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RedditJohn McCain's nomination speech was so flat, so disjointed, so utterly devoid of any vision or affirmative plan for the U.S. -- it's hard to say much about it, other than it sucked. That's basically what CNN's Jeffrey Toobin was driving at when he panned it in historic proportions on Thursday, declaring it the "worst speech by a nominee" since 1980. It was, Toobin added, a "shockingly bad," "boring," "theme-less" train wreck. (More after clip.)
Another pundit, former Bush speechwriter Michael Gerson, said McCain's poor policy emphasis in the speech represented a missed opportunity:
Finally, former Republican White House official and uber-pundit David Gergen criticized McCain's "rerun" of "thin" policies. "I think the country is looking for fresh answers," he said. "It's hard to separate yourself out from President Bush when you essentially have the same economic policies as President Bush."
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it was background noise while i worked...guess i'll check it out later. really that bad?
maybe i'll dream about it...scary...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:17am
yo ari! wassup!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:19am
Here are my thoughts on McCain's speech. Read them or not I don't care. McCain like Kerry is not an attractive candidate. I don't mean just physically he is not a good speaker. He might be better off the cuff but he sounded too much like he was reading. Some of you will say that, that is because he IS reading. However that is what makes a great speech. Someone who can read a speech but sound like they are speaking with passion. Palin did it the night before. Obama did it at his convention. Hillary does it. Bill does it. McCain speaks a lot like G.W. His speeches become one note and uninteresting because he sounds like he is reading even when talking about his family. What he is saying is exactly what I expected him to say and he is saying it like he is reading it which makes for a rather one note speech. I want to hear McCain speak off the cuff because he didn't sound strong when he delivered.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 12:21am
I'd be bitter if I expected a good speech. That was terrible. My uncle who sits in the corner on Thanksgiving drinking vodka and eating flies gives better speeches the next morning.
Chris Matthews has always gotten that tingle up his leg when he is around McCain. That's why most shots are done from the waste up.
But I agree with you, this race is over. Obama will have the electoral college wrapped up before Oregon is counted. Which is not terribly exciting to me, but it is better than McCain.
Posted by onthehelm at 09/05/2008 @ 12:24am
Posted by frankgrits at 09/05/2008 @ 12:20am
Of course Frank feels it is the best thing since sliced bread.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 12:24am
I think this is an over statement. This wasn't a bad speech. It was just very "read".
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 12:25am
from what i heard it wasnt bad. guess i missed the stumbles and boring stuff.
good fer grampa!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:30am
I began watching McCain's speech with a fairly neutral mindset --I am firmly confident that he's fighting an increasingly uphill battle even after Palin's supposed success the night before.
What I witnessed dovetails tightly with what Toobin said. I was semi-shocked that the Republicans let McCain deliver such a dead-weight speech.
Did anyone work with him in a practice run to give him some pointers? Did anyone try to help add some oratorical spice?
Wow!
That speech has perhaps given the Repugs at least the creeping suspicion that Palin should in fact head the ticket --and I would love to see that happen if only to watch the ship go under with even more ferocious speed.
Hello President Obama.
Now get us the hell out of Iraq......AND Afghanistan.
New campaign slogan:
YES WE CAN.....GET OUT of Iraq and Afghanistan!
Posted by b_kool_66 at 09/05/2008 @ 12:34am
wow - gergen, eh?
well it IS all about the IDEOLOGY, STUPID! LOL
you can dress a pig up in a thong bikini but i still wouldn't want to (insert your own verb here) it!
they're still spouting out the same stale rightwing ideology-presented-as-facts as always and i hate to say it, but i think that will shine through the glitz and dog and pony show...or poked pig show...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:37am
"i hate to say it"
not really - optimism is a heady drug...but so is pessimism.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:39am
maybe this is the republican version of the "malaise" speech...
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:47am
Posted by frankgrits at 09/05/2008 @ 12:47am | ignore this person | warn this person
fight fight fight, fight fight fight....the itchy and scratchy show!!!
Posted by ibbleblibble at 09/05/2008 @ 12:48am
The fuzz will quickly wear off of tis cheap velvet painting of Elvis, the (Choke) change candidate. Gerson hit the nail on the head.
Quite frankly, I'm not into hero worship. Time for an innovator. With al due respect, Soldier/Presidents seldom leave a lasting impression.
Also, this countyr can't take a gamble on his health and age and leave the country in the control of a snake handler.
Posted by tulipan at 09/05/2008 @ 01:04am
I watched the speech with some die-hard Republican friends of mine. The room came unglued when McCain stumbled over the word "illiterate" when he attempted to say "Teach an illiterate adult to read". Eventually, they were begging him to wrap it up. They couldn't stand to listen to him anymore. I, of course, was laughing my ass off through most of it. That said...
