Netanyahu's Fig Leaf

So finally, after weeks of seamy backroom maneuvering, Benjamin Netanyahu has formed the new Israeli government, so bloated with ministries doled out as party favors that it was beginning to look as if Bibi would name a Minister of Public Toilets, or perhaps Deputy Premier for Parking Violations, just to placate dissatisfied rivals from his restless Likud stable.

Kadima leader Tzipi Livni made the mistake of assuming that Labor, in particular leader Ehud Barak, still retained some smidgen of principle and would thus stand by its avowal not to take part in a government liberally stocked with rejectionist bigots like Avigdor Lieberman. She should've known better. There may be a few decent souls left in the party, but common references to it, especially in the US media, as "center left" are laughable and have been for some time, as Daphna Baram pointed out recently in the Guardian.

Barak himself has always been a rejectionist warrior. As chief of staff of the army in the early 1990s, he opposed the Oslo Accords. As prime minister in 1999-2000, he approved a massive increase in settlement construction and then destroyed what remained of the Oslo process by making outrageous demands of the Palestinians at Camp David. Then, in response to overwhelmingly unarmed rioting after Ariel Sharon's provocative peacock-strut on the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount, Barak ordered a murderous fusillade of live ammunition to suppress demonstrations all over the territories.

Not only has Barak consistently opposed serious negotiations with the Palestinians, he's not even a good military strategist, despite being Israel's most highly decorated soldier. As defense minister in Ehud Olmert's now deceased government, Barak just oversaw the disastrous Gaza massacre, now condemned round the world as involving multiple war crimes (see the devastating February 11 report, A/HRC/10/20, by Nation editorial board member and UN Special Rapporteur, Richard Falk). All that, and the campaign didn't even seriously damage Hamas's rocket capability.

So what kind of government is Bibi leading? Observers should keep an unpleasant fact in mind as they wade through the media verbiage: Netanyahu and his partners have no intention of engaging in serious negotiations--and there should be no illusions that Barak or the other Labor cabinet members will put a serious brake on this. The new government will do everything it can to kill any chances of a two-state solution, including acceleration of settlement construction. See Helena Cobban's posting on our site about the latest spate of house demolitions in East Jerusalem. And Israeli Army Radio has reported a secret agreement between Netanyahu and Lieberman to build 3,000 units of housing in the crucial E1 area, between East Jerusalem and the giant Ma'ale Adumim settlement. The colonization of E1 would cement the bantustanization of the West Bank, not only severing the Palestinian northern West Bank from the southern but choking off Palestinian access to Jerusalem, the necessary capital of any future state.

Barak was recruited to the cabinet to serve as a fig leaf for Western governments and leading media, which desperately crave the appearance of a peace process, since even they would not be able to continue the now-years-long pretense in the face of a government composed solely of Bibi and thugs to his right like Lieberman. There's collusion on almost all sides, actually: Israel needs the fig leaf both to satisfy Western diplomats and to help ease upgraded status with its largest trading partner, the EU. The Obama administration needs the fig leaf to avoid incurring the draining confrontation with the AIPAC and Christian Zionist crowd (and their cutthroat brethren in the blogosphere) that might arise as a result of tensions between the administration and an openly recalcitrant Israel. And, perhaps most pathetic of all, Mahmous Abbas and his cohort in the Palestinian Authority leadership desperately need to keep alive the possibility of negotiations, because without that, their last shred of credibility--their very raison d'etre--would disappear.

It looks pretty bleak, but one recent diplomatic demarche would at least provide bipartisan cover for Obama to press for serious talks, in contrast to the 2007 Annapolis charade: under the auspices of Henry Siegman's U.S./Middle East Project, a heavyweight crew of former diplomats and think tankers, including Zbigniew Brzezinski, Brent Scowcroft, Paul Volcker, James Wolfensohn and Chuck Hagel, has submitted to President Obama "A Last Chance for a Two-State Israel-Palestine Agreement."

The document calls for putting serious pressure on all parties to begin accelerated negotiations toward a solution roughly along the lines of most recent two-state proposals: Israeli withdrawal to the 1967 lines, with only minor and reciprocal adjustments allowed; division of Jerusalem, with Jewish neighborhoods under Israeli sovereignty and Arab neighborhoods under Palestinian sovereignty, and unimpeded access from both sides to their respective holy sites in the Old City; a resolution of the refugee problem "consistent with the two-state solution," i.e., that would not allow general return to Israel but would acknowledge the injustice of the expulsion and provide generous compensation for resettlement in the new state of Palestine or elsewhere. There's plenty to argue about in these elements, as in other details of the plan, but there's little denying that something along these lines is the only chance for survival of the two-state solution.

The question is, Does Obama have the guts to adopt and forcefully push it--and threaten serious repercussions if he encounters obstruction? The recent Chas Freeman episode isn't exactly encouraging, but we're still testing the mettle of this president. He may yet surprise us.

Comments (61)

1. 'And Israeli Army Radio has reported a secret agreement between Netanyahu and Lieberman to build 3,000 units of housing in the crucial E1 area, between East Jerusalem and the giant Ma'ale Adumim settlement. The colonization of E1 would cement the bantustanization of the West Bank, not only severing the Palestinian northern West Bank from the southern but choking off Palestinian access to Jerusalem, the necessary capital of any future state.'

   Still waiting for the US State Department's formal announcement of cancellation of loan gurarantees on Israeli bonds used to finance building of settlements in occupied terrorities.

