The Notion

Height of Hypocrisy

posted by Ari Berman on 09/29/2006 @ 5:12pm

Rep. Mark Foley co-chaired the House Caucus on Missing and Exploited Children.

So it's particularly sickening that Foley suddenly resigned from the House today after details emerged that he'd kept up a highly questionable e-mail correspondence with a 16-year-old male page in his office, who dubbed the exchanges, "sick sick sick sick sick sick."

Talk about the height of hypocrisy.

Here are the emails.

And ABC News just released excerpts of instant messenges exchanged between Foley and another underage male page.

Foley asked the teen, "Do I make you a little horny?" When the kid responded, "a little," Foley wrote, "Cool."

Foley has been a leading proponent of cracking down on pedophiles. He should start with himself.

Comments (130)

  1. all i gotta say is: that is SO republican of him

    Posted by darladoon at 09/29/2006 @ 5:16pm

  2. Is this what GOPers mean by "family values"?

    Posted by BlueTexan at 09/29/2006 @ 5:18pm

  3. Rep. Mark Foley co-chaired the House Caucus on Missing and Exploited Children.

    Those Republicans will use any advantage - even chairing a committee that gives them a leg up on the competition!

    Posted by Turk33 at 09/29/2006 @ 5:35pm

  4. Throw the prick in jail...period.

    Since we're using the broad brush here regarding Republicans, remember...Republicans usually fight so that kids can be born in the first place.

    Posted by Sliver at 09/29/2006 @ 5:38pm

  5. .

    DO YOU FUCKING GET IT NOW?

    DO YOU FUCKING UNDERSTAND HOW BLACKMAIL HAS PLAYED A ROLE IN EVERYTHING THAT HAS TRANSPIRED SINCE BUSH TOOK OFFICE?

    DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE VALUE OF BEING ABLE TO WIRETAP WITHOUT A WARRANT?

    HOW LONG HAS ISRAEL KNOWN THIS INFORMATION ABOUT FOLEY?

    WHY DOES CONGRESS VOTE WITH ISRAEL ON EVERYTHING?

    WHY DO YOU THINK ONLY MEN OF LOW MORAL CHARACTER ARE PUT INTO THE SYSTEM IN THE FIRST PLACE?

    GET A CLUE AMERICA.

    BLACKMAIL IN D.C. IS RAMPANT.

    WHO CONTROLS THE WIRETAPS?

    ISRAEL DOES:

    LOOK AT THIS ENTIRE 4 PART SERIES ON FOX:

    Now can you help me out with a plausible explanation for this:

    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7545.htm

    GET A CLUE!!!!

    Hey Joe, what's the deal with Mossad Operative Kobi Alexander?

    He donated $2,000 to you.

    Jacob "Kobi" Alexander, the Israeli founder of Comverse Technology, one of the leading Mossad companies involved in the terror attacks has fled justice in the United States and escaped to Israel with at least $57 million of ill-gotten gains.

    Kobi Alexander should be arrested and interrogated about his knowledge of the events of 9/11. His company acquired the other Mossad firm, Odigo, shortly after it was revealed that Odigo employees had been forewarned of the attacks on the World Trade Center.

    This is the tip of the Israeli criminal mafia who is behind the terror attacks on 9/11.

    Here is a relevant section from one of my articles about Mossad's involvement in 9/11, which I posted on RMN on April 7, 2005:

    At least two Israel-based employees of Odigo received warnings of an imminent attack in New York City more than two hours before the first plane hit the WTC. Odigo had its U.S. headquarters two blocks from the WTC. The Odigo employees, however, did not pass the warning on to the authorities in New York City, a move that could have saved thousands of lives.

    Odigo has a feature called People Finder that allows users to seek out and contact others based on certain demographics, such as Israeli nationality.

    Two weeks after 9/11, Alex Diamandis, Odigo's vice president, reportedly said, "It was possible that the attack warning was broadcast to other Odigo members, but the company has not received reports of other recipients of the message."

    The Internet address of the sender was given to the FBI, and two months later it was reported that the FBI was still investigating the matter. There have been no media reports since.

    Odigo, like many Israeli software companies, is based and has its Research and Development (R&D) center in Herzliya, Israel, the small town north of Tel Aviv, which happens to be where Mossad's headquarters are located.

    Shortly after 9/11, Odigo was taken over by Comverse Technology, another Israeli company. Within a year, five executives from Comverse were reported to have profited by more than $267 million from "insider trading."

    http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=68985

    http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=91721

    http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/business/15368320.htm

    Sleuthing the trail of a fugitive CEO EX-COMVERSE HEAD, SOUGHT IN SCANDAL, DROPS FROM SIGHT

    In the unfolding saga of stock-option fraud, few characters are more curious than an Israeli entrepreneur named Jacob ``Kobi'' Alexander.

    The 54-year-old entrepreneur, who nurtured Comverse Technology from a penny-stock, high-tech wannabe to a leading producer of voice-mail software with 5,000 employees, fled the United States this month rather than face charges of scheming to manipulate stock options.

    Alexander was born in Israel, the son of Zvi Alexander, who is considered the founder of that nation's meager oil industry. The younger Alexander served in the Israeli military and intelligence services and has spent much of his adult life going back and forth between Israel and the United States.

    By 1984, Alexander was back in the United States, helping launch Comverse on New York's Long Island. The start-up took off in the 1990s, eventually selling its high-tech wares in more than 120 countries and seizing on niche opportunities, such as digital eavesdropping for law enforcement.

    On Thursday, the Israeli newspaper Maariv reported that private investigator Moshe Buller had reportedly tracked Alexander to the Indian Ocean island of Sri Lanka by tracing a call the beleaguered entrepreneur had made over the Internet.

    Israeli authorities have not commented on the case. But the public there remains fascinated with the tale of the local hero turned fugitive.

    ``It's a really big story in Israel,'' journalist Yom-Tov said. ``It's an amazing story.''

    Hey Joe…it's a BIG STORY in Israel.

    Why is the American Mainstream Media not covering this story?

    Did Kobi Alexander have foreknowledge of 9/11?

    Did you?

    .

    Posted by plunger at 09/29/2006 @ 5:56pm

  6. "Ptech was with MITRE Corporation in the basement of the FAA for two years prior to 9/11," Singh said. "Their specific job is to look at interoperability issues the FAA had with NORAD and the Air Force in the case of an emergency. If anyone was in a position to know that the FAA -- that there was a window of opportunity or to insert software or to change anything -- it would have been Ptech along with MITRE."

    The Mossad-run Guardium company is linked with Ptech through Goff Communications, the Holliston, Mass.-based public relations firm previously run by Michael S. Goff and his wife Marcia, which represents Guardium. Since being exposed in AFP in 2005, however, Michael's name no longer appears on the company website.

    Photo: Amit Yoran, the Israeli "Cyber Security Czar" appointed by President George W. Bush in 2003. Yoran has held various positions since the 1990s in which he oversaw computer security for the Dept. of Defense computers.

    Although he and his brother reportedly grew up in Pound Ridge, New York during the 1970s and 1980s, the heads of the Jewish community told AFP that they had never heard of him. One said that she had conducted a survey of the Jews living in the small village of Pound Ridge in the 1970s and she would have remembered if a wealthy Israeli family named Yoran had been found.

    Why did the locals in Pound Ridge NOT remember the Yorans?

    Probably because they were NOT in Pound Ridge - but in Israel. The Pound Ridge address was used to give the appearance that the Yorans were Americans. I spoke with Elad and he has a distinctive Israeli accent - not what you would expect for a guy who grew up in a posh Yankee village.

    So who are the Yorans? Who are their parents and why did they come to the United States? To raise a couple high-level moles to infiltrate the most sensitive U.S. computer networks? How could they have lived for 20 years in Pound Ridge and NOT be remembered.

    http://rense.com/general72/nss.htm

    Indira Singh, an "IT consultant" who previously worked on a Defense Advanced Research Project, and who was employed by J.P. Morgan on 9/11, in risk management, pointed to MITRE's role at the FAA during the 9/11 Citizens' Commission hearings in New York last September.

    "Ptech was with MITRE Corporation in the basement of the FAA for two years prior to 9/11," Singh said. "Their specific job is to look at interoperability issues the FAA had with NORAD and the Air Force in the case of an emergency. If anyone was in a position to know that the FAA – that there was a window of opportunity or to insert software or to change anything – it would have been Ptech along with MITRE."

    http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=68463

    IS DEFENSE CONTRACTOR MITRE CORP. THE TROJAN HORSE OF 9/11?

    By Christopher Bollyn American Free Press http://www.americanfreepress.net

    Did a central controller with "super user" privileges of the command and control systems of the Department of Defense, NORAD, the Air Force, and the FAA, control the aerial attacks of 9/11? There is only one agency that has that capability – a little-known private company known as MITRE Corp.

