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RedditOn Meet the Press on Sunday, Hillary Clinton said her campaign had nothing to do with a lawsuit--written about by Nation Editor Katrina vanden Heuvel--that threatens to prevent thousands of workers from voting in the Nevada caucus on Saturday.
Back in March, the Nevada Democratic Party agreed to set up caucus locations on the Vegas strip for low-income shift workers, many of them members of the state's influential Culinary Union, who commute long distances to work and wouldn't be able to get home in time to caucus. It was an uncontroversial idea until the Culinary Union endorsed Barack Obama and the Nevada State Education Association, whose top officials support Clinton, sued to shut down the caucus sites. The Clinton camp played dumb until yesterday, when President Clinton came out in favor of the lawsuit.
Clinton's comments drew a heated response from D. Taylor, the head of Nevada's Culinary Union, on MSNBC's Hardball. "He is in support of disenfranchising thousands upon thousands of workers, not even just our members," Taylor said of Clinton. "The teachers union is just being used here. We understand that. This is the Clinton campaign. They tried to disenfranchise students in Iowa. Now they're trying to disenfranchise people here in Nevada, who are union members and people of color and women."
Rank-and-file members of Nevada's teachers union also come out against the lawsuit filed by their leadership. "We never thought our union and Senator Clinton would put politics ahead of what's right for our students, but that's exactly what they're doing," the letter stated. "As teachers, and proud Democrats, we hope they will drop this undemocratic lawsuit and help all Nevadans caucus, no matter which candidate they support."
The lawsuit's opponents make a persuasive point. Creating obstacles to voting is what the GOP does to Democrats, not what Democrats should be doing to other Democrats.
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The Hill and Bill show are on a roll.
Let's hope they keep it up and solidify their reputation as slimy political operators. Then progressives can hopefully breath a sigh of relief and chant in unison, "Good riddance to bad rubbish", around say, February 5th.
Posted by b_kool_66 at 01/15/2008 @ 11:47am
Just say no to anyone named Bush or Clinton.Now that Bush 1 and Clinton 1 have gotten together we can view this as one family rule called the Bush-Clinton family.
Posted by i'm nobody at 01/15/2008 @ 11:47am
Posted by I'M NOBODY 01/15/2008 @ 11:47am
got JEB on your radar?
chelsea?
BWAHAHAHAHAHA
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/15/2008 @ 11:50am
No w we see Hillary's TRUE COLORS: a closet dictator in the making!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 11:51am
Just to save time...here's FRANKGRITS' response---
"Hey, it's working. The idea is to get elected."----Posted by FRANKGRITS 11/02/2007 @ 12:20pm
CRITICIZE HILLARY: YOU'RE SEXIST!----Posted by Ari Berman at 11/02/2007 @ 11:53am
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 11:52am
Frosty-I think Jeb is supposed to follow Hillary,but unsure about Chelsea.Good thing that Bush2 and the Clintons had daughters otherwise they'd inter marry and breed future family rulers of America.
Posted by i'm nobody at 01/15/2008 @ 11:53am
Has there been a decision in this lawsuit, anyone know?
Posted by Lit at 01/15/2008 @ 12:03pm
After Hill is Jeb. Then Chelsea then George P
Posted by kenburnsidelj at 01/15/2008 @ 12:04pm
Posted by I'M NOBODY 01/15/2008 @ 11:53am
THEY will have legalized cloning by then.
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/15/2008 @ 12:33pm
Frosty-We must get Jeb elected or Bush1 will cry,again.Crying is the new way for the Bush-Clinton family to get votes.
Posted by i'm nobody at 01/15/2008 @ 12:43pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 12:24pm
Why wasn't this "fairness" issue brought up some time ago when the issue was ripe?
Why wait until you FAIL to get the union's endorsement?
Come on, FRANKGRITS, you guys are coming up with one lame excuse after another, in which "winning" is more important than the democratic process.