   These Zionist characters are just complete and utter BS. Yuck!

   Queen Noor of Jordan attempted to address the utter hypocrisy of Israel and US with regard to Sudan by addressing the Palestinian issue, and Wolfie Blitzer shut her right down (not before she made her point) by saying "oh....we aren't going to talk about that."

   Friggin nonsense by the biggest terrorist state on Earth.

   Posted by OneVote at 03/31/2009 @ 6:26pm

2. "A Last Chance for a Two-State Israel-Palestine Agreement."

   I remain hopeful that PM Netenyahu will reject outright this suicidal plan by leftists and naive moderates.

   Jerusalem is the capital of Israel. It is not a subdivision of Jordan, Egypt, or Syria.

   Posted by antisocialist at 03/31/2009 @ 6:42pm

3. Friggin nonsense by the biggest terrorist state on Earth.

   Posted by OneVote at 03/31/2009 @ 6:26pm

   Top Terrorist states, Iran, Syria, Pakistan, Indonesia, Somalia, Algeria

   CIA 2006 top 6

   Currently, six countries are on that list: Cuba, Iran, North Korean, Syria, Libya and Sudan.

   Former CIA officer Michael Scheuer says Iran and Syria are considered to be the most active in sponsoring terrorism -- Iran for its backing of Hezbollah and Syria for aiding Hezbollah, Hamas, and other Palestinian groups attacking Israel.

   Posted by antisocialist at 03/31/2009 @ 6:55pm

4. Posted by antisocialist at 03/31/2009 @ 6:55pm | ignore this person | warn this person

   Michael Scheuer is pretty strong stuff, but I must admit, sometimes I like it straight no chaser. He is a no holds barred kind of guy, and he thinks when we play, we play to win - despite the weak kneed politicians who wink and nod on the green light, and then piss and moan once we are mired down.

   But Liv, Scheuer thinks we are too beholden to Isrrael, and we are pissing off the wrong guys. Likely you don't agree with that assessment? Not to say that you have to agree with him on everything.

   Scheuer wouldn't come and say Israel sponsors state terrorism, because of course, he is former CIA. But much of the world disagrees with that assessment. And Scheuer, though protective of Israel in many ways, was critized heavily by Israel and US for being critical of our slavelike devotion to Israel that weakened our position in the Middle East.

   Terrorism is used by both sides - and you know this better than most of us.

   Posted by OneVote at 03/31/2009 @ 7:18pm

5. The document "A Last Chance for a Two-State Israel-Palestine Agreement." identifies specific things that have been identified plenty of times before.

   What is not identified in the document is the fact that the Arab world and the Palestinians want no Israel, have opposed Israel from the beginning, have done everything in their power to bring this (no Israel) about, and have no intention of changing their stance on that subject.

   If everything in the document were achieved, then the next phase would begin - more rocket attacks or suicide bombings or perhaps some new and yet unknown tactic to bring about Israel's end.

   There would be more "grievances" against Israel, either identified by Mr. Peanut (Jimmy Carter) or by the U.N. "Rapporteur" , along with more plans for more documents and peace processes where Israel would be required to concede even more in exchange for Palestinian promises for peace which are disingenuous when made and never kept anyway.

   The document (and Mr. Peanut and the U.N. Rapporteur and The Nation,etc.) also forget that all the "wrongs" they claim Israel is guilty of have only come about as Israel has had to defend itself against enemies that want to destroy it.

   So where is the document that lays out how the world can change it's bias against Israel? And where is the document that lays out how the Arab world and the Palestinians can be forced to knock the crap off that they have engaged in all of these years?

   Where are the documents that hold those people to account for all the misery and suffering they have caused in the Middle East and world wide all of these years while pursuing their dream of no Israel?

   I am sure the Rapporteur or Jimmy Carter or any of the lib editors at The Nation are NOT working on preparing those documents.

   Posted by sjchermak at 03/31/2009 @ 7:36pm

6. Posted by antisocialist at 03/31/2009 @ 6:55pm | ignore this person | warn this person

   Interesting side note on Scheuer.

   'RFE/RL: You decided to end your career at the CIA earlier than you originally planned to. Was it difficult to resign?

   Scheuer: I resigned from the agency with much regret. I had intended to work there for 30 years and then retire, or longer if I could. And I had nothing to complain about regarding the agency. Indeed the agency asked me to stay when I decided to resign.

   The terrorist attack on the World Trade Center in New York on September 11, 2001 (epa)

   I resigned because I thought the 9/11 commission had thoroughly failed America by not finding anyone responsible for anything before 9/11. The amount of individual negligence and culpability at the highest levels of the American government was completely whitewashed by the 9/11 commission. And I resigned because I wanted to speak out on those issues.

   My feeling since I have left has been that I have not had any influence at all on that particular debate. I think I've had a bit of influence through my books and writings on trying to convince people that the war we're fighting against Al-Qaedaism is a more serious problem than we have imagined to date. And that it has much more to do with religion than anyone in power is willing to talk about. I seem to have an equal number of detractors on the right and on the left, and perhaps that is suggests that I have at least said something that's getting some attention.'

   Excerpt: Radio Free Europe - Interiew with Michael Scheuer January 08, 2007 World: Former CIA Analyst Says West Misunderstands Al-Qaeda

   Posted by OneVote at 03/31/2009 @ 7:43pm

7. ministry of bulldozers.