    There are basically two versions of events surrounding the terror attacks of September 11, 2001. There is the government version, propagated by the controlled media, which claims that 19 Arab terrorists, organized by Osama Bin Laden in Afghanistan, hijacked 4 passenger aircraft and used them to attack the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. This version, used to launch the "war on terror" and two invasions in the Middle East, is challenged by a lack of evidence.

    On the other hand, a host of unofficial explanations, based on available evidence, make up what can be called the "inside job" or anti-government version. This version basically claims that agents embedded within the U.S. military and intelligence organizations conspired to carry out the terror attacks.

    The two foreign nations most often implicated in the unofficial explanations of 9/11 are Israel and Britain. Both countries are supporters and beneficiaries of the Bush administration's "war on terror."

    For the Israelis, Iraq, a major threat, was drastically reduced in power and put under military occupation. For the British, a oil-rich territory, Iraq's southern region of Basra, which it originally occupied in 1914, was reoccupied and its immense oil assets put under control of the Crown.

    Royal Dutch Shell and BP, formerly named British Petroleum, are two companies said to be controlled by the Crown, which have posted record profits since 9/11.

    While both Britain and Israel have substantial assets and powerful organizations in the United States, proponents of the anti-government version have not explained how a foreign power could manipulate the computer systems of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), the North American Aerospace Defense Command ( NORAD), and the U.S. Air Force, and thereby control the aerial attacks of 9/11.

    When American Free Press interviewed Eckehardt Werthebach, former president of Germany's domestic intelligence service, in December 2001, he said "the deathly precision" and "the magnitude of planning" behind the 9/11 attacks would have required "years of planning."

    Such a sophisticated operation, Werthebach said, would require the "fixed frame" of a state intelligence organization, something not found in a "loose group" of terrorists like the one allegedly led by Mohammed Atta.

    Many people would have been involved in the planning of such an operation, Werthebach said. He pointed to the absence of leaks as further indication that the attacks were "state organized actions."

    Andreas von Bülow, who served on Germany's parliamentary commission and oversaw the three branches of the German secret service, told AFP that he believed that Mossad, Israel's intelligence service, was behind the terror attacks. The attacks, he said, were carried out to turn public opinion against the Arabs and boost military and security spending.

    "You don't get the higher echelons," von Bülow said, referring to the "architectural structure" which masterminds such terror attacks. At this level, he said, the organization doing the planning, such as Mossad or British intelligence, is primarily interested in affecting public opinion.

    In a recent article in AFP, " The Perfect Terrorist Plan To Level the Twin Towers Created In 1976" by Greg Szymanski, it was reported that the U.S. Army devised a plan in 1976 to bring down the towers using commercial airliners and box cutters as weapons.

    At the time, George H.W. Bush was head of the CIA and Martin R. Hoffmann was Secretary of the Army. Hoffmann told AFP that he did not recall being involved in this planning reportedly done by the U.S. Army.

    An architect, even of destruction, needs a contractor. Proponents of the anti-government version of 9/11 provide evidence to support their claims, but do not explain how the U.S. military and civil aviation control systems could have been hijacked to allow the aerial attacks to occur.

    Because the attacks involved systems used by the FAA, NORAD, and the U.S. Air Force, the conspirators would have needed "super user" access to the command and control centers of these three separate organizations.

    Super user means the most privileged user on a computerized data system. The super user has complete access to all files on the system. For the previously mentioned agencies, and virtually all other U.S. defense and intelligence organizations, there is one such possible super user: a little-known private not-for-profit organization, based in Bedford, Mass., known as MITRE Corp. MITRE also has a headquarters in McLean, Va., on a campus it shares with Northrop Grumman.

    The MITRE Corp. is a major defense contracting organization headed by the former Director of Central Intelligence (DCI), Dr. James Rodney Schlesinger. Schlesinger, who was reportedly made DCI at the request of Henry Kissinger in 1973, later served as Secretary of Defense.

    Schlesinger, a former director of strategic studies at the RAND Corp., was described in a 1973 biography as a "devout Lutheran," although he was born in New York in 1929 to immigrant Jewish parents from Austria and Russia. Schlesinger earned three degrees from Harvard University.

    Schlesinger's father, an accountant, founded the accounting firm Schlesinger & Haas, and was a trustee and chairman of the budget of the Stephen Wise Free Synagogue. His father was also a member of the New York State Grand Lodge of Masons.

    The MITRE Corp., of which Schlesinger is chairman of the board of trustees, is connected to the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), MIT's Lincoln Laboratory, and Mitretek Systems of Falls Church, Va.

    Schlesinger is a senior advisor for the Lehman Brothers investment firm and a member of the Defense Policy Board and advisory council for the Department of Homeland Security (DHS).

    The MITRE Corp. has provided computer and information technology to the FAA and the U.S. Air Force since the late 1950's. MITRE is a Federally Funded Research and Development Center (FFRDC) for the Dept. of Defense, the FAA, and the Internal Revenue Service.

    The chairman of the board of trustees of Mitretek Systems, a spin-off of MITRE Corp., is Martin R. Hoffmann, who served as Secretary of the Army when the "perfect terrorist plan" was reportedly prepared in 1976.

    MITRE's Command, Control, Communications, and Intelligence (C3I) FFRDC for the Dept. of Defense was established in 1958. The C3I "supports a broad and diverse set of sponsors within the Department of Defense and the Intelligence Community. These include the military departments, defense and intelligence agencies, the combatant commands, and elements of both the Office of the Secretary of Defense and the office of the Joint Chiefs of Staff," according to MITRE's website. "Information systems technology," it says, "coupled with domain knowledge, underpin the work of the C3I FFRDC."

    The U.S. Air Force maintains its Electronic Systems Center (ESC) at the Hanscom AFB in Bedford, Mass. The ESC manages the development and acquisition of electronic command and control (C2) systems used by the Air Force.

    The ESC is the Air Force's "brain for information, command and control systems," according to Charles Paone, a civilian employee of the ESC. It is the "product center" for the Air Force's Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS) and Joint Surveillance Target Attack Radar System (J-STARS), Paone said.

    Asked about MITRE's role at the ESC, Paone said, "MITRE does the front-end engineering. It's basically our in-house engineer." MITRE employees operate the computer systems at Hanscom AFB, Paone said.

    MIT's Lincoln Laboratories, the parent of MITRE, is located on the Hanscom AFB.

    A second FFRDC, the Center for Advanced Aviation System Development (CAASD) provides computer engineering and technology to the FAA. MITRE's support of the FAA began in 1958, when the company was created.

    The FAA's Airspace Management Handbook of May 2004, for example, was written and published by the MITRE Corp.

    Note that both Stewart Air Force Base and PTECH are mentioned in the following:

    http://www.rense.com/general64/moss.htm

    The IDC, a private, non-profit university, is closely tied to the Mossad. The IDC has a "research institute" headed by Shabtai Shavit, former head of the Mossad from 1989 to 1996, called the International Policy Institute for Counter-Terrorism.

    The IDC also has a "Marc Rich Center for the Study of Commodities, Trading and Financial Markets" and a "Lauder School of Government, Diplomacy and Strategy." The cosmetics magnate Ronald S. Lauder, who is a supporter of Israel's Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and his far-right Likud Party, founded the Lauder school.

    Lauder, president of the Jewish National Fund and former chairman of New York Governor George Pataki's Commission on Privatization, is the key individual who pushed the privatization of the WTC and former Stewart AFB, where the flight paths of the two planes that hit the twin towers oddly converged. Ronald Lauder played a significant, albeit unreported, role in the preparation for 9/11.

    Pataki's wife, Libby, has been on Lauder's payroll since at least 2002 and reportedly earned $100,000 as a consultant in 2004. According to The Village Voice, between 1994 and 1998, Gov. Pataki earned some $70,000 for speaking to groups affiliated with Lauder.

    THE PTECH CUTOUT

    Ptech, a mysterious software company has been tied with the events of 9/11. The Quincy, Massachusetts-based company was supposedly connected to "the Muslim Brotherhood" and Arab financiers of terrorism.

    The firm's suspected links with terrorism resulted in a consensual examination by the FBI in December 2002, which was immediately leaked to the media. The media reports of the FBI "raid" on Ptech soon led to the demise of the company.

    Ptech "produced software that derived from PROMIS, had an artificial intelligence core, and was installed on virtually every computer system of the U.S. government and its military agencies on September 11, 2001," according to Michael Ruppert's From the Wilderness (FTW) website.

    "This included the White House, Treasury Dept. (Secret Service), Air Force, FAA, CIA, FBI, both houses of Congress, Navy, Dept. of Energy, IRS, Booz Allen Hamilton, IBM, Enron and more," FTW reported.

