellian reference I'm more direct and just say that she is a liar.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 1:41pm
This is a bizarre take on The Big Lie....
of course, Palin can MOMENTARILY get away with it, since she's still dodging the legitimate press and keeps going on GOP-friendly interviews.
But at this point, even McCain must be thinking "If I win, ASAP I dump this dingbat and see if I can form a unity government with Joe Lieberman as Veep!"
and Palin's thinking "They can't prosecute me once I'm 'Dick Cheney', can they?!?!?!?!"
LOL
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/14/2008 @ 1:42pm
Sorry, LL....
"getting even with your ex-brother-in-law" is seen as "personal".
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/14/2008 @ 1:43pm
lvliberty-As you know,this had to do with revenge and, as you know,this has nothing to do with Marxism and will not cause us to become a Marxist state.Lawyers,judges,politicians,police,etc cannot be allowed to use their power to get revenge..
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 1:45pm
She had no personal benefit therefore there was no violation of the statute.
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 1:41pm
Why do you insist that this is the case?
Like SP herself, you are flat out wrong.
Failure to derive a benefit because of the upstanding efforts on the part of Monegan doesn't me that Sally McNastier didn't try - through the actions of her husband - to exact vengence on behalf of her sister.
Won't hold my breath for a rejoinder as I think Luvvy has me on iggy.
Posted by skeletonman at 10/14/2008 @ 1:54pm
lvliberty will,always,excuse his side when they lie,commit adultery or anything else,but we all know that he would be on here calling Obama or Biden liars if the situation was reversed.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 2:08pm
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 2:08pm
Well, of course...if Palin were a non-entity (some GOP governor in Alaska) nobody had heard of...he'd ignore the thread.
If she was a DEMOCRAT!!!!!!, well, then it'd be "a pattern of abuse" "just like the Clintons and Travel-gate".
But as long as she's a fundy/evangey Christian right-winger (and only hope of stopping Obama and pulling McCain back to the Far Right)????
LL throws his "Christian morality" out the door for political expediency. Which shows how "deep" it really is.
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/14/2008 @ 2:36pm
Mask-You hit the nail on the head,as they say.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 2:38pm
lvliberty-Hopefully,you don't really believe the nonsense you just posted and believe that people in power can do what they want simply because they are in power.It is that attitude that would lead to a fascist or Marxist state and not the view that one should not use their power to get revenge..
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 2:48pm
lvliberty-You,also,claim to be for states rights,but want to interfere in a states right to pursue this and arrive at their own conclusions based on their own laws and views of ethics.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 2:52pm
Palin and the rest of the right: "I reject reality and substitute my own. Besides who are you going to believe me or your lying eyes?"
Posted by bascaville at 10/14/2008 @ 3:11pm
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 2:35pm
So lvl are you the judge in this case? I think not. The Republican controlled legislature found that she had abused her power and violated an Alaskan Statute. She was found guilty of an ethics violation. Plain and simple.
And then she lied about it in press releases. Simple as that. What you think about the case has no relevance. As do most of your posts.
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 3:18pm
lvliberty-Your employer/employee argument does not apply since Palin is not an employer,but is,in fact,an employee who was hired by the people of Alaska.They are the employers and not Palin.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 3:36pm
Employers must retain the right to fire for any reason-without cause. Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 2:41pm
37 States have an implied contract exception. Only 13 do not. So, in most states you cannot fire an employee for no cause whatsoever. There has to be "good cause" or the company could be held liable for breach of contract.
You must live in one of those "At Will" neanderthal states than can fire you because they don't like the color of your tie. So employers don't have the right to fire for any reason without cause in 37 states.
So why do you act like it's some sort of universal "Right to Fire?" Glad I don't work for you.
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 3:40pm
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 3:40pm
Even Alaska has a "Covenant of good faith and Fair dealing" as an exemption to "At-Will" employment.
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 3:45pm
lvliberty1, You are missing the point. Of course she can fire anyone. She must prove she did it in the best interest of the office she holds. That is where they find her guilty.
"any effort to benefit a personal or financial interest through official action is a violation of that trust."