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 12:52pm
Frank, this is disgraceful and you should admit it, even if you continue to support Clinton. This is not just for one union but for all sorts of low-wage shift workers who can't take time off from work to go to their neighborhood caucuses. Also, who says that illegal immigrants would be allowed to participate in the caucuses, anyway? Talk about a bait and switch worthy of Lou Dobbs or Rush Limbaugh!
Posted by cka2nd at 01/15/2008 @ 1:05pm
Couple of thoughts:
If this is a tactic by the Clinton campaign then
(1) This type of tactic may have worked during Bill Clinton's years of campaigning, when the voters (us) weren't so keen on following closely what was going on; or
(2) Hillary's campaign isn't as "slick" as Bill's. His was more saavy whereas Hillary's is more bungling; or
(3) [Insert thought]
You have to admit this looks pretty damning especially coming on the tail end of a union endorsement for Obama. Wasn't an issue before (or maybe it was and was unreported?) but it is now.
Interesting.
Posted by FritztheCat at 01/15/2008 @ 1:17pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 12:21pm
Haha I love the immigrants thing thats hilarity. What is it with people in this country always using the illegals to try and prop up a worthless argument. I would like to see what Hillary's people would have done had the union not given it's support to Obama but had given it to her. I'm sure they would be singing a much different tune. And I think that Hillary's people maybe not her but definitely he people are the ones who convinced the teachers union lodge this complaint considering many teachers are coming out against it too. This is a political move. If you have ever been to Vegas you would know that most of the people who work on the strip have to commute there for long distances in bad traffic. So are you saying that everyone who works on the strip doesn't deserve the right to vote? I think if your job is interfering with your ability to vote then yes we should provide places for people who can't make it to their neighborhoods to vote. However don't even try to lodge the argument well they aren't doing it for other people so why should the people on the strip get it. That sounds like "WELL TOMMY GOT A NEW BIKE SO I WANT ONE TOO."
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 1:19pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 12:24pm
WAS it "out of context", FRANK?
I mean if you're going to start claiming that those Culinary Union members are mostly a bunch of illegal immigrants...
pretty apparent that the ONLY thing you really care about is "Hey, it's working. The idea is to get elected!"
BTW, again, note that Her Majesty sends out her minions (or serfs) to start talking about "illegal immigrants working in those casinos trying to vote".
Of course she wouldn't say such a thing...leave it to her cultists to sound like....REPUBLICANS!
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 1:24pm
Posted by FRITZTHECAT 01/15/2008 @ 1:17pm
The hypocrisy of the Hillary guys (and gals...don't want to leave out HELENDAO) is rapidly approaching critical mass.
To garner a win for Her Majesty, they are playing down MLK, referencing Obama's "doing other stuff" (i.e. drugs), calling Obama a "mulatto", and trying to play the "illegal immigrant" card on the voting of Culinary Union members in Las Vegas.
Their thinking, of course, is that "Oh, we'll make it up to the blacks and Latinos LATER, after She-Who-Must-Be-Obeyed gets the nomination!" and "And the Repubs won't be able to use any of this stuff against us in the General Election...won't stick with OUR voters! And if it does...we'll blame Obama for mentioning it and turn it around on him!"
With FG in the lead, you'll see over the next few weeks (til Super Duper Tuesday, Feb 5th)...they really will have NO shame whatsoever.
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 1:29pm
What's really interesting, is that it isn't Hillary herself saying or doing these things. It's her supporters. Now, can she really have that much control over all those people? In truth, probably not. Some people like to be talking heads and drift away from the campaign script. Humans tend to do that. Okay, maybe that's the truth of the matter - but I doubt it.
On the other hand, and here's the interesting part, is that you don't see the same sort of tactics coming from Obama supporters. There's plenty of fodder on the Clinton's to wage negative assaults on. Wonder why you don't see that? The only time I've seen Obama stray off the "issues" path is in response to something negative coming from the Clinton camp.
She needs to clean up her campaign. Seriously. She's got plenty of positives to run on. Stick to the issues and stop playing this one-up-manship game. Sadly, her track record thus far says she isn't going to do that.