    "Whoever plotted 9/11 definitely viewed the FAA as the enemy that morning. Overriding FAA systems would be the most effective way to ensure the attacks were successful," FTW reported. "To do this, the FAA needed an evolution of PROMIS software installed on their systems and Ptech was just that; the White House and Secret Service had the same software on their systems - likely a superior modified version capable of 'surveillance and intervention' systems."

    But did the U.S. government unwittingly load software capable of "surveillance and intervention" operations and produced by a company linked to terrorism onto its most sensitive computer networks, or was Ptech simply a Mossad "cutout" company?

    Posted by plunger at 09/29/2006 @ 5:57pm

  7. WHY DID CHERTOFF KILL THE PTECH INVESTIGATION?

    ON WHOSE BEHALF?

    GOT TREASON?

    http://www.aztlan.net/israeli_sexpionage.htm

    Israeli Sexpionage : The McGreevey, Condit and Clinton Affairs

    Chandra Levy and Monica Lewinsky, which I will discuss later, can be called "Swallows".

    Zionist Israel places great importance in its "symbiotic" relationship with the USA. In fact, the State of Israel would be unable to exist without the vast amounts of aid, both military and social welfare, that is sent yearly to prop up the Zionist government. This total amount is estimated to be more than 5 Billion dollars per year. In addition, Israel survives and depends on critical technology transfers that are obtained both through cooperation and covertly. For example, Israel now possess thermonuclear bombs and missiles, thanks to an American Jew, Jonathan Pollard, who stole the "nuclear secrets" while working as a US Naval Analyst. Pollard, it was admitted by the Israeli government, was a MOSSAD spy. He is presently doing a life term in a US Federal Prison for his crime.

    The success and effectiveness of the Israel/USA symbiotic relationship depends on many factors. One is massive propaganda through the US based Zionist press that keeps the American people in a constant stupor about certain political and economic realities. Another is the near total subserviency of corrupt politicians, especially of the Democratic Party, who do not speak up because they are on the take. Another is the massive infiltration into government of what are nothing less than Israeli agents. Israeli agents in the Pentagon, for example, has caused the USA dearly in terms of the costs of the "War on Iraq" and in terms of its "hated image" around the world.

    Lastly, a factor that is very important for Israel in keeping a profitable symbiotic relationships with the USA is effective sexpionage. Sexpionage is so important to Israel, that it has opened an office for this purpose right smack in the center of US political power -- Washington D.C. The office fronts as a post 911 anti-terrorism institute and is located at 3811 N. Fairfax Drive, Suite 720 Arlington, VA 22203. The Chief of the office is non other that the immediate former Director of the Israeli MOSSAD, Shabtai Shavit.

    The target in this sexpionage operation was the married Gary Condit, who was a senior member of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence. As member of the committee, Condit was privy to highly classified information of much interest to Zionist Israel. The MOSSAD leaned on their "sleeper and sexpionage agent" Chandra Levy to obtain the secret US government information that the Israeli government needed. The MOSSAD arranged for Chandra Levy, than a US government intern, to meet Congressman Condit. Soon, the married Condit was having a sexual affair with the voluptuous 24 year old Chandra Levy.

    Whatever classified information Levy was able to obtain, on her "sexpionage mission", was at the cost of her life. One day before she was to return to California, she disappeared without a trace. The Washington D.C. police searched Congressman Condit's apartment for clues to no avail. Thirteen months later the "skull and bones" of Chandra Levy were found at Washington's Rock Creek Park even though the park had been repeatedly searched during the early phases of the investigation.

    Everyone reading this report should be acquainted with the President Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky affair. This has been called "The Mother of all Sexpionage Scandals" because it almost toppled a US presidency. Generally less known is the fact that Monica Lewinsky was actually a "sexpionage agent" working on behalf of the Israeli government. She was, and probably still is, what the MOSSAD calls a "Swallow".

    It is believed that Lewinsky's primary mission was to sexually compromise Bill Clinton in order to bribe him to release the Israeli spy Jonathan Pollard. The timing and unfolding of the "White House Sex Scandal" coincided with the efforts and meetings by the then Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu with President Bill Clinton in the White House.

    The mission for Israel failed but it ended giving the Zionist state some peripheral benefits. In an effort by Clinton to rid himself of the "Swallow", he transferred her to the Pentagon with the highest "security clearance" possible and which is only afforded to top brass and a few high level government officials. Soon Monica Lewinsky was cavorting with Admirals and Generals and became pregnant. She says she aborted the baby.

    No one knows what Pentagon secrets Lewinsky was able to pass on to the Zionists, but perhaps Paul Wolfowitz' great success in involving the USA in the War against Iraq may be the results of Monica Lewinsky's efforts on behalf of Israel. Sexpionage pays and it is paying big for Israel.

    Chandra Levy and Monica Lewinsky – "Swallows" for Israel.

    Isn't it interesting that Lieberman's name pops up in the case of two similar-looking tarts, who were "Honey Pots" (or "Swallows" - the term used to describe women in the employ of Israel whose job is to compromise US Officials) for Israel's Mossad?

    Note that his article dated less than TWO MONTHS PRIOR TO 9/11.

    Police to return to parks in Levy case Experts: Condit damaged own reputation

    July 22, 2001 Posted: 6:07 PM EDT (2207 GMT)

    Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-Connecticut, said it wouldn't be productive to focus on Condit's conduct. In 1998, Lieberman was the first prominent Democrat to criticize Clinton for his affair with Monica Lewinsky.

    Lieberman said the two matters are different and he declined to say whether Condit should resign, as two Republican lawmakers have said.

    "The Chandra Levy case is a missing persons case. And I think we all ought to let the law-enforcement authorities focus on finding Chandra Levy and relieving the terrible trauma and nightmare that her family and friends have gone through," Lieberman told Fox News Sunday. "And when that is over, politicians can begin to speak out."

    Saturday, a spokeswoman for Vice President Dick Cheney, said Cheney met with Condit around the same time Levy was logging off her computer in her apartment May 1.

    Juleanna Glover Weiss said the meeting happened between 12:30 p.m. and 12:50 p.m. in Cheney's office in the House of Representatives. The meeting was "at Condit's request," she said, and included Cheney and some of Cheney's staff discussing the California energy crisis.

    http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/07/21/missing.intern/index.html

    CHENEY ORDERED THE HIT TO PROTECT THE 9/11 OPERATION?

    .

    MEL SEMBLER HOSTED A FUNDRAISER FOR JOE LIEBERMAN???

    WHAT'S THE DEAL...REALLY?

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/09/21/top-republican-hosts-fund_n_299 69.html?p=1#comments

    .

    WHY DOES LIEBERMAN FAVOR WAR?

    Just follow the trail of the money!

    MEL SEMBLER:

    Mel Sembler---U.S. Ambassador to Italy, although he can't speak Italian. Election Fraud specialist. Owns the Bay Point School in Florida allegedly used for testing election fraud devices in 1999.

    Involved in creating the forged yellowcake documents that led to the War in Iraq. National Finance Chairman Republican Party, head of finance for Bush presidential campaign. Past hon. Pres. Republican Jewish Coalition.

    The United States has given Israel over 90 billion dollars in foreign aid. In 2003, Israel received $53.4 Million dollars a day from the traitors in Congress. That's a very solid return on the AIPAC contributions that Israel pays out to U.S. Congressmen.

    ISRAEL RECEIVED up to $75 billion as emergency aid, directly connected to the war on Iraq. This amounts to 2500% increase in aid to support Israel in a war that they have claimed they are not involved in. Who is benefiting from the war on Iraq?

    Follow the trail of the money!

    Iraqi oil flowing to Israel….

    http://www.nogw.com/warforisrael.html

    WHO IS MEL SEMBLER???

    WHY IS HE HEADING UP THE SCOOTER LIBBY LEGAL DEFENSE FUND?

    HERE'S WHY:

    WHEN was he Ambassador to Italy? Does 2002 ring any bells in your head? Well it should-- remember all the secret meetings in Italy involving Ledeen et al, and the forged documents about uranium from Africa that turned up at the US Embassy that October? Yes, THAT October 2002.... So we have Sembler at the scene of the crime related to the crime Scooter is being investigated for.

    WHO ELSE HAS RUSHED TO LIBBY'S DEFENSE?

    Sounds like a PNAC Picnic roster…

    http://securingamerica.com/ccn/node/4299

    WHY DID ISRAEL WANT THE US TO INVADE IRAQ, AND INVENT FALSE INTELLIGENCE TO MAKE IT HAPPEN?

    http://www.nogw.com/warforisrael.html

    MEL SEMBLER:

    The Washington Post gave him its "Narcissism Run Amok" award for buying a monument to himself.

    As a Bush supporter since 1979, Sembler capped nearly 10 years of campaigning on November 8, 1988, when Bush won the bid for the presidency.