Posted by throwin at 10/14/2008 @ 3:46pm
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 3:44pm
I was posting the opinion of the Alaska State Legislature. Man you are thick aren't you?
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 3:47pm
>>>Page 8, Finding Number One of the report says: "I find that Governor Sarah Palin abused her power by violating Alaska Statute 39.52.110(a) of the Alaska Executive Branch Ethics Act." <<<
She is obviously counting on most people not reading the report, and she is getting LOTS of help from the MSM that has essentially ignored the story.
Imagine if Joe Biden was found guilty of violating senate ethics rules? It would be front page news and looped on nightly news for at least a week.
She was given a pass, and that is scary considering she could be a heartbeat away from being President of the United States.
Posted by Metteyya at 10/14/2008 @ 3:48pm
lvliberty-You run from posts that contain facts you can't argue with in favor of posting more nonsense about Marxists.I realize that you condemned me to hell the other day and are ignoring me,but you are reading my posts and so I will continue to post at you.You,like Frankgrits,are a child who is who is having a tantrum and you need to grow up.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 3:50pm
So, true to your marxist beliefs, only those who agree with you are allowed to posit an opinion?
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 3:44pm
So, true to your nationalistic beliefs, only those who agree with you are allowed to posit an opinion?
Sounds like a hog calling a pig smelly when you put it that way, no?
Posted by skeletonman at 10/14/2008 @ 3:57pm
guys, didn't you know that lvliberty was a computer program? why waste your time?
Posted by Jason Rhodes at 10/14/2008 @ 4:11pm
redriver-The trooper was investigated and punished and in America that ends it.The Palin family knew about his acts,but said nothing until he dumped Palin's sister for another woman.The death threat thing was not proven even though the investigation concluded that he,probably,did it,but found that it was not in violation of the law and was something that someone said in anger.Cops ,frequently,stay on the job after doing such things.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 4:16pm
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 2:41pm
LVLIB...do you think God will judge you for lying with a "It's okay, Larry...as long as you TRIED to believe it, I don't count it as a lie"?
LOL
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/14/2008 @ 4:17pm
lvliberty ran away from facts,having his hypocrisy exposed,and dishonesty exposed,again.More death threats being spewed at a Adolph Palin rally.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 4:32pm
BTW, have you noticed the complete tangent the Defenders of St. Sarah want to take it.
One of the POINTS of the article was that Palin is saying "I was vindicated in the report"...
while the report CLEARLY said she violated the Alaska Exec. Branch Ethics Act....
ergo Palin is either totally stupid or lying. Which is it?
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/14/2008 @ 4:40pm
Yellow Dog Larry, the ethical issue where Palin crossed the line isn't the firing of Monegan, so, in the narrowest sense "If you read the report you'll see that there was nothing unlawful or unethical about replacing a cabinet member," she continued. The ethics issue is that she used her minions to put pressure on Monegan to fire Wooten.
Posted by nathanhale at 10/14/2008 @ 5:16pm
guys, didn't you know that lvliberty was a computer program? why waste your time?
Posted by Jason Rhodes at 10/14/2008 @ 4:11pm
I don't know about a computer program, but he sure plays the automaton well.
I almost feel sorry for him.
Posted by skeletonman at 10/14/2008 @ 5:49pm
Had Palin,simply,said that she disagreed with the findings and was going to appeal she would have been fine,but she did what she has a habit of doing and lied.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/14/2008 @ 6:50pm
The Neo Cons are becoming increasingly irrelevent. They are on the verge of getting their politically pompous asses whipped. A Democratic President and a Democratic House and Senate with a fillibuster proof majority.
They will have to run away and find a damp cave somewhere to hide in. Where they can plot to unleash more ruinous policies. Maybe Bin Laden would be willing to sublet them a cave or two..
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 7:18pm
And what are the chances that either Sarah or Todd know what 'Orwellian' means?