   Posted by frosty zoom at 03/31/2009 @ 7:58pm

8. posted by Roane Carey on 03/31/2009 @ 6:08pm

   Could it be that the so-called "two state" solution really is a goner? For there to be any hope for any peaceful outcome, the Israeli nation and regime has to want a peaceful outcome. They have all the firepower and they initiated the last two horribly violent acts destabilizing to peace, the war on Lebanon and the war on Gaza.

   One suspects that, if this is the "last chance" for a two-state outcome, then opponents of the two-state outcome - which includes completely the Israeli regime - will shortly do the one thing they know will end the "last chance" which initiate another barbaric massacre. Israel is already plotting its next horrible act. I personally suspect that the "peace process" will be dead, put to death by Israeli violence, triumphalism, by the end of the year, the apartheid will worsen, the "settlements" will expand rapidly, and the US government will do ... nothing about it ... by the end of the year.

   Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:06pm

9. Posted by antisocialist at 03/31/2009 @ 6:42pm | ignore this person | warn this person

   Why don't you volunteer go to kill a bunch of Palestinians yourself, since you are so all-fired-up about the prospects of ethnocide and Israeli violence.

   (Placing your personal religious lunacy aside, according to the 1948 UN charter for Israel, which is the only international legal structure for Israel beyond resolutions like 242 which Israel flouts, Jerusalem assuredly IS not "the capital of Israel", it is a *shared* capital.)

   Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:09pm

10. Posted by antisocialist at 03/31/2009 @ 6:55pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    It is 100% idiotic to quote the USG on who is and is not a terrorist nation. The USG, like any country, uses this label for political purposes. In the view held in some other countries, US and Western Europe are the big terrorists.

    In the eyes of any rational human being, Israel is a terrorist regime and a rogue regime.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:12pm

11. http://blogs.jta.org/politics/article/2009/03/30/ 1004111/zoa-on-the-hill

    For those interested, there is the Lobby at work.

    " ... Hundreds of Zionist Organization of America (ZOA) activist from 16 states, including dozens of students, took part in ZOA's annual activist Mission to Washington, D.C., on March 26 to urge Members of Congress to support legislation for significantly tightening sanctions on Iran; denying $900 million in U.S. financial assistance to Gaza Arabs and the Palestinian Authority (PA) ..."

    This is why Obama cannot ever hope to defy Israel: bought and sold American fanatics in the political class.

    " ... Rep. Gene Green (D-TX) spoke warmly of Israel as the classic underdog in the Middle East, surrounded by hostile enemies. Nonetheless, he said, the partnership between Israel and the U.S. had grown into a real alliance of greater depth, he said, than that with Britain or any other country ..."

    A Democratic politician just declared in front of the Israel Lobby that the relationship between the US and Israel has a greater depth than the relationship between the US and Britain.

    That is why there is no hope for improvement, or at least an example of why. The US government is under the heel of the Israel Lobby.

    When Israel engages in its next barbaric and savage assault on the Palestinian people - the next military assault, as opposed to the barbaric and savage expropriation of the West Bank and choking of Gaza currently underway - the US will do NOTHING. Because politicians like this asshole Green of Texas will declare Israel a deeper relationship than even Britain, because if he does, he gets lots of campaign contributions, and if he doesn't, he is targeted for removal by the Israel Lobby.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:20pm

12. More American politicians groveling in front of the Israel Lobby, courtesy of the Jewish News Service:

    " ... Rep. Patrick McHenry (R-NC) started his remarks by observing that "our history in this country pales in comparison to the history of the Chosen People." He went on to challenge the notions that global warming or the economic hardships are our worst problems saying, "last time I checked, it was not warm climate that smashed into buildings, blew up bombs or killed thousands of people. Our No. 1 global threat is not global warming, not the economy, it is Muslim extremists … Israel is the only functioning democracy in the Middle East. We have very few true friends in the world, but at the top of that list is Israel. Israel is the land of the Bible ..."

    So one of our elected officials thinks that US history is nothing compared to "the Chosen People". Perhaps he should go to Israel, burn his passport, and formally renounce his citizenship in front of the US consultate, if he thinks so little of America. And blowing up bombs and killings thousands of people? Israel hasn't anything like that, recently!! No!!!

    And here is another Democrat, who apparently managed to miss the war on Gaza.

    " ... Rep. Anthony Weiner (D-NY) gave his customary greeting of hailing from "the ZOA wing of the Democratic Party" before launching into a strong rebuttal of the idea that the U.S. should be funding the Palestinians. "Until they demonstrate that they are not supporting terror, they should not be getting one dime of U.S. taxpayer's money." ..."

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:27pm

13. And here is another Democrat, demonstrating clearly that she has no loyalty in the world beyond Israel:

    " ... Rep. Shelley Berkley (D-NV) joked that she always brings Mort Klein her ZOA membership check each time our Mission is in Washington but that today she had left her checkbook in her car. She said that "being Jewish is a lifelong occupation. It's what we do as Jews, more than any place else, we are experiencing the liberties our ancestors only dreamt of for generation after generation .There is a price to pay for this and the price is being engaged in our government process and no one does this better than ZOA." Speaking of the rocket falling on Israeli towns like Sderot, she said that she "knows every neighborhood of Sderot … Israel has exercised extraordinary restraint and did not use disproportionate force. On the contrary, it didn't use enough, soon enough. Many of my colleagues were concerned at this – I ask them, ‘Would you have been happier if a thousand more Jews had died?' ... UNRWA is nothing but the face and arm of Hamas. We are giving funds to rebuild Gaza for UNRWA to administer – I couldn't think of anything more ridiculous than this. I was delighted when my colleagues Mark Kirk and Steve Rothman introduced it – but first I called Mort to make sure it was strong enough before I signed on … There is no way on G--'s green earth that we can allow Iran to get nuclear weapons. I remember Ariel Sharon telling a group of us at Blair House that a nuclear Iran is as much a threat to the U.S., to the West and the Arab nations and that the world should not be expecting Israel to take care of its dirty work. And I couldn't agree more." ..."