    In February 1989, President George H.W. Bush appointed Sembler United States Ambassador to Australia and Nauru, where he served for three and a half years

    Sembler has been a Republican fundraiser since 1979, raising a record $21.3m at a single dinner in April 2000.

    Mel Sembler was appointed by President Bush as Ambassador to Italy and was sworn in by Vice President Cheney on November 16, 2001.

    In February 2005 Sembler had an annex to the US Embassy in Rome named after him (the Mel Sembler Building) - an unheard of honour for a sitting diplomat. The naming was due to an amendment by Rep. Bill Young to an appropriations bill.

    Bush thought this unusual. "And he said," Young recalled, " 'We don't do that, do we? We don't name buildings for ambassadors where they have served.' And I said, 'Mr. President, I introduced the bill and you signed it.' "

    But there was more. If you go, as you should, to the Web site to look at the stunning photo display, you'll come to a gorgeous photo (shown above) of the frescoed ceiling of the C.W. Bill Young Conference Center right there in the Mel Sembler Building. And there are a couple of fine bronze plaques naming the center that go on the walls there.

    And so it is only fitting that, despite this being only early March, the coveted In the Loop Narcissism Run Amok Award for 2005 goes to Sembler and Young for their efforts to establish an excellent new trend in American diplomacy.

    Sembler is an Honorary Chairman of the Republican Jewish Coalition.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A5165-2005Mar3.html?sub=AR

    http://italy.indymedia.org/news/2005/03/757886.php

    His Own Private Abu Ghraib

    He created a system to reprogram bad kids. He modeled STRAIGHT after another program, creepily named "The Seed," shut down after the U.S. Congress literally issued a report in 1974 comparing it to "the highly refined 'brainwashing' techniques employed by the North Koreans." Sembler's imitation wasn't shut down until 1993 for illegal child abuse: beatings and sexual humiliation.

    Gov. Jeb Bush once named a "Betty Sembler Day" in Florida to honor his wife's ongoing, taxpayer-funded campaigns on behalf of workplace urine tests.

    http://media.orkut.com/articles/0145.html

    OH, YOU MEAN THAT MEL SEMBLER?

    SEMBLER & LIEBERMAN ARE JUST PART OF THE MACHINE THAT RESULTS IN THIS:

    Israel has acquired three Dolphin class diesel submarines in 2002 that it is arming with newly designed cruise missiles capable of carrying nuclear warheads. According to Pentagon and Israeli officials, Israel now has a triad of land-, sea- and air-based nuclear weapons for the first time. Now, Germany has agreed to sell Israel another two Dolphin-class submarines.

    THIS STORY WAS SLIPPED OUT INTO THE MEDIA AT THE HEIGHT OF KARL ROVE'S PHONY LONDON LIQUID BOMB TERROR SCARE:

    Recently the mainstream media has kept the stories of Ariel Weinmann and Adam Pearlman out of the news. Weinmann was a Navy Petty Officer arrested approximately four months ago for passing extremely sensitive national security information relating to nuclear submarines to the Israelis – ever heard of him? Adam Pearlman is an Al Qaeda terrorist by the name of "Azzam the American." It isn't that the media is keeping Azzam out of the news, hardly, he made the front page, and prime time on every network, but not a single network has mentioned the fact that he's in reality a Californian Jew named Adam Pearlman, whose grandfather was a sitting Board Member on the Anti-Defamation League.

    WHO CONTROLS THE MEDIA???

    Zionist forces are in control of the United States. When Ariel Sharon said:

    "Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."

    Ariel Sharon to Shimon Peres, October 3rd, 2001, as reported on Kol Yisrael

    it was no idle chatter. He was telling the truth.

    Nary a single network has mentioned an Israeli by the name of Asher Karni that was arrested at Denver International airport in January of 2004 for having sold Pakistan nuclear weapon detonators known as "spark gap igniters,"

    Not one network has told you about a New York Orthodox Jew named Yehuda Abraham, who was arrested for having sold shoulder fired surface to air missiles to FBI agents posing as Al Qaeda operatives, with the understanding that they were to be used against non-Jewish Americans.

    Zionist media seeks to suppress uncomfortable facts, like the indisputable fact that Israel intentionally attacked an American Intelligence ship, the USS Liberty, in 1967 killing more than fifty sailors, and then compelled the United States government to cover that fact up.

    The MSM censors any thing to do with the infamous Lavon Affair, where Israeli's attempted to bomb American assets in Egypt in the 1950s and frame the Egyptians for the attack.

    The establishment media struggles to keep all [and there is a great deal] of the damning evidence implicating the United States government and the Mossad in the attacks of September 11, 2001

    In conclusion the evidence that Israel is behind the invasion on Iraq is more than circumstantial. You just need to look at who stands to gain from all this. Those that can't understand why Dubya is so determined to attack Iraq, probably haven't considered that Israel is running the show. If you just look at who stands to gain from Iraqi oil you see the picture but it doesn't seem to be the whole thing. But when you add the dancing Israelis and Senator Graham's statements about foreign governments involvement in 911 and Sharon's orders on who Bush is to attack next, the whole picture begins to get in focus.

    WANT TO UNDERSTAND?

    READ THIS SITE:

    http://www.nogw.com/warforisrael.html

    IRAN IS NEXT...THE OCTOBER SURPRISE...

    WILL CHENEY NUKE THE US TO PROVIDE THE PRETEXT?

    ASK JOE LIEBERMAN.

    .

    .

    Posted by plunger at 09/29/2006 @ 5:58pm

  8. The number at the top says there have been eight posts. I see just four. So, including Sliver, 5 of the 8 posters are from our conservative friends. Congratulations to all of you. I remember the exact same thing happening to my congressman (Robert Bauman) when I was a teen in MD. Strong advocate for Christian, family values who publicly denounced homosexual activity. Probably the only Republican representing any district in MD at the time.

    Saddest thing in the world to witness those who do their damnedest to suppress their inner demons by enacting legislation to outlaw their desires. Well...second saddest, next to the victims of their inevitable crash.

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 09/29/2006 @ 6:28pm

  9. Bejesus! I can't believe it. MASK didn't show up to say something like, "But the Democrats weren't nearly as outraged when . . ." or "34 Democrats supported it. 34! That's a fact of life."

    Posted by fromredbird at 09/29/2006 @ 6:44pm

  10. Not so surprising to see that another one is exactly what he condemns. Take a look at the torture-advocating anti-terrorists, the 2,000 lb. bomb-celebrating condemners of violence right here every day.

    Posted by fromredbird at 09/29/2006 @ 6:48pm

  11. "Is this what GOPers mean by "family values"?"

    I thought gayness is to be celebrated....

    This guy should be flogged...on second thought, he might actually like that...

    Why didn't Barney Frank resign after his little, ah, business arrangement..oh, yeah, he didn't know a gay escort business was being run out of his own house... ..exactly?

    At least the GOPers resign or quit....the other side seems to write books, hit the talk circut and get rich and praised....why is that?

    Posted by john maasch at 09/29/2006 @ 6:51pm

  12. It's really notable that the right-wing neo-fascists on talk radio, etc, are always railing against Barney Frank who is openly gay. Based on just the involuntary outings the Republican Party apparently has as least three times as many in the closet leading a life that is two-faced in the extreme. Exactly how weird is this political party? Are there any limits to the hypocrisy?

    Posted by fromredbird at 09/29/2006 @ 6:53pm

  13. Posted by JOHN MAASCH 09/29/2006 @ 6:51pm

    Last time I checked, being gay was not a crime, while pedophilia is, in fact, illegal. The fact that this waste of oxygen had the balls to sit on a committee that is charged with preventing crimes just as this is horrible. The fact that some of the reactionary Republican posters always - and I mean always - respond to problems with Republicans by playing the "but some Democrat did the same thing" card, even though the comparison usually is about as valid as comparing jay walking to murder.

    Posted by Turk33 at 09/29/2006 @ 7:05pm

  14. So Maasch, the "other" side writes books instead of just quits and this condones it for you? If that were true. Tact and defend buddy, really weak. I bet it's only a matter of time before I see a Foley memoir at Barnes & Noble.

    Maybe James Dobson will un-gay him... don't let him near the teen choir though.

    Posted by libsurf at 09/29/2006 @ 7:05pm

  15. LIBSURF,

    THE GUY (FOLEY)IS A PIECE OF SHIT, AND SHIT IS SHIT...FROM BOTH SIDES...AND SO IS GOV GREEBY AND FRANK, AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED.

    Posted by john maasch at 09/29/2006 @ 7:20pm

  16. just ignore maasch already! anyone willing to spend their peak years in omaha HAS to be a total waste of time and energy....

    Posted by darladoon at 09/29/2006 @ 8:40pm

  17. And now...

    Back to our usual political message.