Posted by FritztheCat at 01/15/2008 @ 1:43pm
She needs to clean up her campaign.----Posted by FRITZTHECAT 01/15/2008 @ 1:43pm
"clean it up"? You think this is a dialectic and "Her supporters are pushing her towards dirty campaigning" and she's merely responding to their demands?
Nuh-huh....this is from the top down (as all authoritarianism is...and if you can't see the authoritarian-follower mentality of FRANK, you're not paying attention).
She keeps her hands clean...but Lady MacBeth is upto her eyeballs in pushing the race card stuff, the drug use stuff, and the newest thing for Vegas..."illegal immigrants getting to vote".
Sure as Sidney Blumenthal shouldn't be your designated driver!
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 2:16pm
Posted by MASK 01/15/2008 @ 2:16pm
I totally agree. I wouldn't go so far as to say she sent down the order to the teachers union to lodge this law-suit but I don't think they thought this one up on their own. I think someone in the campaign pushed the leaders of the teachers union to do this. Like mentioned in the article participants in the teachers union are coming out against this too.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 2:20pm
Posted by MASK 01/15/2008 @ 2:16pm
Well, that's kind of what I was getting at, in a round about way. I guess we'll see what the voters think. If she loses in NV (that would be Nevada, not Obama's senate voting record) and SC, then I would say that's a sure sign that the voters think she's playing dirty pool.
Posted by FritztheCat at 01/15/2008 @ 2:29pm
Hillary learned her politics from the master---Bill. However, while Bill and Hillary are master politicians they have no real core convictions---their view points sway with the political winds. In fact, both are experts on revisionist history so that they can't even be held accountable for the decisions that the do make. I am not an supporter of any democrat, but please dems, no more Clinton's ---PLEASE!
Posted by Len Mosse at 01/15/2008 @ 2:41pm
Posted by CCCOMFO1 01/15/2008 @ 2:20pm
Union leadership and a disconnect from the rank-n-file is an old story.
Posted by FRITZTHECAT 01/15/2008 @ 2:29pm
"NV" for Nevada and Not Voting. Pretty good double slam on both Her Nibs AND Obama....LOL!
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 3:00pm
Rio-You live in a wonderful partisan fantasy world.
Posted by i'm nobody at 01/15/2008 @ 3:21pm
Posted by I'M NOBODY 01/15/2008 @ 3:21pm
Poor ol' guy sees what's coming. He gets four, possibly EIGHT years of whining, insulting, flailing his arms, and spitting venom with no real impact on any KIND of discussion or debate.
President Hillary or President Obama sneezes...ol' RIO will be posting "Ha! Them Demoncrats and their secular regressive health care ain't fixing Satan's favorite daughter/son's sniffles is it?"
and pat himself on the back for "Showing them lib'ruls a thing or two!"
Sad really, if you're kind-hearted enough....which I'm not....heheh
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 3:43pm
Posted by RIO BRAVO 01/15/2008 @ 3:18pm
Instead we need Giuliana who has declared outright racist statements against Muslims. Greeaattt
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 3:43pm
I'm really disappointed at the level of intellengence on this site. Or rather the lack of it.----Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 3:42pm
No FRANK, we've all figured it out. Hillary wants the members of the union that endorsed her opponent to not be able to vote...period.
If she had won the Culinary Union's endorsement, she'd be all for casino polling and EVERYBODY knows it.
I HOPE that you, in your heart of hearts, knows it too. If you don't, you truly are approaching a level of cult of personality concerning this woman and that NEVER ends well!
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 3:46pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 3:42pm
And I guarantee you Obama would be getting railed against if he had done it too. I'm saddened by the lack of intelligence in your arguments. You're basically saying yes politics should be all about mud slinging and who is willing to go as low as possible. Even if that means disenfranchising voters. Great. I bring up the point again that the teacher right now technically by their own argument have an unfair advantage because of most of the caucusing is done at schools. So by their argument we should remove caucuses from any workplace including schools. How about we put them on the edge of town equidistant from all workers so everyone has to commute an hour to vote. That makes sense right? The teachers have nothing to complain about caucusing is conducive to their work hours and their places of work. So this is entirely political and since politicians disgust me I am not one to sit by and let them use slimy tactics to win. Hillary has displayed herself as one to jump at slimy tactics.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 3:50pm
All the Clinton people are saying is that either caucusing is available to all workers or none of them.