...it was a horrible speech. You'd think after 20 years, he'd be a bit more polished, but he was simply...awful. Nothing new, no content, no vision, no specifics, no plan; simply championing change by promising the same old shit. It would have been funny if it hadn't been so painful.
Happy: The smile is creepy and he needs to stop it. He's scaring the children.
Posted by Balrog at 09/05/2008 @ 01:08am
TOM BROKAW: But the fact is, governor, that you have had eight years of a bush administration and a lot of Republicans in Congress for the last eight years, so why wouldn't the american people say, look they had their shot we're going to change?
TOM RIDGE: Because John Bush - because John McCain is very much his own man...
BWAH-hahahahaha!!!!
Posted by Balrog at 09/05/2008 @ 01:12am
Give it up..we are never leaving Iraq or Afganistan in your life time..
Posted by JOMAMMA at 09/05/2008 @ 01:02am
my god!
you actually posted something that makes sense.
you might not leave, but you may get kicked out.
and have a $20,000,000,000,000 debt to pay back to china, saudi arabia, russia and others.
Foreign owners of US Treasury Securities (April 2008)
Nation billions of dollars
Japan 592.2 China, Mainland 502 United Kingdom 251.4 Oil Exporters 153.9 Brazil 149.5 Carib Bnkng Cntrs 115.4 Luxembourg 84.8 Hong Kong 63.1 Russia 60.2 Norway 45.3 Germany 44 Taiwan 42.6 Switzerland 42.5 Korea 40.5 Mexico 38 Singapore 33.3 Turkey 31.1 Thailand 27.9 Canada 24 Ireland 18.5 Netherlands 15.5 Sweden 13.1 Egypt 12.7 Belgium 12.5 Poland 12.5 Italy 10.6 India 10.5 All Other 154.2 Grand Total 2601.8
ENJOY!
(actually, this really pisses me off because it means more inflation here, too.)
mexico?!?!?!?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 01:16am
All in all, a good night for the country.
Posted by JOMAMMA at 09/05/2008 @ 01:07am
and a bad night for planet earth.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 01:18am
"I have the record and the scars to prove it,"
please, america.
not again.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 01:40am
http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/archives/20
08/09/9598_mccain_acceptance_speech_republican_convention.html
excellent post by mr. corn.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 01:44am
Are we surprised that he was fifth from the bottom of his class at the Naval Academny?
Posted by bobforer at 09/05/2008 @ 01:46am
Same old.
Surprised?
Peggy Noonan was right, it's over.
Now, how about focusing on key senate & house races, dear Nation editors, where the real battles are.
Posted by sloper at 09/05/2008 @ 01:50am
Strangely enough, I actually really liked McCain's speech. I'll grant to Gerson that there might have been more emphasis on policy specificities, but frankly, I'm just not sure that's what the speech needed to be about. What he needed to address, most fundamentally, was the big picture and not the individualized details, and I think he did a very good job of that.
I just have to disagree about the characterizations of his speaking style. Did he stumble a couple times? Sure, and that is a legitimate flaw. But overall, I thought that a lot of the speech DIDN'T come across as wooden in the way some commentators suggest (and the "didn't really raise arms much"...yeah, that would be because of torture).
What appealed to me most was the resurgence of his maverickness. In a room full of Republican party loyalists, he had no problem calling out the party for its failures and saying that Republicans have been corrupt, and have recently failed the American people in important ways. I respect that a lot, and everything in his record indicates that he means it. He had no problem calling out Rumsfeld from the very beginning, and has been attacking wastefulness within the Republican party all throughout his campaign. He also called for a more civilized conversation in a room that apparently was paid per "USA" chant.
I'll be honest: up until this point, I've been leaning more and more in the direction of Obama. I think I still lean in that direction (especially with Biden on the ticket), but the speech tonight has put me back in the somewhat-undecided column.
Posted by Thrawn at 09/05/2008 @ 02:24am
What appealed to me most was the resurgence of his maverickness.
Posted by Thrawn at 09/05/2008 @ 02:24am
What doesn't appeal to me is that it's been dormant for four years. I don't trust him.
Posted by Balrog at 09/05/2008 @ 03:04am
"I have no doubt anymore about the outcome of this election. Obama simply is no match for John McCain."
And given your track record of predictions, I think that's pretty much seals it in favor of Obama.
Posted by brunowe at 09/05/2008 @ 03:46am
Maybe it was too far past his bedtime?
What a wooden, monotone delivery!
He reminded me of those automatons that perform a free show in the Ceasar's Mall in vegas. Creeeeepy!!
Horrible delivery aside...The idea that he is invoking change as a theme for his administration is such a joke. He voted with W almost all the time. He's agreed to keep W's tax cuts for the rich. McCain made a comment about how he will target pork spending. But, the sassy Gov. Palin persued pork spending for her town when mayor. She Also supported the poster child of pork spending, the "Bridge To Nowhere."