    This is why there is no hope for the USG to ever change anything with respect to Israel and the poor Palestinians.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:28pm

14. " ... Rep. Gene Green (D-TX) spoke warmly of Israel as the classic underdog in the Middle East, surrounded by hostile enemies. Nonetheless, he said, the partnership between Israel and the U.S. had grown into a real alliance of greater depth, he said, than that with Britain or any other country ..."

    A Democratic politician just declared in front of the Israel Lobby that the relationship between the US and Israel has a greater depth than the relationship between the US and Britain.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:20pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    Of course he means our government which is infested with Lobby acolytes.

    The people of this Country would beg to differ, but you know, our opinion will never make the headlines.

    We are enslaved to a foreign nation. Michael Scheuer is spot on. He just couldn't stand it anymore.

    Posted by OneVote at 03/31/2009 @ 8:30pm

15. From the pitiful and shameless Shelley Berkeley, we have the most dishonest statement of the year about Gaza:

    " ... ‘Would you have been happier if a thousand more Jews had died?' ..."

    The number of Israelis killed by rockets from Gaza in the several YEARS prior to Israel's savage and barbaric assault on the people in Gaza was LESS THAN 10.

    And this worm Berkeley - she has the temerity to say "a thousand more" Israelis?

    Gaza never killed a thousand Israelis with rockets.

    On the other hand, thousands of Palestinians in Gaza have been killed by Israel, and enormous number wounded.

    Berkeley is apparently one of the most reprehensibly dishonest and/or fanatical figures holding national office today.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:31pm

16. Here's a Democrat who isn't just a fanatical Zionist but sure likes the military pork spending too!

    " ... Rep. Steve Rothman (D-NJ) spoke of his 41 years of fighting for Israel on Capitol Hill and recalled that he had been the first Jewish Member of the House to work on House Defense Sub Committee dealing with appropriations for all military spending. He recounted with pride that the Committee had provided an additional $6 million in joint U.S.-Israeli research on the Arrow missile and how he and his Illinois republican colleague, Mark Kirk, had introduced legislation to hold UNRWA responsible for how it spends U.S. aid. ..."

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:35pm

17. And here is a lunatic religious fanatic who holds high office, he needs no bribes from lobbyists:

    " ... Rep. Paul Broun (R-GA) opened by saying that "In the Torah, it says blessed is the nation that blesses Israel, cursed is the one that curses it. I've been described as the Zionist Christian – and I heartily embrace that description. What has made this nation great are the Judeo-Christian principles upon which this nation was founded … the U.S. must never give up blessing Israel. The only vestiges of G-'s blessing on this nation today is because we continue to bless Israel and I will do everything in my power to continue to ensure that Israel is blessed by America. My position, based on G-d's word, is that Canaan was given to the Israelites. The Israelites owned that territory. It doesn't belong to anyone else. Israel should have the opportunity to ensure that everyone who lives there does so in freedom and safety ..."

    Whatever this man serves, it isn't the US.

    No hope. None at all.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:36pm

18. " ... Rep. Shelley Berkley (D-NV) joked that she always brings Mort Klein her ZOA membership check each time our Mission is in Washington but that today she had left her checkbook in her car. She said that "being Jewish is a lifelong occupation. It's what we do as Jews, more than any place else, we are experiencing the liberties our ancestors only dreamt of for generation after generation .There is a price to pay for this and the price is being engaged in our government process and no one does this better than ZOA."

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 8:28pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    No one does it better than ZOA. Kind of catchy huh?

    Perhaps Ms. Berkley should give a little more careful read to history and the association of "being Jewish is a lifelong occupation" and the loss of liberties of her ancestors were they were a ethnocentric minority first and foremost by choice who practiced outright and discrete discrimination againt goyim on a daily basis while enjoying privileges of state created by and paid for by the goyim.

    Who are big sponsors of the loss of your Constitutional freedoms via the Patriot Act, NSA citizen spying which goes right to Israel, use of terrorism, etc. You guessed it....The Lobby.

    Yep....nobody does it better than ZOA.

    Posted by OneVote at 03/31/2009 @ 8:53pm

19. And round and round we go again....

    syfriend with all the "Israel is Nazi Germany...oh, but I'm all for a peaceful solution"...

    and antisoc Larry with a slightly less disengenuous "Israel Initiative" plan which is of course Israel retakes Gaza and the West Bank and the Palestinians "move back" to Jordan.

    BTW, have a feeling Netanyahu is just talking tough on Iran. Despite what many think, Israel doesn't run American foreign policy under Obama and Bibi knows if they bomb Iran, the US won't give it a nod and a wink and three slaps with a wet noodle....since Dubya ain't running the show anymore.

    We now return to your normally scheduled...and increasingly boring donnybrook over Israel and Palestine.