Why not AS MANY WORKERS AS POSSIBLE, rather than NONE OF THEM?
FRANKGRITS,
You didn't answer the question as to why this "fairness argument" is being made at the last minute rather than a year ago when this was debated and public comment sought?
You know that the answer is a year ago Hillary thought she was inevitable and therefore would get the Culinary Workers Union endorsement; but now that is goes to Obama, we hear a fairness argument at the last minute to try to disenfranchise workers that Hillary thinks will go for Obama.
Well if they were for Obama already, this latest Hillary gaffe will ensure that they vote for Obama now!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 3:57pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:01pm
No you said that either its available for all workers or none of them and my argument is that the teachers are making it easy for themselves to vote and harder for other workers to. So in your line of argument and the teachers they should take it out of schools and make it hard to access for everyone.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 4:03pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:05pm |
They ...aren't doing it, are they, FRANKG?
Their surrogates in NV are.
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 4:08pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:05pm
Considering they have repeatedly shot themselves in the foot with their comments I am going to go ahead and say possibly.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 4:08pm
Unless of course republicans were running the show.
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:07pm
Because only Republicans would say something like "And are you aware that approximately 45% of the culinary workers in the casinos are illegal immigrants?"
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 4:09pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:09pm
No I just think they thought this suit would be a jump shot. If the culinary workers can't vote this move wouldn't hurt her. But if she loses the law suit it will. This is a gamble one which I hope she will lose. You are glossing over the fact that if she wins this suit whether she alienates the culinary workers doesn't matter because they won't be able to vote anyways. So I think she is willing to take the chance.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 4:12pm
Fool, FRANK?....like the guy who said-
"MASK, You don't understand. Joe Lieberman couldn't even be elected as dog catcher in conn. no matter which party he chooses."
Posted by ___(guess who)_____ 08/04/2006 @ 4:34pm
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 4:12pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:09pm
Besides she already was lacking in their vote. So she is only losing a few votes by alienating the rest if she loses. She really doesn't stand to lose much here if she doesn't win this suit.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 4:14pm
So you figure that the Clinton people are too stupid to understand that if they really did this to try to exclude culinary workers that it would make things worse for them. Do you really think that the Clinton people are that stupid?
Yes, they are THAT stupid!
The same advisers who told her it was OK to use MLK to try to denigrate Obama's oratory skills are at it again!
You guys have overpaid IDIOTS that only know how to run a divisive campaign against Karl Rove! If you are forced to run a straight-up campaign, you fall flat on your noses!
Did it ever occur to you folks that a "significant" percentage of Nevada voters who CAN make it to the carcases on Saturday will be completely turned off by Hillary's latest stunt and vote against her in-mass?
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 4:16pm
Mask-I just wish Rio would figure out that Republican politicians do the same things that Democratic politicians do.He is so naive and trusting of those who tell him what he wants to hear.One thing I liked about rednecks in Montana was that they trusted no one in politics that they did not personally know and were even a bit suspicious of them.That was a great place because the outside world mattered little.I'm,actually, a tiny government person who prefers places like Montana or Alaska where things are taken care of locally and the emphasis is on local politics and where laws are few and not strictly enforced unless violence is involved.
Posted by i'm nobody at 01/15/2008 @ 4:17pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:22pm
FRANKGRITS,
Your world of "dirty tricks" politics is about to come crashing down on your head!
Remember, it is like Obama said - no matter how much "experience" you have, if you continue to exercise "poor judgment" then you can not lead America!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 4:26pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:22pm
You never answered to my comment frank. Hillary stands to gain more than she stands to lose in this move so why would it be unintelligent for her to make it?
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 4:30pm
Posted by I'M NOBODY 01/15/2008 @ 4:17pm
RIO is first and foremost a liar. He claims he's an "independent", while he's probably voted 8 times out of a 100 in 40 years for a Democrat.