Posted by koroviev at 09/05/2008 @ 04:53am
NOMINATE IS ENOUGH
NEWSWIRE--The Republican National convention has ended.
As delegates don't capture me, And speakers seldom rapture me, I've wandered some, as my attention'll do:
Tonight, I'm thrilled the network news Will reach beyond two-party views, And give to me, my unconventional due.
www.newsandverse.com Light verse, ripped from the headlines
Posted by newsandverse at 09/05/2008 @ 07:15am
I do not condemn Sarah Palin for:
1) Becoming pregnant at a late age, and not aborting a known Downs Syndrome fetus. That is her right as an American.
2) Continuing her job as Governor, and/or Running for Vice President. Her children appear to have been adequately cared for since infancy. Like many working Americans woman, she has successfully relied upon the help of a spouse, older children, friends, neighbors, other family members, and sitters. Nothing wrong or usual about that.
3) Raising her children with a religious philosophy that condemns abortion, anything but abstinence only sex education, an abhorrence to birth control, and a literal interpretation of the Bible. That is her Constitutional Right as an American.
4) That her 17 year old child is unmarried, pregnant, and intends to give birth and raise the child. It happens to over a million teenage American girls each and every year, and while not the best of all possible worlds, it is a frequent and understandable result of human sexual instinct.
However, and because we live in the great Constitutional Democracy known as American, I do condemn her for attempting to force her personal religious beliefs, and her narrowly construed philosophy regarding sex education, birth control, marriage, abortion, et al. upon the rest of us. While personal religious beliefs and family life should be "off limits" in the American political arena, when one specifically chooses those things as a "plank" of a political campaign, and wears them on a sleeve, the proverbial "barn door" has been irreversibly opened, and is subject to fair comment. .
Yes, Sarah, like the majority of Americans women, you are the proud mother of a typical, and beautiful family. Everything else about your family is
Posted by bobforer at 09/05/2008 @ 08:02am
(con't) is irrelevant, immaterial, and off limits... but nonetheless frightening in that, if you were Queen, all Americans would be legally compelled to "Be like Sarah."
No thanks. Go away, and leave the rest of us be. We have Constitutional rights, too.
Posted by bobforer at 09/05/2008 @ 08:03am
Dillweed. if you're out there, save this post because I'm going to want you to repost it on the Weds after election day.----Posted by frankgrits at 09/05/2008 @ 12:30am
Oh, I will, FRANK. More than happy to give you (and other PUMAs) the credit for a McCain victory that you so richly deserve.
I'll also save all this lavish praise you have put out for McCain and Palin....for 2010, 2011, and especially 2012....
since it's guarenteed (if Obama loses and Hillary is the nom in '12)...
you'll contradict yourself MASSIVELY.
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 08:48am
BTW, ignoring FRANK (who's insane with cultish obsession)...
I note ....TEPID praise from HAPPY and MAASCH.
"good speech"? "I wish I could give as good a speech at 72" Not "Reaganesque"? Not "inspiring"?
Again, I think they know ...it was "kinder, gentler"-2008 redux. And they SURE hated THAT speech 20 years ago.
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 08:50am
FrankGrits-If Hillary had won you would be on here calling McCain/Palin fascists,like you did before Hillary lost.Why you come on here to lie is beyond comprehension and all I can think of is that you want attention,like all kids who are having a tantrum.
Posted by i'm nobody at 09/05/2008 @ 09:04am
Posted by i'm nobody at 09/05/2008 @ 09:04am
I'M, you need to be more subtle...or ask FRANK "the Question"...i.e.
"After 4 years as Veep, if McCain steps down and Palin is the GOP nominee....who'll be more qualified to be President in 2012...Sarah or Hillary?"
Again, FG will HAVE to contradict himself (he knows we'll save his post)...he'll HAVE to start DOWN-playing Palin and coming up with how "Co-President for 8 years" is "better" than actual VICE-President for 4....but in doing so, he'll contradict himself over just the past week.
Direct assaults on his insane obsession with "getting '12 for Hillary" don't work...he just lies and claims he "supports McCain/Palin and always did like McCain".
Put him in a box on a "Palin v. Clinton 2012" scenario...and he'll be like a rabid weasel who eats his own tail!
heheh
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 09:18am
Mask-Frank hides from me so I can't ask him questions.All I can do is keep him honest by reminding him of what his real views are.
Posted by i'm nobody at 09/05/2008 @ 09:21am
Mask-At first I thought that Frank was a kid because of the way he kept referring to the GOP as fascists and was surprised to discover that he was older.
Posted by i'm nobody at 09/05/2008 @ 09:24am
jomamma-Pandering to evangelicals hardly shows that McCain is heading in a new direction.That's just politics, as usual.