    Posted by Mask at 03/31/2009 @ 8:53pm

20. Posted by Mask at 03/31/2009 @ 8:53pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    It's really obnoxious, the way you try to start fights with people by mischaracterizing or simply lying about what they do or do not write on these pages. It's a pathology with you. I continue to believe that this is how you make up for a lack of real-world relationships.

    As for my views on Israel, I don't need you to make them clear for me, nor am I giving you any more attention.

    Get a point, Mask. Get a life. Get some relationships away from the internet.

    Do you stalk people, too?

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 9:58pm

21. Posted by Mask at 03/31/2009 @ 8:53pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    PS the "donnybrook" is about a huge toll of human lives and suffering. While you personally might imagine that you know what "Bibi" - a figure whom you probably had not heard of prior to a few weeks ago - is thinking - the weight of the pain and anger and bitterness in this issue is the weight of the pain and anger and bitterness of the people subjugated by this creepy rogue nation under discussion. Your dismissal of that suffering doesn't just bely your own (huge) ignorance of these issues, and your vast distance from them, but really reflects more your own character. Your big thing in life seems to be seeing yourself in your mind scoring little "points" with people on online bulletin boards.

    Get a life.

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 10:01pm

22. (And here comes "Mask" again needing to turn the online bulletin board discussion into an angry attention-fest, filled with responses and attention for him personally.)

    Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 10:02pm

23. Out come the two types of people who ever debate about this stuff. The two people who's solutions will lead to the destruction of both Israel and Palestine. Where are the people who can see an actual pragmatic solution to this issue?

    Posted by Cccomfo1 at 03/31/2009 @ 10:44pm

24. The nation really has gotten the "knack" for fomenting anti-semitism and hate lately. These weekly anti-Israel threads are sure one way to sell magazines without Sex on the cover!

    Posted by comancheamerican at 03/31/2009 @ 11:06pm

25. I always felt a little uncomfortable with Bibi, now I am really disturb with this guy. he is beginning to sound and look like Michael Steel.

    Posted by julien38 at 03/31/2009 @ 11:37pm

26. Posted by syfriendly at 03/31/2009 @ 9:58pm

    No, your views are pretty clear...even the ones you don't like to OPENLY discuss.

    BTW, as far as "turn(ing) the online bulletin board discussion into an angry attention-fest"....

    look in the mirror.

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 08:11am

27. The nation really has gotten the "knack" for fomenting anti-semitism and hate lately. These weekly anti-Israel threads are sure one way to sell magazines without Sex on the cover!

    Posted by comancheamerican at 03/31/2009 @ 11:06pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    There you have it folks.

    Anti-Israel = Anti-Semitism.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 08:36am

28. Posted by Cccomfo1 at 03/31/2009 @ 10:44pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    We get drowned out by all the shouting from the hatemongerers...

    Posted by BizarroRio at 04/01/2009 @ 08:38am

29. Where are the people who can see an actual pragmatic solution to this issue?

    Posted by Cccomfo1 at 03/31/2009 @ 10:44pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    Generally, you must understand the context of the problem before offering a solution.

    Many times the context of the problem needs to change before solution is possible.

    The problem within the problem.

    Even handedness in dealing with the Israeli-Palestinian issue is a splendid example.

    Note that posts detailing the pushback against even handedness from the Zionist crowd here in America is sabotage of a solution that we are supposedly working for.

    Pretty darn relevant - unless of course you are one of those who really don't want solution, but rather continuation with lip service only.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 08:49am

30. Israeli withdrawal to the 1967 lines?

    Hmmmmm.

    Where is the international community in all this? Why won't they lead by example?

    Instead of merely advocating land for peace, wouldn't the following actions be more persuasive: China returns the Aksai Chin region to India, Ukraine returns the Crimea to Turkey, Spain returns Ceuta and Mellila to Morocco, the UK returns Gibraltar to Spain, France returns Calais to the English, Russia returns Kaliningrad (Konigsberg) to Germany, Turkey returns Constantinople (Istanbul) to Greece, Taiwan returns all of Taiwan to China, China returns all of Tibet to Tibet ... and let's not forget the "right of return" of the Sudeten Germans, who were expelled by the Czechs?

    Posted by Mistral at 04/01/2009 @ 09:16am

31. Sey Hersch says in the New Yorker that Dick Cheney went to Israeli officials after Obama took office and told them Obama could not be trusted, that he was pro-Palestinian. Is this not treason? How can the US tolerate a former Vice President's undermining of the current President in an area involving important military cooperation? Dick Cheney is dangerous and something should be done about him.

    Posted by jecolo at 04/01/2009 @ 09:20am

32. Posted by Mistral at 04/01/2009 @ 09:16am | ignore this person | warn this person

    'The Oslo Accord signed on Sept. 13, 1993, was a political and economic program for peace. It called for establishment of a Palestinian interim self-governing authority, for the West Bank and Gaza, for a five-year period, leading to a final settlement, based on UN Resolutions 242 and 338. These call for the "withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied" in the 1967 war, secure and recognized borders, and a "just settlement of the refugee problem" regarding those Palestinians driven off their land in the wars since 1948, estimated to add up to 5 million today.'

    Please point out to us similar treaties and agreements in the examples you have cited above.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 09:42am

33. Is this not treason? How can the US tolerate a former Vice President's undermining of the current President in an area involving important military cooperation? Dick Cheney is dangerous and something should be done about him.