But mostly he's just flailing away...flinging poo like a trapped chimp. And in the end, making himself a laughingstock to the Left and Center....and embarassment to the Right.
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 4:30pm
I hope nobody asks me any questions tonight between the hours of 9 to 11 est. My nose will be glued to the tube.----Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 4:24pm
Why?
You already know that "Hillary mopped the floor with those other guys" is going to happen....you expect anything different?
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 4:31pm
Personally, I think the whole system of caucusing is past it's time and is blatently unfair. People's votes are affected by peer pressure that doesn't exist in the privacy of the voting booth.
FRANK, I can agree with you on this. Caucusing does seem a bit outdated. I can see some of the benefits of it but in all in all, I think a private voting booth is better.
Posted by FritztheCat at 01/15/2008 @ 5:16pm
"OBAMA PORTRAIT MUSIC VIDEO" on Youtube - Don't Miss It!
For those of you who still have not heard:
There is a WONDERFUL and INSPIRING music video on Youtube.com entitled "Obama Portrait Music Video by Bjarne O." You can use the free downloaded high-quality stereo version from the composer's website in DVD form to show at house parties and fundraisers. Even people who knew nothing at all about Obama have been moved: either a thrilling introduction, or further inspiration for those of us who already know and fight for Obama. The music soundtrack, which incorporates excerpts from the famous 2004 speech, can also be downloaded separately in high-quality.
It is an uplifting and informative campaign tool - so please, SPREAD THE WORD!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=mCPwbozpIzM
YES WE CAN
Anne
Posted by annevilla at 01/15/2008 @ 5:41pm
Posted by CCCOMFO1 01/15/2008 @ 4:30pm
Is that why every comment Obama makes about Hillary is construed as sexist?
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 6:00pm
Name one candidate who hasn't played tough and got elected?
What about Jimmy Carter?
But rather than look "backward', why don't you guys look FORWARD and see what kind of politics is possible if you chart your own course?
This is why Hillary is losing in the "politics of change" debate. Most voters understand that if they want to break with the politics of the past, they must break with the Clintons!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 6:35pm
The Clintons brought the Democratic party to the right. It is time they are run out of politics. Let them do their good work outside of government. We must take the party back to its bread and butter issues and get corporations out of the mix. Obama is no poster child for the Democrats either. A lot of huff and puff about change but talk is big and reality a hard fight for equal justice for all. Wish that Edwards would surge
Posted by Chhabili at 01/15/2008 @ 7:32pm
As a first time poster and long time progressive and supporter of The Nation to seeing the posts here of bile ridden infantile posters who are so Rove filled with GOP hate memes probably will cause me not to renew my Nation subscrition. This uber liberal purist stance is sickening considering how The Nation has not even vetted Obama,[ a serious lightweight] in any way.
His ties to the corrupt Pritzker Chicago machine have been overlooked, his real estate deal that is suffused with greed and deception with Tony Rezko [now federally indicted],enriched him in a backyard land deal that allowed corrupt fundraiser Rezko to transfer his part of $300,00 of land to Obama for personal use for $165,000. Fitgerald [ yes, Libby] was investigating Rezko for part of $6 million kickbacks], did not deter Obama. Rezko and he were neighbors.
He closed with Rita Rezko for the transfer of Rezko land to his for $165,00. A nice kickback for Obama. Then,Obama had to return $11,500 of $60.000 Rezko had fundraised. Rezko has currently been indicted for fraud. Penny Pritzker of the Chicao billionaire machine is Obama's fianance director. There's so much more I cannot express re: my disappointment with The Nation as to the trashing of Hillary and the deliberate avoidance of the truth behind Obama's connections and donors along with his lackluster performance in Illinois as part time senator and a do nothing senator for US Senate. As a long time progressive I find the hatred, bias, and unwillingness to dig for and find the truth appalling.
The uber purism combined with blind hatred and the pile on of sexism does not promis hope or change.