    Have we not considered what this will do to the House balance? Since it's too late to replace Foley on the ballot, Mahoney is now running against a child molester. I think that pretty much wraps FL-16 up as a Democratic pick-up. Yes, I know it's callous to dance on the man's political grave (and probable jail term) but if anyone every deserved it... Meanwhile, Rove must be practically stroking out over this, since it's converted a fairly safe Republican seat into another Democratic threat to his boss's ability to avoid two years as a lame duck and more investigations than Watergate, Iran-Contra, and Whitewater rolled into one.

    Posted by Stwriley at 09/29/2006 @ 8:54pm

  18. " just ignore maasch already! anyone willing to spend their peak years in omaha HAS to be a total waste of time and energy...."

    Intelligently spoken....again......Enough....

    Posted by john maasch at 09/29/2006 @ 9:05pm

  19. 1st : Posted by LVLIBERTY1 09/29/2006 @ 6:33pm

    Good man!!

    2nd" HAHAHAHAHHAHA, One cannot make this shit up. snort, snicker, haha hehehe. hack. sniffle. hehe. chuckle.

    3rd. : Maasch, your attempt to compare Foleys acts (alleged) to Barney Frank is disgustiing. Would you compare your sexual acitivities to a female child molester? Say, David koresh? It is way past time smart people got past the gay=pedophilia cannard crap.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/29/2006 @ 9:17pm

  20. Maasch, one of your worst. a homophobic smear, unworthy of you.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 09/29/2006 @ 9:31pm

  21. the fact that this slime, Foley, is a repub is incidental. it's good that he's gone from public life, but I won't be the one to cast the first stone.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 09/29/2006 @ 9:33pm

  22. maasch simply cannot accept his imminent irrelevance.

    that someone as important as maasch, what with his frequent visits to the Orient, would spend so much time rebutting the advocates of the elderly, the raped, and the severely vulnerable, is evidence of his pathology, his inexorable penchant for projection.

    so ignore him, ok?

    Posted by darladoon at 09/29/2006 @ 9:53pm

  23. It is way past time smart people got past the gay=pedophilia cannard crap. Posted by CRABWALK 09/29/2006 @ 9:17pm Here Here ! ! That's the same tired agrument that social conservatives use to keep competent teachers (who happen to be gay) out of our schools, thus contributing to the over all decline in the quality of our education system. As to the topic at hand, if charges are filed, and if found guilty, Foley should go to jail.

    Posted by yen4truth at 09/29/2006 @ 10:02pm

  24. Well, if I could butt in...

    I sure ain't no amblin' nambla man by any means, but, really, THERE IS NOTHING IN THESE EMAILS INCOMPATIBLE WITH THE HYPOTHESIS THAT A GOOD MAN IS GETTING THE SHAFT FROM SOME SICK SMART ASS WEISENHEIMER KID who is in/onto the Great Reversal Game (= "another who is exactly what they condemn" (WELL PUT). This is the connection between Foley and Guckert (Rove, Mehlman, Abramoff) everyone jumps to make (reverse gay; as in early Nazism) -- right-wing effort to take over and put its coarse, lower-level id-as-moral, tasteless, debauched, grotesque stamp on everything the 60's avante garde accomplished -- then shove its authentic reps out the gangplank, even those of themselves who, like Foley, may only be guilty of a little humanity, no hands-down-the-pants hanky-panky at all. Requesting "a picture" is not sexual, is it.

    Shame on you all -- even right-wingers who won't stand up for friendship with young boys. Bunch of fucking sick-o's these bush people have driven males to.

    In other words, once the poison of The Great Reversal (as in LA Confidential, common characteristic of Re-pubes, not Dems) has been poured into the waters of collective discourse, anybody can be set up for anything. Fake hate crimes, demonizing Ahmadenijad, fake Allah worshipper anthrax attack -- anything.

    (note: value your posts, Plunger. Downloaded and studying)

    Posted by jones at 09/29/2006 @ 11:48pm

  25. hey I just heard that the RNC was thinking of sharing office space with NAMBLA

    Is that true?

    Luvvy, do you have any inside scoop?

    Posted by Will C. at 09/30/2006 @ 12:16am

  26. the republicans stand for child molesting, treason, torture, raping the environment, destroying america's military capability, and lower taxes for rich people. maybe the part about lower taxes for rich people should come first on the list--it's hard to say.

    Posted by pretzel at 09/30/2006 @ 12:37am

  27. Im stealing that line Will C!

    Posted by pretzel at 09/30/2006 @ 12:45am

  28. Ah yes-- oversight, seems to be working like a charm for everything those repubs 'deal' with:

    "Six hours after his resignation letter was read to the House by a clerk, the chairman of a panel that oversees the page program issued a one-page written statement that deflected any blame from House leaders.

    The statement from Rep. John Shimkus, R-Ill., said the House Page Board he chairs investigated the allegations late last year, but he said Foley "was not honest" in denying improper conduct with the teenager. Pages are high school students who attend classes under congressional supervision and work as messengers.

    Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., who sponsored the page from his district, told reporters that he learned of the e-mails from a reporter some months ago and passed on the information to Rep. Thomas Reynolds, R-N.Y., chairman of the House Republican campaign organization.

    Alexander said he did not pursue the matter further because "his parents said they didn't want me to do anything."

    Carl Forti, a spokesman for the GOP campaign organization, said Reynolds learned from Alexander that the parents did not want to pursue the matter. Forti said, however, that the matter did go before the House Page Board -- the three lawmakers and two House officials who oversee the pages.

    Shimkus, who avoided reporters for hours, worked out his statement with Speaker Dennis Hastert's office. He said he promptly investigated what he thought were non-explicit message exchanges."

    http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f= /n/a/2006/09/29/national/w123452D40.DTL

    Posted by hsuBfools at 09/30/2006 @ 02:20am

  29. Like I posted on the other thread, isn't a pedophile is just a "picky" homosexual?

    Posted by RIO BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 01:29am

    are you providing inside scoop rio?

    Posted by Will C. at 09/30/2006 @ 03:22am

  30. Republicans usually fight so that kids can be born in the first place.

    Posted by SLIVER 09/29/2006 @ 5:38pm

    After birth, they on on there own, unless they want to be cannon fodder for a fools errand.

    -----------

    Like I posted on the other thread, isn't a pedophile is just a "picky" homosexual?

    Posted by RIO BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 01:29am

    No. As I wrote to Maasch, So you like to put your thangy into 10 year old girls, eh, Brave Coward? Hetero-sexuals is just another name for "little girl fucker"? Moron. Or do you like em even younger? So small and cute they can't run from big bad Rio. This just proves to me thet you have no shame, no sense of decency and no grasp of any logical process. About what I expect from someone that thinks Iraq is going swell.

    for all you moronic neo-cons out there, once and for all, pedophilia and homsexuality are TWO different things. MOST pedophiles are hetero, idiots. Do you want to ban all straight people from teaching? Maybe we should.

    Lets see if we can come up with new names for the little girl loving Rio Rapo.

    yet another Jesus Man bringing false witness, seems to be their favorite sport nowadays.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 07:33am

  31. Or, I will start with your logic. ALL republicans are pedophiles!! did you notice which party Foley belongs to Rio Girlylover? Was he a dem? NO hahaha. He belongs to the"values" party. Party of Abramoff, Delay, Reed, Savafian, Armstrong, Gannon(Guckert), Ollie North, Negroponte, and the long list of CONVICTED felon that make up the superstructure of the GOP. Yep, the dems are bringin' down America.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 07:54am

  32. "What ya wearing?" Mr. Foley wrote to one, according to the network. "Tshirt and shorts," the teenager responded. "Love to slip them off of you," Mr. Foley replied.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 08:00am

  33. hehehe. It seems Woodward is going to be at Lauras book festival, signing "Denial". It was worth getting up this morning.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 08:13am

  34. re: Maasch & Rio Bravo-- WHY do y'all even respond to them?

    re: Foley-- This is not a "good" man brought low by a moment of weakness. This is the prototypical conservative scumbag who lashes out at what he despises in himself; missing and exploited children indeed. It's like Swaggart in the motel room with the working girl or Bennett gambling away the "milk money" in Las Vegas, etc. These are the "moral" people who tell the rest of us how we should live and what we should think. The conservatives in England are usually discovered sashaying around in tutus or tied up with complex knots. Seems much more dignified than our homegrown wingnuts' predilections.

    Posted by bookmanjb1 at 09/30/2006 @ 08:26am

  35. I'd like to hear the conversation where the parents of the boy expressed that they "didn't want to pursue" the matter.

    GOPer Alexander to boy's Mom: You don't want to pursue this matter in any way... DO YOU, Ma'am?

    If a young girl is harassed or assaulted, should an adult get to decide that the perpetrator should not be brought to justice? Does this boy have rights? Do adults have a responsibility not to simply make this go away?

    This boy was harmed by GOPers across the board.