Posted by Prairiefire at 10/14/2008 @ 7:48pm
SARAH PALIN CONSORTED WITH A HEAVILY ARMED RIGHTWING SECCECIONIST MILITIA!
her HUSBAND was a member of this organization, which shares ideology and contect with other such rightwing organizations nationwide and THE OKLAHOMAH CITY BOMBERS!
members of the alaska independence party, which has given up electing folks under its own name, advocate slipping SLEEPER candidates under the banner of the republican party...a tactic shared with other such groups...
watch out, america! treasonous, tratorous, america haters of the right are attempting to RUIN OUR COUNTRY AND UNDERMINE OUR DEMOCRACY!!!
and once obama is elected...expect a return of the "turner diaries" style rightwing, christofascist terror campaign of the 90's which has been suspended for 8 short years only as a result of the fact that the "sleeper" candidate of all time, GEORGE W. BUSH, STOLE TWO ELECTIONS AND BACKDOOR COUPED HIMSELF INTO POWER...
next ruby ridge or waco i say declare the bastards in open, armed insurrection and drop a daisy cutter...
but perhaps it won't be as bad as the 90's after all... hell, thanks to the fascist repugnants we DO have the USA PATRIOT act...
Posted by dexter666 at 10/14/2008 @ 7:56pm
oklahoma, not oklahomah...lol
sarah palin regularly attended meetings of the ALASKA INDEPENDENCE PARTY, and allowed members of this HEAVILY ARMED RIGHTWING MILITIA GROUP access to her offices as mayor and governor...
one heartbeat away...
who IS this sarah palin?
Posted by dexter666 at 10/14/2008 @ 8:04pm
Posted by chaoszen at 10/14/2008 @ 7:18pm
Good one, bro. But I suspect it will be more like some shadowy financier's sumptuous yacht.
Posted by A_Pax_On_Your_Houses at 10/14/2008 @ 8:24pm
I have a personal definition of ethics that, for me anyway, trumps all the legal ones: If you give even the appearance of impropriety, that's sufficient cause to find you unethical.
Palibn did it in spades.
Posted by barnesgene at 10/14/2008 @ 9:01pm
There is something truly pitiful about the various winger blowhards that post on this site. I get that they provide good sport for Mask and others. I get that they think are defending a their vision of America against the threat of "liberal" thought. But I can't for the life of me understand what the point of the exercise is.
Dull thrusts, unintelligible ripostes and convoluted parries aside, what exactly do these people think they've achieved? Disrupting intelligent discussion of issues raised in The Nation among people who care about them; adding fuel to their already burning resentment of people who hold a different set of ideas than they; spewing bile and scorn on their political adversaries and swamping the site with post after ridiculous post.
Wow, what a life goal. What a toweringly insignificant and purposeless use of time. How overwhelming pitiful and small.
Can't hang with the Big Dogs on the right wing sites so come over to The Nation to urinate on some liberals. Now that should make anyone feel like a god.`
Posted by Demtothebone at 10/14/2008 @ 11:00pm
What I love is the argument that Obama is actually a puppet controlled by a bunch of radicals who have a secret plot to take over America...
If that sounds familiar it's because it's EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED with puppet W and the Cheney neocons over the past 8 years...
Posted by takemyveepplease at 10/14/2008 @ 11:13pm
Palin sounds like the sort of person who would seek to weaken the law of the land thru signing statements. Just what we need another adherent of rule by decree.
Posted by sdslaw at 10/14/2008 @ 11:35pm
Posted by Demtothebone at 10/14/2008 @ 11:00pm
Great analysis. You have a gift for writing. I guess there's some cathartic reward for both sides. Each round, the dems enjoy disabusing repubs of their delusions of logic. Repubs enjoy the chase, knowing they can always resort to the Marxist, socialist change and/or ad hominem.
I do personally learn a lot from the quality progressive posters. But you raise a good point, maybe we'd be better off without the predictable, base ping pong.
Posted by winyahn at 10/14/2008 @ 11:40pm
See, this is what happens when your Governor learned political theory and ethics from watching the Dukes of Hazzard.
Posted by koroviev at 10/15/2008 @ 12:40am
How dare they impugn Sarah Palin's ethics? She's against abortion, gay marraige and the teaching of evolution. What else do they want?
Posted by LocalCrank at 10/15/2008 @ 01:16am
So, true to your marxist beliefs, only those who agree with you are allowed to posit an opinion?