Posted by morris1030 at 01/15/2008 @ 7:51pm
Posted by MORRIS1030 01/15/2008 @ 7:51pm
So are you then contending that we should vote for Hillary even though she hasn't had much more of a record than Obama? And again why is it sexist to criticize Hillary but not racist to criticize Obama. I don't get it, anyone who criticizes Hillary is racist but anyone who criticizes Obama is fine. Also Morris you stilll aren't looking at the question at hand about how she is suppressing peoples right to vote in order to win. I don't thank that's such a good trait. On top of the fact that she is taking money from corporate interest groups, indebting her to them, she has a proponent and longtime employee of Black Water USA working as her advisor and hasn't really done anything noteworthy for this country.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 8:02pm
The Clintons stink -- after all he has been a sleazeball all his life. She reminds me of Benazir Bhutto -- "Chairperson for Life" of the party >> so dont run across either one --
Posted by idocare at 01/15/2008 @ 8:09pm
BTW have any of you seen the utterly contemptible flyers put out by the Obama machine in Nevada from Obama campaign honchos asking Republicans to stop Hillary by voting for Obama as this is only a caucus and they of course can change their real votes in general. They plead with Republicans to stop Hilary and vote Democrat now. Taylor Marsh has it, and Google. This is Ok?
Posted by morris1030 at 01/15/2008 @ 8:14pm
Posted by MORRIS1030 01/15/2008 @ 8:14pm
How about the utterly contemptible attempt by the Hillary machine to take away the rights of many to vote in Nevada?
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 8:23pm
Posted by MORRIS1030 01/15/2008 @ 7:51pm
Morris,
Do us all a favor and take your bucket of slime over to some conservative site where it will be appreciated by the clinton/rove types.
Over here at The Nation, we are trying to debate substantive issues, not personal character issues like why Hillary's blind ambition is so scary that she failed to divorce Bill for getting sucked off in the oval office in a public spectacle!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 8:48pm
Posted by MORRIS1030 01/15/2008 @ 7:51pm
If we start getting into character issues, then we degenerate into Whitewater land deals, whether Vince Foster "really" committed suicide, and Hillary's defense of "Groper Bill" and his disgusting sexual harassment of a number of women in the workplace.
You don't want to do that, do you?
Posted by Metteyya at 01/15/2008 @ 8:55pm
The state party approved the at-large precincts at its Nevada State Democratic Party's State Central Committee meeting on March 31, 2007.
According to those minutes and attendance records of the obtained by ABC News (Click HERE), four plaintiffs now suing the state party to stop these "at-large" precincts from convening were in attendance: Clark Party Second Vice Chair Vicki Birkland and John Birkland, Party Third Vice Chair Dwayne Chesnut and Clark County Public Administrator John Cahill.
The "Delegation Selection Plan Review and Approval" including these "at-large" precincts was, according to minutes of the meeting reviewed by ABC News, "Passed unanimously." The plan was submitted to the Democratic National Committee for approval in August.
Posted by FLaim at 01/15/2008 @ 9:03pm
Posted by METTEYYA 01/15/2008 @ 8:55pm
There's a plan for ya, METTE. Next time FRANKGRITS brings up "mulatto" or HELENDAO brings up drug use...
bring up Vince Foster and allude to it not being a suicide (or just that HRC and Vince were fooling around).
It'll drive 'em nuts.
Posted by Mask at 01/15/2008 @ 9:05pm
I found this great article on the topic at www.SAVAGEPOLITICS.com. It raises some great issues. Here is an excerpt:
"For the last couple of days we have heard incessant commentary in the mainstream mediums about the racial issues brought up recently in the Democratic side of this season's primary elections. This, amongst the vast criticisms that the Clinton campaign has received for supposedly sending out "agents" to spread rumors about Barack Obama's not too lustrous past, has Hillary's supporters scrambling for cover. Apparently, or so the press claims, there exists certain knowledge about a candidate's past that we are not supposed to discuss because they are "insensitive" or "negative". Robert L. Johnson, founder of Black Entertainment Television and supporter of Hillary Clinton's candidacy, recently caught some heat when he made public references to Barack Obama's past drug use (cocaine and marijuana) for being "ugly" attempts to discredit Obama's reputation amongst conservative Democrats. Tonight, in Nevada's Democrat debate, we will probably get to hear these candidates respond to this so-called "mud slinging" charges, which up until now are being leveled against both camps, and probably witness a pathetic "coming together" in which both lead candidates leave all this controversy behind. An act which is only done out of pure self-interest since they both know that this "race and gender" discussion hurts both camps somewhat equally. Once again, instead of witnessing an actual debate on real issues, we will get washed down campaign slogans, ad nauseum. What is the information contained in this Fine Print that the Media keeps pushing us to ignore until the election is over?..." Visit www.SAVAGEPOLITICS.com to see the rest of the article.