Posted by i'm nobody at 09/05/2008 @ 09:44am
I'll be honest: up until this point, I've been leaning more and more in the direction of Obama. I think I still lean in that direction (especially with Biden on the ticket), but the speech tonight has put me back in the somewhat-undecided column.
Posted by Thrawn at 09/05/2008 @ 02:24am
i always thought you were human.
think pragmatically. mccain's economic proposals will swell national debt more than obama's.
that means more inflation. and you know what that means.
plus, if he starts yet ANOTHER war.............
"You might therefore say that when it comes to Iraq, President Bush is just enforcing the McCain-Lieberman policy."
joe lieberman, 2003
<<<<<>>>>>
you said the generalities were important to you.
well, don't vote fear. vote hope. (that felt real icky writing that but hey, mr. mccain frightens me.)
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 09:49am
"Old Man McCain made some gutsy calls, divorced himself from Bush and is heading out on a little different direction, recognized by those of us who are watching him and Palin..of course, those here do not see a difference and dont care...they were never the target of McCain in any case... I do believe if he gets a true lead he will not lose it"
No, he divorced himself from his first wife during the middle of an affair. Not that this matters, but he has not divorced himself from Bush as recognized by his voting record, and that's all the Obama campaign has to do--emphasize that he is no different from Bush.
As to you believing if he gets a true lead he will not lose it, I used to believe in unicorns, or god for that matter. Lost 'em both.
Posted by onthehelm at 09/05/2008 @ 09:51am
Posted by Thrawn at 09/05/2008 @ 02:24am
While I see your point Thrawn I just think McCain is not a great orator. Like I said I think he does better when not giving speeches. We will see what real people have to say about the speech not pundits but I think he isn't a great speaker. I don't mean that about the stumbles either because everyone stumbles. I just think he has a very GW style of speaking which ends up sounding very read.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 09:51am
I do believe if he gets a true lead he will not lose it
Posted by JOMAMMA at 09/05/2008 @ 09:27am
oh go sniff your money.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 09:53am
Posted by Thrawn at 09/05/2008 @ 02:24am
Also I don't know if I would be so quick to say that he is bringing back the maverickness. I think it is important to read the platform he is running on and there is nothing maverick about that platform.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 09:54am
I seem to be more of a political animal than others my age around here but that said,I tried to stay away from all of the theater of the conventions and tried not to watch the drivel being spewed forth for the benefit of propaganda. Being in the twin cities area and keeping abreast of the way of government actions towards commoners protesting, or in this case, trying to protest, and others, trying to document the government's abuse of power, I'm not surprised that a "splitter group" got away with property destruction. (Sounds similar to Montreal.) Funny how the media didn't have any of those people uncovered to show us the identities? That said, my mind has been made up long before any of these conventions were even planned. John Bush is what is wrong with this nation's government and more of the same won't make it better for us, or the rest of the world. My mind was made up long ago. Trotting out some twisted bible banging person with a vagina won't phase me in the least as to whom I'm going to vote for. It just cements my thoughts.
Posted by Jay Coleman at 09/05/2008 @ 10:03am
I do believe if he gets a true lead he will not lose it----Posted by JOMAMMA at 09/05/2008 @ 09:27am
Hedging your bets, MAASCH?
Yesterday you said McCain in a landslide.
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 10:30am
All the republicans have done is take a page out of OBAMA's Campaign Strategy. They were DESPERATE to get noticed- CHANGE always wins over experience and MCcaine jumped on the bandwagon and PALIN is merely a dummy with a ventriloquist up her back. They are hiding her from the press because she is just NOT ready for this GAME. If she was ready she would be made accessible and it is not right that they are attacking the media who is merely the voice of the people. People want to know. They made fun of Obama's Theatrics yet McCaine walked out on that platform with lights out and loud voice over as if he was coming out in the superbowl. It was a chess move and no doubt if made some noise let's hope that AMERICA is not stupid enough to be dazzled and distracted by the "making of history" razzle dazzle and look beyond. He'll do anything to win and it seems to me that he is on a vendetta. McCaine is very militant - and is using the scare tactic by displaying footage of 9/11 - all it did was remind me that we were in the wrong war. Yes, He is ready to fight but without any diplomacy - he is ready to fight just to fight - he will make decisions based on extreme radical AMERICAN HONOR - HE is a bully. This scares me especially when he used the words FIGHT 25 times in his speech last night and was a POW for 5 years. Most POWs have serious psychological issues and what would make McCaine any different. His temperament should be questioned. It has been observed that he has an explosive temper. That's not putting country first. I don't trust it.
Posted by RosaPeart at 09/05/2008 @ 10:46am
I think this is going to be a landslide.