    Posted by jecolo at 04/01/2009 @ 09:20am | ignore this person | warn this person

    Check out Youtube for videos of Dick Cheney as honored guest speaker at AIPAC meetings. Terror is against the law too, but note AIPAC and its congressional lapdogs are big proponents of such "interrogation" techniques. Bush admministration appoints Mukassey (Jewish Alberto) to Holocaust Memorial post. Is it any wonder.

    Hoping that Spain is going to be putting some of these characters on the most wanted list soon.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 09:49am

34. Oslo? Could it be perhaps that Norway wants Iceland, the Orkneys and Faroes, and Greenland back and is just using "land for peace" as a pretext for eventually demanding the return of its own territory? I'm just asking.

    Posted by Mistral at 04/01/2009 @ 10:06am

35. Norway! Don't forget their other property, Mistral - as you should know, they don't call a big chunk of France 'Normandy' for nothing.

    Seriously, though, don't bother to try humour as a way to make things less confrontational on this blog. It never seems to register. They take it seriously and soon it's just spittle coming out of screaming mouths in red faces. Wipe it off your glasses and next time stick to bland and boring assertions of fact (that's what I've been accused of, anyway).

    Posted by HonestLiberal at 04/01/2009 @ 10:19am

36. jecolo,

    You are joking, of course?

    Unfortunately, probably not... but there are 2 things you apparently do not see, or remember.

    1. From what we have seen so far, it appears Dick Cheney is correct.

    2. You seem to have forgotten about another person, the illustrious Mr. Peanut, Jimmy Carter, going to foreign governments in the early 90's and lobbying them to oppose the first President Bush's attempts to build a coalition to kick Saddam out of Kuwait. Our government did not know about this, until Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney found out and contacted our government (it was Dick Cheney he talked to, by the way) and the PM asked Mr. Cheney, "What the .... is Carter up to?".

    So we can draw several conclusions, or ask some questions:

    1. The "..." above did not stand for words like "heck" but instead for a popular word that begins with the letter F. This is amazing, that a question like that has to be asked of a former U.S. President, by a foreign leader, to our government, who did not know what Mr. Peanut was trying to do.

    2. Obviously, Mr. Mulroney was not impressed by Mr. Peanut, quite apparently he had a low opinion of him.

    3. If that is the case, I agree with Mr. Mulroney.

    4. What say you about this? Was it OK for Mr. Peanut to do what he did.. NOTE: you can not win on this one... I am being like Mask here......and I have you in checkmate..... if you say it was OK for Mr. Peanut, then you are a hypocrite for complaining about Dick Cheney.... if you are consistent and say they were both wrong then when will Mr. Peanut be arrested for treason?

    (side note to Mask - believe it or not I do learn some things from you!)

    Posted by sjchermak at 04/01/2009 @ 10:34am

37. Posted by Mistral at 04/01/2009 @ 10:06am | ignore this person | warn this person

    Still waiting.

    Wipe it off your glasses and next time stick to bland and boring assertions of fact (that's what I've been accused of, anyway).

    Posted by HonestLiberal at 04/01/2009 @ 10:19am | ignore this person | warn this person

    The Palestinians don't think it is too funny either apparently. Walk a mile in their shoes. Humor is your luxury, not theirs.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 10:36am

38. Posted by sjchermak at 04/01/2009 @ 10:34am

    So Carter lobbying foreign leaders to stay out of a war is the same as Cheney running an assassination team?

    Ah-ha.

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 11:21am

39. Posted by HonestLiberal at 04/01/2009 @ 10:19am

    No indeed, honestliberal, I'm being deadly serious. I don't laugh about any of these geopolitical conflicts. I don't laugh and party and hand out candy when Hamas terrorists blow up Fatah officials in Gaza. It would be inhumane to laugh and party and hqnd out candy when terrorists kill people. Especially here in downtown Manhattan (formerly New Amsterdam - forgot to mention the Dutch before). Wouldn't it?

    Posted by Mistral at 04/01/2009 @ 11:40am

40. US Envoy Writes of Israeli Threats By Barbara Crossette - The Nation March 31, 2009 - Excerpt

    'In the wake of the accusation by Chas Freeman that his nomination to lead the National Intelligence Council was derailed by an "Israeli lobby," a forthcoming memoir by another distinguished ambassador adds stunning new charges to the debate. The ambassador, John Gunther Dean, writes that over the years he not only came under pressure from pro-Israeli groups and officials in Washington but also was the target of an Israeli-inspired assassination attempt in 1980 in Lebanon, where he had opened links to the Palestine Liberation Organization.'

    Do read Ms. Crossette's article in The Nation. Mr. Dean is Jewish, so you anti-semite mudslingers hold off.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 11:41am

41. Mask,

    Classic post, this one may qualify for the Mask hall of fame.

    1. Lib jecolo above is whining because Vice President Cheney gave Israeli officials his opinion about Obama.

    2. And I mentioned the activities of Mr. Peanut, and asked jecolo for an opinion.

    3. You ask me a rhetorical question about a "Cheney assasination team" and if it is the same as Mr. Peanut's treason.

    Which one of the three pieces doesn't fit the discussion here?

    (answer - item 3).

    What is odd, is that by the context of your question you are assuming there was a "Cheney assasination team". But the last I knew there was an article on The Nation that got libs hair all on fire because Seymour Hersh, not by any means an objective and at many times not even credible journalist, declares there was a "Cheney assasination team".