    Posted by kimbo1 at 09/30/2006 @ 08:32am

  36. Jr,

    "Maasch, one of your worst. a homophobic smear, unworthy of you."

    No. you are wrong here....Frank "didn't know of a sex business"(illegal) operation being run out of his own house, so, he should have resigned..it seems the libs never resign......Foley is a piece of shit. I would feel the same way if the victim was a girl...I personaly don't care about ones sexual orientation and never did...I care about character, as in MLK, and it is obvious Foley has none, and in my opinion, neither does Frank, the old NJ governor, and many others....sex scandals are sex scandels, so stop trying to paint me with homomphobic brush.

    Darala, please, try to lift yourself...your posts are thin and weak montras...nothing there...I thought I was on the ignore list of yours with the other 80% of the posters here..I would feel better if I were..

    Posted by john maasch at 09/30/2006 @ 08:39am

  37. Maasch, you use the"they all do it" defense over and over again. a shabby and transparent trick. this is how it goes: repub A is caught in some malfeasance. your answer, what about when the dem B did such and such, years ago. and then you can praise him for resigning. yeah right.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 09/30/2006 @ 08:45am

  38. and in my opinion, neither does Frank, the old NJ governor, and many others..

    funny that both your examples involve male homosexuals. just a coincidence I'm sure.

    will we see you at Federal Hall on Friday at noon?

    Posted by johannesrolf at 09/30/2006 @ 08:52am

  39. Posted by RIO BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 01:29am

    Like I posted on the other thread, isn't a pedophile is just a "picky" homosexual?

    And once again, Rio, you prove your utter lack of any research skills and ignorance of current scientific thought. The data has long since disproved the idea that "homosexual orientation = pedophile". I'll refer you to the work of Dr. Gregory Herek of the psychology department at UC Berkeley and his article "Facts About Homosexuality and Child Molestation" [psychology.ucdavis.edu] for a full review of the science. The most relevant passages are as follows:

    Using the fixated-regressed distinction, Groth and Birnbaum (1978) studied 175 adult males who were convicted in Massachusetts of sexual assault against a child. None of the men had an exclusively homosexual adult sexual orientation. 83 (47%) were classified as "fixated;" 70 others (40%) were classified as regressed adult heterosexuals; the remaining 22 (13%) were classified as regressed adult bisexuals. Of the last group, Groth and Birnbaum observed that "in their adult relationships they engaged in sex on occasion with men as well as with women. However, in no case did this attraction to men exceed their preference for women....There were no men who were primarily sexually attracted to other adult males..." (p.180).

    Other researchers have taken different approaches, but have similarly failed to find a connection between homosexuality and child molestation. Dr. Carole Jenny reviewed 352 medical charts, representing all of the sexually abused children seen in the emergency room or child abuse clinic of a Denver children's hospital during a one-year period (from July 1, 1991 to June 30, 1992). The molester was a gay or lesbian adult in only 2 of the 269 cases in which an adult molester could be identified – fewer than 1% (Jenny et al., 1994).

    So the actual facts show that gays and lesbians are actually less likely to molest children than heterosexuals. Get your facts straight before you try to paint whole sections of society as criminals.

    Posted by Stwriley at 09/30/2006 @ 09:12am

  40. I'm sure every lib and Dem here will enjoy a little "family values GOP hypocrisy" for a while and it'll be fun for kicks and giggles...

    but as I noted yesterday, I'm seeing something A LOT more serious.

    A Democratic Congressman who voted for HR 6166, i.e. "Military Commissions Act" or, more generally...the "torture bill".

    His name....Sherrod Brown. The guy being touted on a BANNER AD in "The Nation" magazine, which just had several articles OPPOSING that same bill.

    What the hell????

    Posted by Mask at 09/30/2006 @ 09:25am

  41. SLIVER,

    I agree with you, Sliver, throw Congressman Lust for underage boys, er Foley in jail and make him register as a sex offender if he should manage to get out alive. And by the way, it seems as if your rightwing, lunatic, over-sexed, faggot Republican friends may fight for children to be born, but that is only so they can molest and exploit them when they reach puberty. So much for George Bush's Republican culure of life.............More like Republican culture of sleaze and disgust................

    Throw the prick in jail...period.

    Since we're using the broad brush here regarding Republicans, remember...Republicans usually fight so that kids can be born in the first place.

    Posted by SLIVER 09/29/2006 @ 5:38pm | ignore this person

    Posted by POSEIDON at 09/30/2006 @ 09:41am

  42. No MASK, the more important issue of today is the sheer panic mode of the Administration regarding Woodward's new book. It seems the Bushies could only enjoy the capitulation of the Congress for one day before bigger news hit the fan.

    Posted by BlueTexan at 09/30/2006 @ 09:49am

  43. Posted by MASK 09/30/2006 @ 09:25am

    A Democratic Congressman who voted for HR 6166, i.e. "Military Commissions Act" or, more generally...the "torture bill".

    His name....Sherrod Brown. The guy being touted on a BANNER AD in "The Nation" magazine, which just had several articles OPPOSING that same bill.

    What the hell????

    Mask,

    Could it be possible that you are actually asking a genuine question? No. You know the answer as well as the rest of us. Brown is in a very tight race with DeWine and can't afford to give him the ammunition of voting against this travesty. I don't think that excuses him, but it's not like it wouldn't have passed without Brown's vote. It's what this whole bill was designed and presented for at this time. So why troll for this explanation?

    Posted by Stwriley at 09/30/2006 @ 09:50am

  44. And now...

    Back to the current thread.

    It seems that the rabbit hole goes even deeper than it first appeared to. It now seems that both Boehner and Hastert knew of this last spring, but that the inquiries by the House Page Board mentioned above were kept from the lone Democratic member of the board. DailyKos has the scoops collected together here [dailykos.com] and here [dailykos.com]. The Republican leadership have once again blown their own collective foot off in an attempt to prevent a scandal.

    Posted by Stwriley at 09/30/2006 @ 10:04am

  45. Posted by STWRILEY 09/30/2006 @ 10:04am

    Wow! If that proves to be true, the GOPers are going to have "fun" on the campaign trail trying to talk this one down. Is this the "Octboer Surprise" the Dems hoped for?

    Posted by BlueTexan at 09/30/2006 @ 10:15am

  46. Mask, we went over this before. the Nation accepts ads they do not agree with, as is their perogative(sic).

    Posted by johannesrolf at 09/30/2006 @ 10:18am

  47. Of course, Congress itself--beyond just the Republicans--is blamed for developing a system of corruption and then stepping aside, allowing it to flower. Back in the 1990s, when each party thought the other was using ethics investigations for political purposes, they agreed on an informal truce. After all, ethics really aren't that important in the big picture, are they? This from a CNN report in January of this year:

    "Everybody knew about it," says former Democratic Congressman Chris Bell of Texas. "There was never any formal agreement between the two parties, but it just came to be known that you don't file a complaint against anyone on our side and we won't file a complaint against anyone on your side."

    Unlike the Senate, the House forbids ethics complaints from outsiders, so hardly a whisper has been heard from the committee as ethical, even criminal, complaints have rained down on House members.

    Ethics Shmethics [cnn.com]

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 09/30/2006 @ 10:20am

  48. prerogative. often mispronounced and misspelled.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 09/30/2006 @ 10:21am

  49. Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., who sponsored the page from his district, told reporters that he learned of the e-mails from a reporter some months ago and passed on the information to Rep. Thomas Reynolds, R-N.Y., chairman of the House Republican campaign organization.

    Posted by HSUBFOOLS 09/30/2006 @ 02:20am

    The Republican Party heirarchy of priorities: re-election, first place, "family values", no place.

    Posted by fromredbird at 09/30/2006 @ 10:52am

  50. I'm sure every lib and Dem here will enjoy a little "family values GOP hypocrisy" for a while and it'll be fun for kicks and giggles...

    but as I noted yesterday, I'm seeing something A LOT more serious.

    A Democratic Congressman who voted for HR 6166, i.e. "Military Commissions Act" or, more generally...the "torture bill".

    His name....Sherrod Brown. The guy being touted on a BANNER AD in "The Nation" magazine, which just had several articles OPPOSING that same bill.

    What the hell????

    Posted by MASK 09/30/2006 @ 09:25am

    How about the seriousness of your anti-semitism, MASK? What the hell?

    Posted by fromredbird at 09/30/2006 @ 10:54am

  51. This is an insult - an intentional instult to Americans, and intentional insult to their own idiot supporters. Republican leaders do not have any opinion about culture and society - other than to impose fascism. The Real Conservatives are unmoved by anything that good people consider to be right or wrong.

    The leaders do not share your "values", they use your "values".