Posted by frankgrits at 09/05/2008 @ 12:20am
Frank, two things to notice from this comment. One is that you don't think. The other is that you've gone from being a Hillary Clinton supporter (republican lite) to an outright conservative war loving republican moron. You want to put a hot tempered, not clear thinking man in charge of the button? Keep in mind that the situation boiling in Georgia could turn into something a lot uglier down the road.
Do you want to start a war with Russia so that defense contractors can make money selling missile radar systems to ex-Soviet countries? W and Cheney just recently delared that we give 1 billion dollars to Georgia? Why? Now we have to support Georgia, Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Pakistan, Ukraine...and on and on? Pull your head out man.
This country needs to spend it's money on infrastructure, American jobs, American medical costs, American Education and American Senior Citizens. Not Frigging weapons systems for other countries.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/05/2008 @ 11:17am
The Obama express is already stalled and about to derail
Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 10:50am
at your peril.
mccain means fewer jobs, bigger government and even more debt than obama.
oh well.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/05/2008 @ 11:27am
"who can stand up to others.
McCain can"
Until, LL, he decided that to be president he needed to be a different McCain from the one that ran in 2000. So he has flip-flopped on the Bush tax cuts, actually pushed a faux-populist measure like the gas tax holiday and cozied up to an evangelical wing he once called "agents of intolerance".
Posted by brunowe at 09/05/2008 @ 11:28am
with 6.1% unemployment most since 91 recession, looming hurricanes to remind voters about GOP incompetence, GOP is trying hard to make this "about character, NOT issues"....
However, if there is ever to be any "straight talk" then let's tell it now:
Sen Obama, despite GOP lies, has proposed a permanent $500 per worker/$1000 per two worker family tax credit to offset payroll taxes; bottom line being more $$$ in our pockets.
Under sen mccain, despite GOP lies, there is a new tax on employer-provided health insurance plans together with a new tax credit that does not rise with the cost of health insurance.
Health insurance expenditures have been rising much more rapidly than overall inflation; therefore the tax increase to consumers under mccain, as health costs gets passed on to consumers, will rise much faster than proposed tax credits---resulting in a net loss for tens of millions of middle class workers in this country...
bottom line: GOP and mccain "do not get it"...it is all smoke and mirrors.....
any questions????
btw: there are 20,000 anti-war peace activists marching on GOP convention, despite the commie news network only talking about a hundred or so "violent" protesters arrested...NEUTRAL media please.....
Posted by jrs112 at 09/05/2008 @ 11:30am
The Obama express is already stalled and about to derail Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 10:50am |
Really? The gap between Obama and McCain is bigger than it has been in a long time so I don't know where you are getting your information. Crazy old LVL just making things up.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 11:32am
Posted by JOMAMMA at 09/05/2008 @ 11:49am
Is there some "fine distinction" between McCain winning in a landslide and "Obama losing big"?!??!?!
I now think Obama will lose...and lose big.----Posted by JOMAMMA at 09/04/2008 @ 10:08pm
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 12:02pm
I could've given a better speech for McPOWhowmanyMANSIONS.
All he had to do was ask...
It was truly embarrassing.
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/05/2008 @ 12:31pm
Wow - so much conservative action on The Nation's blogs. Amazing. Do progressives blog as fiercely on conservative web sites? The conservative presence in The Nation is both a tribute to its commitment to free speech, and a conundrum regarding why conservatives love to read and blog The Nation.
It's easy math despite the blowhard verbiage constantly on display in The Nation's blogs. Liked the 8 years of Cheney/Bush? Then vote Palin/McCain you'll get 4 more of the same. Want a change in a positive direction? Vote Obama/Biden.
Posted by guanabana at 09/05/2008 @ 12:38pm
Next question? Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 12:57pm
I like how you ignore the gallup poll. The CNN poll. The Rasmussen poll. Gallup has it at 49 Obama 42 McCain.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 1:05pm
Next question? Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 12:57pm
You also ignore the fact that Palin's speech launched Democrats into a spurt of giving. Obama made 8 million dollars in less than 24 hours after her speech.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 1:07pm
Yeah, a new Gallup's got McPOWhowmanyMANSIONS at a whopping 1% bounce from 9/1-9/5; going from 43% to 44%...
That's really scary bad.
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/05/2008 @ 1:22pm
"It's no surprise that people like you Ari and Toobin who have so much invested in the messiah would be very bitter tonight. You should have listened to me." Posted by frankgrits at 09/05/2008 @ 12:28am
The irony speaks for itself. Characterizing someone as a "messiah" in one breath and asserting "you should have listened to me" in the next is astonishing. Despite being demonstrably wrong about everything, frankgrits still views himself as the only source of truth - that's messianic behavior! Frank, I'm no longer concerned about your vote, I'm concerned about you as a human being and the members of your family/community. Regardless of your vote, please seek professional help if you haven't already. www.apa.org is a good starting point. Though I disagree with you politically, I honestly wish you the best of luck personally.