    Which doesn't come within a million miles of any acutal proof of such a "team".

    Why are you asking me about something that has not been proven to exist?

    (Oh, I forgot... you ask me about things that have not been proven to exist all the time.... case in point...you keep asking about global warming!)

    Posted by sjchermak at 04/01/2009 @ 12:10pm

42. Posted by Mistral at 04/01/2009 @ 11:40am | ignore this person | warn this person

    Still waiting schmuck. Both HonestLiberal and I are awaiting your assertions of facts relevant to your argument.

    Now you using WTC as justification for Zionist atrocity against Palestinians.

    Sure you weren't celebrating with Mossad while watching the towers come down? Maybe you are one of those grateful Israeli nationals that got advance warning to evacuate before the "attack."

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 12:18pm

43. : In the view held in some other countries, US and Western Europe are the big terrorists..."

    I am sure that isn true....and the list begins..

    Cuba, Iran, North Korean, Syria, Libya and Sudan....

    Plus....

    Russia, Pakistan, Venezzuala, all countries with insurgencies fighting "for the people"..half the aide receiving nations in the UN, all Islamic Jihadists...AQ nut cases, Hamas, Hellsboolah, the alphabet soup of "Peoples revolutionary...whatevers"...

    Plus....

    The Nation Mag, NYT, MSM, most of the far left Democratic Party, Code Pink, SOROS, Media Matters, all the people NOBODY wants on their soil that are now in GITMO, San Francisco,...DON'T FORGET ALGORE, enviromental loons groups(all o0f them, Gorbachev...Air America,...

    all the loons in London streets today..

    I dont have enough space...to narrow it down...all those who do not want those who work for their money, to be able to keep it.

    and all the others to numerous to mention..

    Posted by YourJomamma at 04/01/2009 @ 12:42pm

44. Report: Netanyahu says 9/11 terror attacks good for Israel

    By Haaretz Service and Reuters

    'The Israeli newspaper Ma'ariv on Wednesday reported that Likud leader Benjamin Netanyahu told an audience at Bar Ilan university that the September 11, 2001 terror attacks had been beneficial for Israel.

    "We are benefiting from one thing, and that is the attack on the Twin Towers and Pentagon, and the American struggle in Iraq," Ma'ariv quoted the former prime minister as saying. He reportedly added that these events "swung American public opinion in our favor." '

    Mossad Motto:

    'By way of deception, thou shalt do war'

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 12:50pm

45. Yes, Mistral, I am waiting for your facts. Send me your facts. Slip your facts in my mailbox. Send them in a plane, direct to my office building. Put them in a rocket and fire them over the border to me. Fax me your facts. Put the facts in an unmarked package and leave it unattended by my door. But keep a straight face, stifle your giggles. Any jokes and you will be punished with abuse greater than that of a Monty Python sketch.

    Posted by HonestLiberal at 04/01/2009 @ 12:53pm

46. Mossad Motto:

    'By way of deception, thou shalt do war'

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 12:50pm

    "We shall fight them on the land, in the air and on the sea.."

    CHURCHILL

    Posted by YourJomamma at 04/01/2009 @ 12:56pm

47. We shall fight them on the land, in the air and on the sea.."

    CHURCHILL

    Posted by YourJomamma at 04/01/2009 @ 12:56pm | ignore this person | warn this person

    MI5 = "Defend the Realm"

    Quite a difference compared to Mossad who believes that both allies and enemies alike are fair game in the use of deception. The Israeli espinonage scandals being a prime example, as well as assassination attempts on our government officials.

    Adaptation of the old saying - 'with friends like we who needs enemies' might be a more appropriate motto for Mossad.

    Posted by OneVote at 04/01/2009 @ 1:08pm

48. Posted by sjchermak at 04/01/2009 @ 12:10pm

    Well, actually, SJ....if somebody wished the worst oo Israel?

    They'd tell them to TAKE Dick Cheney's advice on pretty much anything!

    LOL

    "Fifty billion would be more accurate" (on the cost of the Iraq War in 2003)

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 2:23pm

49. I am certain that I speak on behalf of my entire nation when I say: Today we are all Americans - in grief, as in defiance.

    Benjamin Netanyahu, September 21, 2001

    Posted by sjchermak at 04/01/2009 @ 2:46pm

50. Seymour Hersh, not by any means an objective and at many times not even credible journalist, declares there was a "Cheney assasination team".

    Which doesn't come within a million miles of any acutal proof of such a "team".

    Why are you asking me about something that has not been proven to exist?

    (Oh, I forgot... you ask me about things that have not been proven to exist all the time.... case in point...you keep asking about global warming!)

    Posted by sjchermak at 04/01/2009 @ 12:10pm

    this is the same Sy Hersh who was asked this week by Amy Goodman if Obama was continuing the "assassination squads". To which Hersh replied "How should I know".

    So he can determine it with Cheney, but gives a flippant "How should I know" regarding Obama on the same subject. I think the objective conclusion is that he didn't really know regarding Cheney also.

    Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 2:53pm

51. BTW, again, the global warming debate is over...'cept for the blogs.

    Since no Republican candidate for President from last year into the future, will ever deny it is real, man-made, and needs addressing.

    The Deniers are like 20th Century reenactors of the Civil War.... hoping for a different result this time.

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 2:58pm

52. Since no Republican candidate for President from last year into the future, will ever deny it is real, man-made, and needs addressing.