    Posted by conshame at 09/30/2006 @ 11:42am

  52. it has yet to be determined whether foley did anything ILLEGAL, although seducing pages might be against House rules.

    the seduced was 16 years old, so technically foley could have had sexual contact with the seduced in DC proper. i'm not sure what the sexual rules of conduct on the internet are for 16 year olds.

    but what IS disgusting is the non-interest on behalf of the republican leadership: boehner even blocked pelosi's attempt to investigate---they even BOOED her!

    the republican leadership are seriously despicable.

    Posted by darladoon at 09/30/2006 @ 11:55am

  53. if this happened to a democrat, the spin machine would be on overdrive.

    Posted by darladoon at 09/30/2006 @ 11:56am

  54. the other issue is: is foley married?

    they are the "values" party.....so......

    Posted by darladoon at 09/30/2006 @ 11:56am

  55. Let the chips fall where they may.

    Posted by conshame at 09/30/2006 @ 11:56am

  56. The guy being touted on a BANNER AD in "The Nation" magazine, which just had several articles OPPOSING that same bill.

    What the hell????

    Posted by MASK 09/30/2006 @ 09:25am

    By the way, I don't know if The Nation realizes it, but...George Harrison is, like, dead. And he was once found guilty of copyright infringement of the tune to He's So Fine when he composed My Sweet Lord, in one fell swoop of thievery converting the secular infatuation into religious adoration. Certainly this is a more egregious misuse of The Nation's advertising policy than Sherrod's banner.

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 09/30/2006 @ 12:52pm

  57. don't like the science, attack it as liberal mumbo-jumbo. AKA, The Usual Response to homosexuality, globa warming, threats from WMD's links to Al-Qaida.

    don't you ever get tired of being wrong? or following those that are wrong?

    Whats my projection Rio Fondler? You put forth the idea that homo=pediphile. If that is the case then the Hetero=tiny girl MUST be the same.

    I admit, I like young women, but I draw the line at the age of consent. I may gaze at a co-workers daughter, but I would NEVER ask her if I made her horny. Let alone be so stupid as to put it in an e-mail. That is the other thing here, Foley was so frickin' stupid to do that? And you trust this guy with national security? HA!

    Mabye Mr (formerly congressman) Foley needs the shots that Smithers takes in the Simpsons. the ones that would make him cry out "I love boobies" on the floor.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 1:04pm

  58. Posted by TJBEHRENS1 09/30/2006 @ 12:52am

    LOL.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 1:05pm

  59. Barney Frank could get caught balls deep in Ralph Reeds ass, crack pipe in hand, Castro on the line with Usam holding, and he would still have more morals than the repubes running our country (into the ground).

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 1:08pm

  60. Posted by RIO BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 12:22am

    1.The only "facts" you have straight are politically correct socio-pycho banter of rationalization and justification for aberrant and perverse behavior!

    2.You mean like, "you are the "representative spokesman for all over-educated yet mentaly challenged secular humanists developmentally referred to as a bonehead"?

    Ahh... ad hominem attack, the last resort of those whose other arguments have been shot down in flames. My facts are based on solid scientific and statistical evidence, Rio. Yours are based on...what exactly? Oh yes, your own convictions no matter the evidence that may contradict them. Intellectual and moral bankruptcy does not excuse you Rio, nor does it make your characterization of gays and lesbians any nearer to reality. As for myself, I think we all know (based on current evidence in this forum at least) who's actually mentally challeneged. I'll give you a hint in case it's too difficult a question for you, the lack of mental capacity is usually defined as the inability to exercise rational judgement and recognize reality. Think about it.

    Posted by Stwriley at 09/30/2006 @ 1:19pm

  61. "Brown is in a very tight race with DeWine and can't afford to give him the ammunition of voting against this travesty. I don't think that excuses him, but it's not like it wouldn't have passed without Brown's vote."

    Posted by STWRILEY 09/30/2006 @ 09:50am

    Well, gee...if it's a "very tight race" and the Dem "can't afford to give ammo to his Repub opponent"....

    then that certainly makes voting for torture, okay, huh?

    Is it any less hypocritical for "The Nation" to run articles and demand (as Peter Rothberg does) "Action Now" to stop such a bill....and then run ads supporting the "guy who represents the future of progressive politics" (Brown), who then votes for the bill...

    than some creep pedophile Repub, who's also on the "Committee against Child Predators"????

    Posted by Mask at 09/30/2006 @ 2:13pm

  62. Is it any less hypocritical for "The Nation" to run articles and demand (as Peter Rothberg does) "Action Now" to stop such a bill....and then run ads supporting the "guy who represents the future of progressive politics" (Brown), who then votes for the bill...

    than some creep pedophile Repub, who's also on the "Committee against Child Predators"????

    Posted by MASK 09/30/2006 @ 2:13pm

    It seems damned important to you to change the subject from Republican hypocrisy, you self-described "Clinton Democrat".

    Some candidate, somewhere, should tailor his/her message to the MASK vote....anti-Semitic AND anti-dicussion of hypocritical Republican pedophiles!

    Posted by fromredbird at 09/30/2006 @ 2:29pm

  63. Rove's fingerprints are all over this latest brouhaha. Rove told Hastert etal to keep Foley's "diversions" under wraps, save them for a rainy day when going public with a bombshell would be needed to put a bigger bombshell on page 21. Enter the rainstorm, Woodward's bombshell book. NOW'S the time to throw Foley under the bus.

    Rove is beyond diabolic - that's a given. But what about Hastert and other in-the-know Republicans? What if Foley, between last year and now, had acted out his fantasies and damaged some young man for life. Would Hastert etal feel any guilt? I doubt it. But who would be the more guilty. Foley, obviously a sick individual, or the Republicans who covered up the information until it could serve the interests of the Republican party to release it. (And for the M&M's on this site - today's Democrats, I'm afraid, would not be beyond such behavior either because today we are being governed by political parties, not the three branches of government specified in the Constitution.)

    Posted by felicity at 09/30/2006 @ 3:22pm

  64. Reguarding your quoting intentionally misleading scientific socio-anthropologic unsound studies from HOMOSEXUAL ADVOCACY websites;

    Posted by RIO BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 3:38pm

    Rio

    first you claimed that a pedophile was a picky homosexual and now you seem to be implying that you cruise a lot of homosexual advocacy websites.

    why don't you just come out of the closet and tell us that you have a thing for young boys?

    Posted by Will C. at 09/30/2006 @ 4:21pm

  65. Your facts are not "straight" facts but "Homosexual Advocacy" perversions of fact that the majority of the populace educated or otherwise recognizes as such! That is probably why you are so DISHONEST about your sourse for such distortions of representative truth!

    Posted by RIO BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 3:38pm

    it's funny how republicans talk just like that right up to the point where they get caught groping kid crotch.

    Posted by Will C. at 09/30/2006 @ 4:24pm

  66. Posted by FROMREDBIRD 09/30/2006 @ 2:29pm

    Abbas called, FRB....your "package" is ready and directions to a pizza parlour in downtown Tel Aviv!

    Posted by Mask at 09/30/2006 @ 4:54pm

  67. HOMOSEXUAL ADVOCACY websites;

    Posted by RIO THE FRIGHTENED (OF VILLAGE PEOPLE BAND MEMBERS) BRAVO 09/30/2006 @ 3:38pm

    That would be any source other then Bob Jones U. Do you have any science to back you up? Not some Intellegent Design funded source, but a legitimate scientific survey that proves gay men are more likely to ask young men or women that work for them to unclothe themselves on-line than straight men?

    And do you get the irony, oh such rich and creamy irony, that someone that aligns themselves with the party of family values again gets caught being a bad boy? That list has grown considerably since 2000 hasn't it?

    Does anybody have any history on Foleys campaigns? I am wondering if he ever used the whole values thing in ads.

    Posted by crabwalk at 09/30/2006 @ 5:35pm

  68. JR,

    Foley should go to jail. Period...and my thoughts on Frank are the same..."Your honor, I didn't know my wife was running a whore house when I left for work..." do you really think that would wash in court? I don't. Not where I live. All I am saying is the piling on for the "republican", as if this proves some point about republicans is nonsense and missies the point...guilt on all sides and the repubs seem to throw their turds out and the libs write books, go on tour with Oprah, and the media promote them to a high plain for "being true"...or so it seems...

    Posted by john maasch at 09/30/2006 @ 5:59pm

  69. In-case you think this post is insensitive, think-again. It's from a victim of child-molestation. This perp from Florida needs to be put under house-arrest for the rest-of-his-life. More-galling is the FACT that GOP-leadership KNEW FOR YEARS that this degenerate was guilty of this--this is a criminal-act, or was before the year 2000. Apparently, it no-longer is if you're a Republican, a Bishop or priest, or simply powerful and connected. I've done social-work with children who have had their parents put-out their cigarettes on their bodies, beaten them, everything. The problem is far-more widespread than most Americans know (or do they know?), or would care to admit. It is certainly a 'conspiracy-of-silence', our dirty-secret as a nation. The emails/IMs released yesterday by ABC were transmitted by Foley in 2003. It is likely the teenager alerted the press to this, good-show. http://chickasawpicklesmell.blogspot.com/

    Posted by Dr. Mabuse at 09/30/2006 @ 7:57pm

  70. Okay, hmmmmmmmmmmmm? I thought about it and my hypothesis is;

    1.The only "facts" you have straight are politically correct socio-pycho banter of rationalization and justification for aberrant and perverse behavior!