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 3:44pm
That's pretty funny, Larry, coming as it does from a guy who'd apparently like to set up his own Christian Taliban government. Because, as you're fond of telling us, Larry, Christians are oppressed here in America where they're just this tiny minority of the overall population and those bullying marxists (or do you really mean secular progressives) won't do as you insist they do. Larry, you wouldn't know a marxist if one came up to you and bit you on the ass.
Posted by jmusolino at 10/15/2008 @ 01:55am
Oh, and Larry, Rio, and the rest of you Palin fawners and assorted right wing types, I'll ask you this about Palin. What kind of utter slimebag uses her 7-year old daughter as a shield against booing by a crowd? What kind of utter lowlife continually throws her own kids under the bus for her own personal aggrandizement? The only question about Palin is whether her ignorance outpaces her personal corruption, or vice versa, or is she equally ignorant and corrupt. The fact that you can support such an utterly depraved excuse for a human being speaks greatly to your own lack of anything resembling values.
Posted by jmusolino at 10/15/2008 @ 02:01am
Did you see the news about Levi?
He's dropping out of high school! Way to go! Stick it to the mom-I mean THE MAN. (Maybe he'll get a GED though.)
He didn't register to vote! (Wow, imagine if McCain/Palin lose Alaska by JUST ONE VOTE. Now THAT would be AWE-SOME.)
Posted by takemyveepplease at 10/15/2008 @ 02:41am
A view from outside the US
Ready to lead the World's Greatest Superpower?
education:
Nicholas Sarkozy (Master in Private law, Doctorate in Business law from Université Paris X Nanterre)
Gordon Brown (First Class Honours MA and PhD in politics from the University of Edinburgh )
Angela Merkel (Doctoral degree in Quantum Chemistry, University of Leipzig)
Manmohan Singh (Master's degree from Panjab University, Undergraduate degree from Cambridge, Ph.D from Oxford, Honorary Doctorates in law from Universities of Alberta, Oxford , and Cambridge ,
Vladimir Putin (Masters in International Law, Leningrad, 15 years in the KGB)
Sarah Palin (BSc in communications-journalism, University of Idaho.)
No education, limited culture, no understanding of science, no understanding of international relations.
Posted by mikecope at 10/15/2008 @ 02:54am
Employers and Administrators must retain the right to terminate employees at will. Otherwise we become just another marxist state.
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 1:41pm
Liv, You're a bigger asshole than I thought. So, employers should be able to terminate workers at will?! What kind of bullshit is this.
So, say I hire you and then find out you are a neocon and can't stand neocons, so I fire your ass. Would that be fine by you? That's basically what the Bush administration did with it's DOJ attorney and is now being investigated for politizing the DOJ.
Being an employer doesn't make you God Liver. Some Christian you are rev larry.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 10/15/2008 @ 04:23am
LvLiberty, please read the statute that Gov. Palin has been accused of violating.
"The legislature affirms that each public officer holds office as a public trust, and any effort to benefit a personal or financial interest through official action is a violation of that trust."
Notice that statute does NOT state that one MUST actually receive a personal benefit. The language reads that one violates the law if one makes an EFFORT to benefit personally.
So, your argument that Gov. Palin did not receive the benefit of Wooten actually being fired and therefore is free of guilt, is wrong.
Gov. Palin and her husband(who exerted pressure through the Gov's office) did make the EFFORT to benefit personally by attempting to get Wooten fired.
Posted by intothewild76 at 10/15/2008 @ 08:08am
Posted by intothewild76 at 10/15/2008 @ 08:08am
Into, trying to destroy your ex-brother-in-law SOMEHOW isn't "personal" to these guys.
I guess if Palin had made money off of it, they'd consider it personal. But using high office to settle grudges and get revenge apparently is "governmental policy" and no ethics violation!
LOL
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/15/2008 @ 09:10am
A view from outside the US
Ready to lead the World's Greatest Superpower?
education:
Nicholas Sarkozy (Master in Private law, Doctorate in Business law from Université Paris X Nanterre)
Gordon Brown (First Class Honours MA and PhD in politics from the University of Edinburgh
etc., etc.