Posted by elsylee at 01/15/2008 @ 9:52pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 9:38pm
Nah I don't think it's him showing his true colors I think it's him responding in kind to show how stupid it is to make character attacks to defend a person who has plenty of reason to have her character attacked.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 10:36pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 10:46pm
Staying with Bill after his cheating her in one of the biggest sham marriages I have ever seen.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 10:58pm
Posted by CCCOMFO1 01/15/2008 @ 10:58pm
repeatedly cheated.
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/15/2008 @ 10:59pm
repeatedly cheated.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 11:05pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/15/2008 @ 11:14pm
I'm not married as a side not. Also are you like a Clinton aide or something is that why you have such fanatical ties to them? Or a family friend?
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 11:17pm
So then how can you say you have INTIMATE knowledge of their marriage? Unless you are closer to them than having read books and watched coverage then you do not have INTIMATE knowledge. You have surface knowledge based on what other people have said. So my argument still stands.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/15/2008 @ 11:25pm
Posted by FRANKGRITS 01/16/2008 @ 12:04am
First off I don't listen to Limbaugh and second off how do you know her thoughts of her marriage were honest did you sit her down with a polygraph. You're so quick to decide that everything Obama does is a lie but you won't believe that she can possibly lie... Plus don't claim you have intimate knowledge of someone's marriage if your knowledge comes from a book anyone can read. People lie in books too.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 01/16/2008 @ 12:29am
FROM OL'JESSE HISSELF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by JOMAMMA 01/16/2008 @ 12:23am
c'mon Jm,
mr. jackson is not some railroad porter from a shirley temple movie.
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/16/2008 @ 12:44am
God, this is a fun election season...
Posted by JOMAMMA 01/16/2008 @ 12:23am
because we all know debushification* is just around the oh-sooo-slooooowly approaching corner.
*fingers crossed.
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/16/2008 @ 12:46am
Re: Supress the Nevada's vote. Alright, let's play the fair game. Why could Mr. Obama attack the Clintons 24/24 and Hillary couldn't even respond. I know, the hip-hop generation to whom mr. OObama claims to belong to is entiitled to everything; but America's future depends right now now not only on them.
Posted by HelenDAO at 01/16/2008 @ 12:52am
As I have been saying, Hillary doesn't care how she wins, as long as she does. I can't wait until all the votes in the New Hampshire primary are recounted. Then we'll see what she did in that state to "win".
Posted by WinnieM at 01/16/2008 @ 01:03am
Re: Clinton supporters supressing Nevada's ...
Fair and balance, fair and balance ... I think that is pricisely what is lacking from the Nation. Why would the "fairly tale" go unvetted and the "experience" be checked from every possible angle? Let's Nevadans be Nevadans (aka gamble on till you drop dead".
Posted by HelenDAO at 01/16/2008 @ 01:04am
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, PEOPLE !! Get rid of the Bush / Clinton dynasties once and for all !!! Isn't 20 years of a Bush or Clinton Presidency in Washington ENOUGH ???? (and I'm not even counting the 4 yrs. Bush senior was VP).
Posted by WinnieM at 01/16/2008 @ 01:16am
Wow, as it goes in America, money matters. In the end the likes of Forbeses, Romneys, Edwardses would never amount to anything, even in America. Hey, consultants, thank gods for those idiots. -------
Romney wins convincing Michigan victory By LIZ SIDOTI and GLEN JOHNSON, Associated Press Writers 1 hour, 38 minutes ago
DETROIT - Mitt Romney scored his first major primary victory Tuesday, a desperately needed win in his native Michigan that gave his weakened presidential candidacy new life. It set the stage for a wide-open Republican showdown in South Carolina in just four days.