Posted by Be Good at 09/05/2008 @ 1:27pm
Almost 1600 people voted for Sarah Palin in her two runs for mayor of Wasilla. I'm sure this great speech by McCain influenced at least that many voters to pull the Ailin'/McPain lever.
Posted by nathanhale at 09/05/2008 @ 2:03pm
Oh and I'm sure he was just sitting on the edge of his seat waiting to be validated by a religious fundamentalist.
Posted by madlib at 09/05/2008 @ 2:01pm
Not only that, but the CBS poll the Liver is talking about has to come in question. Noing Liver, CBS may very well stand for Christian Broadcasting Sytem.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/05/2008 @ 2:08pm
No acknowledgment that you were wrong and that I didn't make up my statement. Furthermore, Gallup and CNN data is from last week (8/31). CBS is today. Rasmussen today also works against you.
Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 1:32pm
Uhh that's not true at all LVL. The Gallup poll is daily.
And what do I have to apologize for? You based your entire arguement on ONE national poll instead of the 3 others that say that it isn't 42-42. The CBS poll also ISN'T from today as you so incorrectly stated. I looked up on the CBS site when the poll is from I recommend you do the same. It doesn't fully reflect Obama's bump which didn't take till Wednesday. So maybe you should be apologizing.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 2:21pm
Bushfools always seems to have trouble with numbers.
On 9/1 it was 50-42 Obama
On 9/5 it is 48-44 Obama
Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 2:02pm
¬,¬ˇ , you may want to actually cite where you got your numbers as I'm getting mine straight from Gallup:
September 1, 2008
Gallup Daily: Obama Maintains 6-Point Lead, 49% to 43%
http://tinyurl.com/5lwgjy
&&&&&
September 5, 2008
Gallup Daily: Obama's Lead Now at 4 Points
PRINCETON, NJ -- Gallup Poll Daily tracking from Tuesday through Thursday finds Barack Obama with a four-percentage-point lead over John McCain in the presidential preferences of registered voters, 48% to 44%.
http://tinyurl.com/58wy79
Yep, this isn't even considering the god awful new con repub continue dic'tatorship exception convection schtick McPOWhowmanyMANIONS stumbled through.
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/05/2008 @ 2:36pm
CBN is one of the finest news organizations around! Where else would I find out when and why I'm going to hell? Or why we deserve 9/11 for being a bunch of faggy girly men?
Posted by madlib at 09/05/2008 @ 2:17pm
Why of course. Hey, living out here in Georgia, on the standard cable version I purhcase, about one third of the channels offered tell me I'm going to hell in a handbasket...mostly because I don't vote republican, but also because well, I'm not cut from the same neo conservative christian cloth they're cut from. Who knew Jesus was such a narrow minded fellow.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/05/2008 @ 3:01pm
Does the Gallup tracking poll show Obama's lead cut in half or is it made up?
Posted by lvliberty1 at 09/05/2008 @ 2:54pm
No it doesn't It shows Obama at 48 McCain at 42. Obama's biggest lead during this bump was 9 points.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 3:04pm
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/05/2008 @ 3:01pm
On CBN, Jesus has been co-opted by the militarism of Bibleman
Posted by nathanhale at 09/05/2008 @ 3:05pm
On top of that LVL. McCain has yet to go UP. McCain has stayed stagnant at 42 points. Obama has fluctuated up and down but McCain has stayed stagnant. You need to look deeper than the surface number. Obviously those supporters aren't going TO McCain. Obviously this talk of galvanizing the base isn't much of anything either because his numbers have no increased.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/05/2008 @ 3:06pm
I think being a great speaker is EVERYTHING....
Forget foreign policy, a spine, some concept of what the private sector does for the country, the realization that there are people on this globe that will saw your head off with a rusty serrated knife just because you're an American....
Yeah, I'd much rather have a great speaker....
(You know, it's been written that Lincoln was a terrible public speaker..... If we had television in the 1860's...maybe the south would've been allowed to secede... if Lincoln really was a poor speaker.... Then.. Obama would be a shoe-in as the south would be a different, albeit backwards, country. And wouldn't be included in the US's presidential elections..)
Posted by bleedingheart at 09/05/2008 @ 3:15pm
hey frangrits: You mean Reagan, the great orator/celebrity? I thought those were bad qualities.
Posted by swarming21 at 09/05/2008 @ 3:18pm
McCain-Palin have resorted to the Lee Atwater/Karl Rove bottom-feeding, Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt invoking tactics in their pursuit of the Presidency. This is a real testament to the level of shear desperation that the GOP has embraced that Senator McCain's once truly 'maverick' approach to nearly every major topic has been sacrificed on the altar of politics. As the Economist clearly stated, I would have much preferred McCain One to this current iteration of a once worthy and provocative politician.
Senator McCain's speech, and the rest of the convention sentiment can be summed up thusly: "God, Guns, and Greed".