Posted by mikecope at 10/15/2008 @ 02:54am
Exactly what I'm sure a lot of discerning Americans of the same ilk as myself & my husband have been talking about! What is with these voters saying that they want the President and VP of the U.S.A. to be "just like us"!!!!! We should've had it demonstrably drilled into our spinning heads by now that the example of the past soon-to-be 8 yrs. of W ruling from his gilded throne...that you just don't "want" the leader of the free world or his VP to be "just like us". The world has been laughing at us! Now...let's recall what Obama's credentials are. And Joe Biden's not exactly a slouch; he's an intelligent man. Now THAT'S what I'm talking about!!! Without being heavily prepped, Palin can't spout out anything intelligible! Forget honest! I'm afraid I agree with Prariefire's post; upon reading it, my automatic reflex was, "ouch!": And what are the chances that either Sarah or Todd know what 'Orwellian' means? (Posted by Prairiefire at 10/14/2008 @ 7:48pm)
Posted by TxMom at 10/15/2008 @ 09:20am
Typical Republican spinmeister! If you don't like the report write your own version to it! I will call it what it is...a out and out lie! It doesn't take much imagination to figure out she will more than fill Dick Cheney's shoes if elected. Then her brother-in-law had better look out!
Posted by ganddw42 at 10/15/2008 @ 09:49am
What LVL seems to not realize is that, executives of state are not employers. They are employees. When they take the job they pledge to uphold the public trust. Which means not using politics for personal gaining including firing a very well respected government employee because they refuse to allow you to take out revenge on your sisters ex-husband. THAT is a breaking of public trust. She ATTEMPTED to benefit personally from the firing of Wooten by getting him of the way for NOT allowing her to benefit personally from firing he sisters ex-husband. Politicians should not use their powers to carry out personal vendettas. THAT is not what they are hired for. They are not executives, they are not employers, they are employees hired by the public to carry out the public interest far above their own.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 10/15/2008 @ 09:54am
This is a bizarre take on The Big Lie....
of course, Palin can MOMENTARILY get away with it, since she's still dodging the legitimate press and keeps going on GOP-friendly interviews.
Like Rush Limbaugh FOX...
Posted by boing007 at 10/15/2008 @ 10:14am
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 10/15/2008 @ 09:54am
CCC, you've got to remember that LVLIB is basically an authoritarian with democratic "flourishes".
In his mind, once somebody is elected to executive office...they are "the leader" and responsible to nobody and nothing until the next election (if then).
To him, Palin got elected...therefore she can do whatever she wants and is accountable to no one until the next election.
Throw in the Right's natural tendency to view EVERYTHING as a "business"...
and you have his "thinking" on how "an employer should be able to fire anybody they want, no questions!"
Posted by Maskdelta at 10/15/2008 @ 10:15am
Palin and the rest of the right: "I reject reality and substitute my own.
Didn't I hear that remark on Mythbusters?
Posted by boing007 at 10/15/2008 @ 10:16am
And what are the chances that either Sarah or Todd know what 'Orwellian' means?
Posted by Prairiefire at 10/14/2008 @ 7:48pm | ignore this person | warn this person
ROTLMAO....they probably banned "1984" in Wasilla...
Posted by graywolf765 at 10/15/2008 @ 10:23am
It seems be a great deal of discontent aired at poor rev. larry regarding his Christian beliefs. HE IS NOT A CHRISTIAN!!!! He is a pseudo-christian. This species tends to use the Bible as a political tool for material gain. They mire the teachings of Christ by inserting them into the political arena. They think that material gain is Gods gift to them. They belive that children killed in war a collateral damage. They don't belive in a womans right to choose but turn their heads when hundreds if not thousands of women in Iraq lost their babies due to exposure to DU munitions. All you have to do is look at the teachings of Christ and you will see that they do not follow them!
Posted by Truthman at 10/15/2008 @ 10:30am
Posted by Truthman at 10/15/2008 @ 10:30am
Oh, fella, you done opened one heckuva can of worms.
I agree that certain posters here fall into the category of CHINO (CHristians In Name Only) but I'm thinking that Rev. Larry will be unhappy with you.