Posted by HelenDAO at 01/16/2008 @ 02:00am
So then how can you say you have INTIMATE knowledge of their marriage? Unless you are closer to them than having read books and watched coverage then you do not have INTIMATE knowledge. You have surface knowledge based on what other people have said. So my argument still stands.
Posted by CCCOMFO1 01/15/2008 @ 11:25pm | ignore this person
this applies to you too. what do you know about other people's marriage? you should get to know more people, a whole world of uncertainty waits for you.
Posted by McQ at 01/16/2008 @ 08:30am
Did any of you note that the Nevada primary is on Saturday? How many teachers won't be able to get to their neighborhood caucus sites because they have to work? Casino workers, on the other hand, will be working on Saturday making it more difficult to vote. This is nothing more than an attempt to insure that voters (whose union has backed Obama) won't have the opportunity to vote. FrankG makes me sick. He seems to think this is just part of doing what you need to to win. To somehow imply that illegal immigrants would vote if the caucus is in their workplace adds to this. Illegal and legal immigrants don't vote. I hope the people of Nevada see through this attempt to disenfranchise voters.
Posted by loria at 01/16/2008 @ 09:46am
i really wish bill clinton, when questioned about his sex life, would have said, "none of your business!"
i think its disgusting that many on the left are now joining the right wing in judging hillary on what she does in her marriage. come on! unless politicians are commiting illegal acts in their private lives, we really shouldn't focus on their private lives at all. if hillary were trying to pass laws that punished women for staying with unfaithful husbands....then ya, i could understand focusing on she and bill's marital problems.
Posted by loveloki at 01/16/2008 @ 10:53am
I never cared about Bill Clinton's sexual indiscretions as it related to his duties in the White House. Because of his actions, however, I don't have any respect for him or her. It's not like she had nowhere to go if she left him or stayed for the kid(s). Hillary is from old money, so financial independence is a given and Chelsea was in high school. No, she stayed for a political purpose. Bill is making it up to her by getting her to the White House. I'm sure she's always known about his dalliances. What wife has absolutely no clue? Anyway, I'm just surprised at how the feminists support her now when they were quick to jump on her when she "stood by her man". What kind of example is that for young women? Please FFH's(feminists for Hillary) help me understand the logic.
Posted by k330k at 01/16/2008 @ 3:01pm
k33ok, personally, i would not react well to a partner who agreed to be monogamous and then cheated. i know some women who have open marriages. i know others who stay with cheating husbands because they feel it is the only right thing to do in a faith based way. there are many different types of marriages. who am i to say they are wrong? that is personal. i don't think personal choices should factor in here.
i want to know how any of these candidates are going to do anything about the corporatocracy. they all seem like they are too involved with big money to me.
Posted by loveloki at 01/16/2008 @ 3:09pm
Posted by LOVELOKI 01/16/2008 @ 3:09pm
I do agree with you on this point. That's another question for Obama. When/if he is elected to the presidency, how will the needs of the corporations who supported him(I'm sure there are some)weigh against the needs of the people he purports to care about. Don't get me wrong. I do support Obama but I'm not naive. Just like Hillary, all of Obama's campaign funds didn't just come from the electorate and personal bank accounts. Dammit! I hate to leave but I gotta go. It's been fun folks. Have a good one everybody!
Posted by k330k at 01/16/2008 @ 3:18pm
The Democrats have a strong record in election FRAUD. Remember in Florida how the DEMOCRATS sent their bully lawyers out to eliminate all the MILITARY Votes !! It was only after the outrage of miliary families and the country as a whole, did these so called "progressives" - now exposed- stopped . Same here, everyone deserves the right to vote, including hard working people at hotels! Shame on you Clinton supporters. It did not work in Florida, and it will not work here in Nevada !!
Posted by hamiltongrad at 01/19/2008 @ 10:51am