"God" - as in Fearing, an attempt to lock in the ever-shrinking 'base' of voters who cling to this dogmatic, idealistic view of the U.S. It's quite clear that any vacancies on the Supreme Court will truly result in their being filled by those who seek to deny Americans the VERY RIGHT that Governor Palin and her Daughter Bristol exercised in the "decision" (key word, since this pro-Life, anti-choice crowd seeks to impose their will on the electorate) to have their respective children for different reasons...hypocrisy only begins to describe this perspective.
"Guns" - We're NOT electing the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff come 04 November, though you'd think we were based upon the aggressively militaristic, how-dare-anyone-question-our-definition-of-Patriotism approach to Service as outlined by the despicably insensitive statements made by nearly all of the speakers this past week, most especially the denigrating remarks concerning Community Service, perhaps the most ubiquitous form of selfless service to others.
"Greed" - "Screw the lot of you" would seem to be the primary economic themes of the GOP convention, as in "We've Got Ours...Tough" was the extent of their serious intent in dealing with the very real issues that even the Children of those who abide by this thought will have to confront in the future. Such selfish and self-interested economic perspectives are just the type of recipe for disaster that have been imposed on this country at least since 2000.
I am grateful that so many of us are keeping a close and interested eye on this election, and that my hope that the 'right' decision will be made come the election in November. Obama-Biden is not a perfect solution by a long shot, but one that offers a view into a bright future amid the realization that we've much to confront and honestly resolve along the way.
Posted by wckoenig at 09/05/2008 @ 3:46pm
This averaging poll looks pretty good:
http://www.pollster.com/polls/us/08-us-pres-ge-mvo.php
Posted by hsuBfools at 09/05/2008 @ 4:03pm
Ms. Palin sounded like George Bush in drag, and I didn't want to have a beer with him either. Her sneering sarcasm did nothing to endear her to me even if we share the same plumbing. Selling Alaska to the highest oil bidder doesn't sound like much of a steward of state to me... oh well, the bears and ground squirrels don't vote, and then there's the tundra, who cares, a veritable wasteland of empty space so who cares about a few oil leaks from the pipeline or a few thousand acres to be drilled. Are we all only concerned with conspicuous consumption? My mother used to say: "don't SH*T where you live", so unless there is another planet for us to move to and inhabit and ravage and destroy, perhaps we should think first about taking care of this one. Let's try to keep our own home habitable before we fill our living rooms with SH*T and drown in it. Apparently, the elites have a plan and it doesn't include anyone of my ilk, I only have one home and it came with wheels. Does it sound like class warfare? I have no objection to anyone rich and I don't even want their money, as long as they don't bury me in their crap. I would like them to stop telling me that drilling is a good thing, when it destroys the planet, pollutes the groundwater and one cannot breath the air, when it makes pockets of dead ocean in the Gulf... so stop telling us to DRILL, DRILL, DRILL trying to frighten the populace and pretend it's out of anything except GREED and AVARICE. I figured it out, it's not good for people or our country... and that's just a View from My Trailer Park. Thank you. MJ Richards
Posted by mcjorich at 09/05/2008 @ 4:08pm
Have you considered trying harder?
Posted by madlib at 09/05/2008 @ 3:30pm
At what? Going to hell? According the likes of Liver, I don't need to try harder, I'm on my way.
Personally, I think if there is a God and there's a heaven and hell, the folks who will have the explaining to do are the ones who: instigate war to profit from it, allow people to starve so they can buy the 2nd, 3rd, 4th home, think that because their parents are rich they are entitled to wealth and other's sole existence is to serve them. Lie, cheat, steal, smear others and do whatever is possible to gain an edge.
You'd think that if there is a God, that god would have a little better sense of justice than that of the neocons.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/05/2008 @ 4:24pm
frankgrits
Bitter? plow over Obama? A landslide? Have you lost your mind? I urge you to visit us on Planet Earth. McCains speech is what probably most people expected a snorefest showcasing mostly his lack of personality. Caribou barbie is such a disaster they are hiding her from the press in total panic. she is OBVIOUSLY a not ready for prime time playa
Posted by solonaz at 09/05/2008 @ 5:44pm
lvliberty1
Apparantly you dont need a president who can. Keep his positions strait. Remember on Monday what he said on Saturday, fly a plane, tell the truth, make sense, or make a decent pick for VP. Of course you dont. As a brainwashed Republican all you need is for Rush to tell you he is the guy.