Posted by skeletonman at 10/15/2008 @ 10:47am
Posted by boing007 at 10/15/2008 @ 10:16am
LOL .. Actually its "I reject your reality..." but funny and appropriate nonetheless
Posted by TxMom at 10/15/2008 @ 09:20am
EXACTLY .. I heard some morning comedian a while back saying just this .. along the lines of "Why would I want someone like me to be POTUS when I KNOW I'm not smart enough to do it? I want someone so smart in the WH that it makes me feel bad about myself when I think about it..."
Posted by leftofcenter at 10/15/2008 @ 10:50am
marx was closer to jesus than you'll ever be....
Posted by frosty zoom at 10/15/2008 @ 11:18am
lvliberty-Your thing about marxist/union mentality makes no sense nor does the personal responsibility thing since you advocate firing people who earned their jobs,are good at their jobs,but are fired on a whim.You,as always, ignore facts like Palin isn't an employer and your posts about employer/employee relations is irrelevant.As always, you quote the constitution when it backs your views,but ignore it when it doesn't.Alaska has the right to pursue this and arrive at their own conclusions and you have no right to interfere.You may now run from this and post more paranoid nonsense about Marxists.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/15/2008 @ 11:22am
lvliberty-get back to us when you stop your hypocrisy by ignoring Palin's lying and not repenting of it and when you do the same.Most on the right have never read the Bible and know nothing about it.You may now run away from this post and post more nonsense about Marxists and how you are perfect.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/15/2008 @ 11:25am
no way.
marx -- help people.
jesus -- help people.
larry -- cluster bombs and d.u.
hmmmm?
Posted by frosty zoom at 10/15/2008 @ 11:35am
lvliberty-It is you who ignores those teachings of Jesus that don't back your views like that pesky one that tells you to stop judging and condemning others.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/15/2008 @ 11:42am
Wooten is still a State Trooper and thus, I repeat, Gov Palin has received no personal or financial benefit from the case.
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/14/2008 @ 2:35pm
Are you asserting only monetary gains count?
"I only tried to kill him, your honor. You can plainly see he's still walking. What do you mean my attempts are illegal? I didn't get my benefit!!"
You get dafter by the post.
Posted by Malcontent at 10/15/2008 @ 11:44am
malcontent-If Palin was a democrat he'd have a different view.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/15/2008 @ 11:47am
The idea of a guaranteed job is ludicrous.
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/15/2008 @ 11:13am
I don't feel that I am "guaranteed" a job, but I certainly wouldn't want to fired because my boss was having a bad day and decided to give me my walking papers. That's a load of hooey!
Posted by graywolf765 at 10/15/2008 @ 11:57am
I don't think you would know Christ's teachings other than a narrow snippet from the Sermon on the Mount if you read it Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/15/2008 @ 11:20am
I am afraid you are wrong rev. I first read the Bible when I was a child, close to 50 years ago. I have read a few differant versions other that KJ. So nice try. I have also studied other world religions and their mystical components. The reason there are so many Christian denominations, all believing only they are correct, is because the mind set of the reader will determine how what is read is interpretated. So the materialist will see it as materialistic.
I am disappointed to hear that you work with children. I hope you don't "share" your right wing views with them.
I treat and have treated sooo many people of all ages who have been damaged in early life by preachers cramming their minds with fear and hate. You have no idea what these people have done! Each time you present a post you further support what I stated in my last post. I suppose your mind set tells you that you are right. How sad you are, and exposed to children!
Posted by Truthman at 10/15/2008 @ 12:04pm
lvliberty-Like with the constitution,you quote the Bible when it suits your purposes and ignore it when it doesn't so I will quote the Bible for you.-"Revenge is mine saith the Lord".What that means is that Palin was wrong to try to get revenge and has not repented.
Posted by i'm nobody at 10/15/2008 @ 12:09pm
For those that cling to the "Palin had the right to fire here department heads, so no ethical violations occured" I hope you can follow the following dumbed down analysis.
Palin's violations were not firing her Public Safety Director, but using the power of her office to try and violate civil service regulations. Because she ran into someone who understood the regulations and refused to violate them she shot the messenger. That she had the right to shoot the messenger is undisputed. What will happen next is up to the politicians and citizens of Alaska.