    The Deniers are like 20th Century reenactors of the Civil War.... hoping for a different result this time.

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 2:58pm

    Given that the hoax is showing itself more and more every day to be just that-a hoax, I doubt any thinking Republican would make the laughable argument for man made global warming in 2012.

    Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 3:18pm

53. I doubt any thinking Republican would make the laughable argument for man made global warming in 2012.----Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 3:18pm

    I gotcha a $1000 if the eventual (not the fringers) GOP nominee in 2012 says it's a hoax or not man-made.

    Shake?

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 3:27pm

54. Actually, there never has been a debate on the Global Warming/Cooling/Climate Change/What ever it is this year.

    That's the problem....ALGORE won't put himself in a public forum position wirh open debate for fear of looking like the fool half of us know he is.... And he can't risk the other half discovering the same truth about him. The agenda is more important than the truth.

    Think the Obamaistas should regulate ALGORES salary? He is the same as Bernie Madolff except with better connections.... And many federal dollars will end up in ALGORES pockets, to save the planet, of course

    Posted by YourJomamma at 04/01/2009 @ 3:29pm

55. I gotcha a $1000 if the eventual (not the fringers) GOP nominee in 2012 says it's a hoax or not man-made.

    Shake?

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 3:27pm

    There are two things I definitely don't do..

    I don't gamble and I don't trust politicians.

    Both are like throwing away your money.

    Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 3:29pm

56. I don't gamble and I don't trust politicians.----Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 3:29pm

    I doubt any thinking Republican would make the laughable argument for man made global warming in 2012.----Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 3:18pm

    Little contradictory there, aren't ya, Lare?

    Don't you even trust Prom Queen Granny of the North???

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 6:54pm

57. I don't know whether to laugh or cry these days when the zionists try to defend themselves against accusations of racism and barbarity. The truth is so brazen and bold faced, the lies so numerous, the racism so arrogant and the murders so numerous that these idiots don't seem to understand the damage they do to The Party when the try to defend the indefensible with more of the same. Wolff Blitzer ain't no match for 90 years of ethnic terrorism.

    Posted by DejaVu at 04/01/2009 @ 7:46pm

58. Little contradictory there, aren't ya, Lare?

    Don't you even trust Prom Queen Granny of the North???

    Posted by Mask at 04/01/2009 @ 6:54pm

    I've said before that ultimately I do not have 100% trust in any politician. That would be an oxymoron.

    Posted by antisocialist at 04/01/2009 @ 9:08pm

59. 'As Uri Avnery, the veteran Israeli writer and peace activist expostulated here furiously in the wake of this last sentence: "Along comes Obama and retrieves from the junkyard the outworn slogan ‘Undivided Jerusalem, the Capital of Israel for all Eternity'. Since Camp David, all Israeli governments have understood that this mantra constitutes an insurmountable obstacle to any peace process. It has disappeared - quietly, almost secretly - from the arsenal of official slogans. No Palestinian, no Arab, no Muslim will make peace with Israel if the Haram-al-Sharif compound (also called the Temple Mount), one of the three holiest places of Islam and the most outstanding symbol of Palestinian nationalism, is not transferred to Palestinian sovereignty. That is one of the core issues of the conflict. On that very issue, the Camp David conference of 2000 broke up."...' -- Alexander Cockburn -- CounterPunch.org -- 13 June 2008

    Posted by HonestLiberal at 04/02/2009 @ 12:40pm

60. Obamanation & the Demoncrats $90 million taxpayer gift should really pay off well for Hamas, Hezzbolah, and Al Queada! Not good for Israel however!

    Chinese-made rockets are being smuggled into the Gaza Strip and are being used to target Israeli cities that had been outside the reach of Hamas' homemade weapons, the head of the Israeli police bomb squad said in a briefing.

    The Hamas arsenal now includes long-range, professional rockets that have been increasingly launched at Israel leading up to and since Israel's invasion of Gaza, dubbed Operation Cast Lead, which began in December.

    Kobi Preger, deputy head of Israel's bomb disposal laboratory, told reporters on Tuesday that the long-range rockets were made by China's military. The 122-millimeter rockets have a range of 25 miles and can reach densely populated Israeli cities. Palestinians also have rockets that can reach Tel Aviv - some 44 miles north of Gaza - but have yet to use them, Preger said.

    "Once you can smuggle, you can smuggle in anything," he said.

    The 122-millimeter rockets pack about 14 pounds of explosives, enough to destroy a house or take out sections of a larger building. One of these rockets destroyed a classroom in a Beer Sheva school. No students were present at the time. The warhead is more than 6 feet long, contains 4,000 steel balls and is powered by a chemical combination of legal pharmacy products, Preger said.

    Palestinians in Gaza have launched some 10,000 rockets at southern Israel since 2001, killing 28 and wounding 1,073, according to The Israel Project. When Hamas' long-range rockets were unveiled late last year, hitting central cities, Israel decided to launch Operation Cast Lead, police spokesman Micky Rosenfeld said.

    Posted by comancheamerican at 04/03/2009 @ 12:05am

61. In Gaza, an entire, extremist system has been reinforced and all factions bolstered," he said, citing a number of al-Qaeda cells and global jihad organizations operating in the coastal strip.

    Obamanation and the Demoncrats sure know how and who to fund to keep hate and terrorism funded!

    Posted by comancheamerican at 04/03/2009 @ 12:07am