Posted by solonaz at 09/05/2008 @ 5:59pm
grits, you gotta be kidding.
although i'm not a big fan of the republican party, i've always been a fan of mccain. i was actually rooting for him to at least get a hit if not knock it out of the ball park. his style was so stilted. he paused after every sentence waiting for applause, which was dutifully given to him to keep him from looking silly up there waiting for it. and the applause lines were "america is a great country" "we're gonna do it this time" "life is wonderful". who's not gonna applause??? badly done and wayyyyyy too much reference to the POW thing. i admire what he did in vietnam but they did what everybody warned them about - mention it and move on. it was the main theme of the video before the speech and it was the main theme of the speech itself. and the technical embarrassments didn't help. how can you say it was a great speech and there's gonna be a landslide. as my dear, Navy chief father would ask back in the day - "what the hell you been smoking?"
Posted by dcaprita at 09/05/2008 @ 7:45pm
What was with that mansion shown on the backdrop? Was that one of his 8 houses?
Posted by Balrog at 09/05/2008 @ 8:57pm
Amazing how they got the lips of John McCain's corpse to move in such a lifelike manner. Unfortunately, the rest of the speech was a total failure. He couldn't even make himself heard over the idiot nationalists chanting USA.
Posted by sandersh at 09/05/2008 @ 9:05pm
The Face: Did anybody see that picture on the Net showing McCain's goiter. Wow, that mfer has gotten huge! Goiter-face. He really does look scary.
Posted by jazzfan at 09/05/2008 @ 10:39pm
Posted by solonaz at 09/05/2008 @ 5:44pm
Okay, officially changing my mind on Palin's nick....I did like "Miss Congeniality" (both for irony and because she WAS)...
now like "Caribou Barbie"!
BTW, can McCain be "GI-Geriatric"?
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 10:43pm
sted by solonaz at 09/05/2008 @ 5:44pm |
Posted by dcaprita at 09/05/2008 @ 7:45pm
BTW, guys, you must be new.
FRANKGRITS is our local rabid Hillary Clinton cultist.
He is desperately trying to get McCain elected, because if Obama is elected...he WILL be the nominee in 2012 and 2012 is Hillary's last shot at it.
FG has, in just six months, gone from a solid anti-war, anti-Republican Democrat.....to a racist right-winger who spouts Limbaugh talking points.
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 10:49pm
"Frank, two things to notice from this comment. One is that you don't think. The other is that you've gone from being a Hillary Clinton supporter (republican lite) to an outright conservative war loving republican moron."
____________________________________ Why even dignify Grits with a response. He is a myth, just like the media created PUMAS. Sure, there were a handful of unsophisticated, juvenile, and misguided women who supported Hillary simply because of her vagina. But subsequent to the terrifying revelation of Palin, ice, I doubt more than three of them are still around. And my guess is that Grits is not one of those three.
I don't think its outlandish to suggest Grits is actually a yellow-dog Republican who lurks and yells with a view, however misguided, to "swing" former Hillary supporters. Laughable, truly laughable.
Ignore him. He will eventually go away.
Posted by bobforer at 09/06/2008 @ 12:33am
Ignore him. He will eventually go away.
Posted by bobforer at 09/06/2008 @ 12:33am No, He's very much like cancer, once he's there, he's damn hard to get rid of.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/06/2008 @ 12:37am
He's very much like cancer, once he's there, he's damn hard to get rid of.
Posted by Wolfgang1 at 09/06/2008 @ 12:37am
i have excised him.
Posted by frosty zoom at 09/06/2008 @ 01:04am
Posted by frankgrits at 09/05/2008 @ 12:28am
Obviously you were not watching the same speech as everyone else.
McCain had nothing to say! Where is the change? What are his policies? ZERO!
If I hear about McCain's hero status anymore I'll puke. He was not the lone ranger at the Hanoi Hilton. He's the son and grandson of two admirals who, after his release, looked like a great bet for public office. Fact is ... he was a screw up and very few like the dick at the Academy.
But the bottom line is; are we better off today than we were 8 years ago? Ha. And does anyone really believe that a man who has the poor judgment to bring on an inexperienced gov. from Alaska can be trusted in the white house? I can't believe it's being considered!
Your candidates are a joke and your convention was possibly the most uninspired I've ever witnessed.
The jokes flying around behind the scenes ..... ha
Posted by Hoot at 09/06/2008 @ 01:18am
just wait 'till Hillary hits the campaign trail...she'll have barracuda for breakfast.
Posted by nursevic at 09/06/2008 @ 02:25am
Posted by Maskdelta at 09/05/2008 @ 10:43pm
LOL .. "Caribou Barbie". That's keeper my friend
ALL: Did you know that John McSame borrowed heavily from Dumbya's 2000 GOP speech. Watch this (the last couple mins)
http://tinyurl.com/6g7voa
Posted by leftofcenter at 09/06/2008 @ 08:22am
Let me suggest "shitfan"! Posted by 2HAPPY at 09/05/2008 @ 11:59pm
Agreed. The man has been around a long time we don't need to make shallow comments about his appearence.
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 09/07/2008 @ 12:30pm