The larger problem that the defenders of Palin need to understand is that this incident demonstrates that she doesn't understand the way the civil service works and has no desire to learn about it. The other possibility is that she understands the rules but feels they don't apply to her. Neither option is attractive and should give pause to her defenders.
Posted by bobf1259 at 10/15/2008 @ 12:12pm
Posted by lvliberty1 at 10/15/2008 @ 11:20am
"You certainly are right that I don't believe that a woman has the right to murder her own child."
Yea! Yea! That's the military's job. Aerial bombing anyone? D.U.?
In spite of your visceral hatred of non-xtians, I hope "one day you actually find the real Jesus, not the make believe one that you and others who deny Him, make Him out to be." (Like the jesus in my bible. Maybe your bible is full of typos?)
Eric
Posted by Malcontent at 10/15/2008 @ 12:13pm
Posted by Demtothebone at 10/14/2008 @ 11:00pm
The point to them being here is answered by Orwell:
Then the sheep broke out into a tremendous bleating of "Four legs good, two legs bad!" which went on for nearly a quarter of an hour and put an end to any chance of discussion. page 47 of Animal Farm by George Orwell from Google Book Search
The trolls are there to bleat. They waste your time and they make it unpalatable for some to try and engage in discussion. The crowd the internet with garbage to make it more difficult to find goo ideas. The less people discuss the world and possible alternatives, the happier the powers that send these trolls become. They serve a serious and direct threat. This is why its good to use sites such as DailyKos where trolls are not tolerated. Read 'The Nation' and please pay for it, but just ignore the trolls. As soon as you have spent one iota of time with them, they have won.
Posted by tranenturm at 10/15/2008 @ 5:07pm
lvliberty: I certainly am acquainted with Jesus' role as the Judge of the world. Check out St. Matthew 25 (or 26; I don't have a Bible handy) and ask yourself how many hungry people you've fed or imprisoned people you've visited, or strangers you've welcomed to this land. The parable in St. Luke about Lazarus and the rich man is also fairly direct. St. James challenged us to join faith and good works, for each one alone is dead without the other. But I think there is still hope for you, brother, and so I wish you peace.
Posted by The Goods at 10/15/2008 @ 6:17pm
lvliberty: you are right, in the narrow sense that the positional authority of 'governor of Alaska' should have the authority to hire and fire her department heads for almost any reason. You are right, Governor Stepford Palin was 'right' when she fired Monegan.
Can you give us your opinion on what kind of work atmosphere Governor Palin instilled in public employees? Governor Palin may have been within her rights to fire Monegan but she was NOT within her rights to fire Trooper Wooten. She was not within her rights to pressure public employees with integrity to do something illegal, which, in this case, would have been to fire Wooten. Palin understood, I believe, that she had positional authority as governor. She attempted to use that positional authority to browbeat good, honest people into doing something she could not do. And then, in what sure sounds like an immature hissy fit to me, she had a tantrum and fired Monegan. . . she fired Monegan because she was having a tantrum, like a two year old. I bet she would have fired all of the employees who refused to fire Wooten if she could have.
Do you seriously believe, lvliberty, that society benefits from having leaders willing to abuse their positional authority for personal vendetta?
The American people are forgiving. I don't think anyone is actually all that 'down' on Palin over firing Monegan. This kind of thing happens. What upsets people is the way she obsfucates, the way she hides from the truth.
If she would say "Well, I am a rookie governor, I overstepped on this issue, it won't happen again". . . I think people would forget about it.
Her smarmy 'black is white' is what creeps people out.
Posted by Tree_Fitz at 10/15/2008 @ 8:45pm
Actually, an employer can't just summarily fire someone without having properly documented the employee's violations of company policy. Otherwise, they could be dragged into court. You can't fire someone because you don't like them or their politics.
You see, ll, those in authority, at least in a free republic, can't just do what they please to their subordinates; that's called Facism. In that "system", scare tactics are the motivator to get the populace to comply. Who has been using these tactics the last several years? Who continues to do so?
America is better than that and enlightened voters will likely choose lack of experience over a ticket that isn't fit to lead, especially now.
To Sgt Ian McDougal, War Eagles: WELCOME HOME!! Well Done and Thank You!
Posted by matster at 10/19/2008 @ 10:04am