    Reguarding your quoting intentionally misleading scientific socio-anthropologic unsound studies from HOMOSEXUAL ADVOCACY websites;

    Ah yes, if you don't like the message, attack the messanger. Very nice, Rio, but this little distraction won't work. Dr. Herek is certainly an advocate for LGBT rights, and I never presented him as not being so. He also is an internationally recognized expert in the field of sexual orientation and its psychology and his sources for the linked paper are in fact the very same ones recognized by the American Psychological Association as central to the issue of the orientation of pedophiles. He even cites the only opposing studies (Cameron 1985 and Cameron, et al 1986) both of which have been shown to be so methodologically unsound that they are worthless for any purpose. There is simply no reliable data that supports your position. The APA itself used the same data that Herek cites in both its current guidelines for treating pedophilia and in its amicus brief to the Supreme Court in Boy Scouts of America v. James Dale. The only distortion involved here is your distorted view of what constitutes reliable scientific data.

    2.You mean like, "you are the "representative spokesman for all over-educated yet mentaly challenged secular humanists developmentally referred to as a bonehead"?

    Your facts are not "straight" facts but "Homosexual Advocacy" perversions of fact that the majority of the populace educated or otherwise recognizes as such! That is probably why you are so DISHONEST about your sourse for such distortions of representative truth!

    And the ad hominem attacks again. You really are at a loss for any real argument, aren't you Rio? All you have are your preconceived beliefs and no evidence whatsoever. I have never been anything but honest and straight-forward in this forum, even with a rude, anti-intellectual troll such as yourself. I'm starting to think that Will C. has it right. To paraphrase Shakespeare, "the gentaleman doth protest too much, methinks."

    Posted by Stwriley at 09/30/2006 @ 9:55pm

  71. An important day for me. The day that Maasch and Rio finally built up so much ugliness in their posts that I finally eliminated their posts from view. Things are starting to a look a little brighter.

    Ahhhhhhhh.

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 09/30/2006 @ 11:27pm

  72. It's comical how the liberals ***coughClintoncough*** are painting Republicans with such a broad brush. ***coughMcGreeveycough*** I mean, they would be wise to remember the old idiom about people living in glass houses ***coughWilliamJeffersoncough***

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:11am

  73. "Liberals", you Trojan or Cock, don't give two shakes of what you've got about Clinton. "Liberals" aren't in your bedroom providing suggestions about the gender of your partner, the orifice you might select, the purpose of your lovemaking, or what you might do should conception occur. Meanwhile, back to the staggering and continuing corruption of your party, you know, that group of do-gooders that have controlled the country for all of the third millennium...

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:21am

  74. Cough

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:21am

  75. TJ, don't speak ill of the dead. George paid for the rights to "He's so fine", albeit after he was sued.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 12:23am

  76. TJB:

    Here's my point--------------------------------------------------------------and here's you.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:31am

  77. Missing the point.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:32am

  78. But it seems as though I've struck a nerve.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:32am

  79. Posted by FROMREDBIRD 09/30/2006 @ 2:29pm

    Abbas called, FRB....your "package" is ready and directions to a pizza parlour in downtown Tel Aviv!

    Posted by MASK 09/30/2006 @ 4:54pm

    I see you had a lot to do on Saturday. Not surprising.

    Posted by fromredbird at 10/01/2006 @ 12:35am

  80. homosexual advocacy... sounds like a good idea to me. homosexuals are living people, and I'm pro life. I'm so pro life that I am against the death penalty.I'm so pro life that I believe that while she is alive, a woman has the right to choose what she does with her body, and a foetus is a part of a woman's body, it is not a citizen, or a baby.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 12:42am

  81. For many, many months know, I've watched as time after time, post after post, Mask jumps to be first poster so he can spin his wheels trying to concoct his little ‘Mask-boxes' around every issue the Nation writers bring up…'Mask-boxes' built of false dichotomies, misquotes, hell…MADE UP quotes, all to try to create a ‘package' of hypocrisy in which he has tried to place EVERY Nation writer at one time or another.

    Now, in a Nation post titled "Height of Hypocrisy" in which a Republican politician is shown to have engaged in VERY inappropriate behavior with a minor boy, while at the same time chairing a House panel on the very subject of exploiting children, suddenly Mask not only fails to post first, but, when he does, he says "…I'm seeing something A LOT more serious. A Democratic Congressman who voted for HR 6166, i.e. "Military Commissions Act" or, more generally...the "torture bill"

    More serious?!?! After months and months of concocting BS hypocrisy, here it is starting you in the face and suddenly there's something else "more serious"?!?! re serious than pedophilia AND the hypocrisy of practicing it while publicly chairng a government panel professing to investigate it!?!?!

    TALK ABOUT 'WHAT THE HELL"?!?!?!?!!!!!

    And then later, MAsk actually has the colossal GAUL to try to create yet another of his BULLSHIT ‘Mask-boxes' to make the Nation seem just as hypocritical as the child-molesting Rep. Mark Foley for running a Sherod Brown ad!?!?!?!

    MASK, you are THE MOST DISGUSTING hypocrite posting here…nobody else even comes close!

    Posted by Lillian at 10/01/2006 @ 12:44am

  82. USC,

    Are you implying that you had a point beyond pointing--shock of shocks--to Clinton and the former governor of New Jersey as a means of distracting our attention from the fourth member of your party to be given the boot from the House this year because he couldn't play by the rules? Was there a connection between the House leadership covering the tracks of one of its members and the daliances of Clinton or the mistakes of McGreevey? Or did I miss something between the lines of your post?

    cough

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:50am

  83. TJ, you are at the top of your game, aces all.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 12:51am

  84. JR,

    Nothing against George H. I was just poking fun at MASK's Sherrod Brown obsession.

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:57am

  85. TJB:

    You didn't miss anything between the lines. Only what was right in front of you. There are "dirty rotten scoundrals" throughout all levels of government. And--GASP!--in both parties. So while you and your liberal comrades enjoy painting Republicans with such a broad brush (hence my earlier use of the phrase "painting Republicans with such a broad brush") as pedophiles or criminals, you forget that your party has its own criminal elements-past, present, and undoubtedly future-that it must face down. (Thus, my use of the "glass houses" idiom.)

    Cases in point, during the democrat scandals, I don't recall liberals or even Republicans labelling the entire democrat party the party of liars (although it could be argued for any elected representative), bribe-makers, bribe-takers, or pimps while those respective scandals were going on.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 01:21am

  86. Cough

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 01:22am

  87. Quite frankly, I don't give a rat's ass what party an elected official belongs to. If he/she is breaking the law, then that official should be tried and convicted if guilty. End of story.

    BTW, hats off to you. You're the first to figure out that there is more than one USC.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 01:29am

  88. You didn't miss anything between the lines. Only what was right in front of you. There are "dirty rotten scoundrals" throughout all levels of government

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:21am

    you're equating perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the house leadership covering it up, with Bill Clinton having consentual sex with an adult woman (the knowledge of which then became daily fodder for the republican perv circle).

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 01:31am

  89. and what's with the cough... STD in the throat?

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 01:32am

  90. Nope, but whatever it is, it seems to be contagious.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 01:41am

  91. Nope, but whatever it is, it seems to be contagious.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:41am

    If you don't know what it is... how can you say nope?

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 01:46am

  92. Posted by WILL C. 10/01/2006 @ 01:31am

    Nope. Ask TJB. He might be able to help you. I gotta get some shut-eye.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 01:50am

  93. Posted by WILL C. 10/01/2006 @ 01:46am

    Because to get an STD of the throat would require actual contact with an STD.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 01:52am

  94. Because to get an STD of the throat would require actual contact with an STD.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:52am

    but to say nope requires a knowledge of the reasons for your cough and you claim not to have that knowledge.

    so is your above statement an example of denial, blind faith or are your rapidiy changing your story as your bullshit is exposed?

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 01:59am

  95. None of the above. I know that I haven't had any exposure to an STD. Thus, the cough could not be caused by one.

    But really, you're being silly.

    Good night.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 02:05am

  96. Nope. Ask TJB. He might be able to help you. I gotta get some shut-eye.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:50am

    sure you are. you entered this thread like this

    It's comical how the liberals ***coughClintoncough*** are painting Republicans with such a broad brush.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:11am

    heck even McGreevey's thing was consentual with an adult.

    yet you are atempting to equate these legal consentual actions with perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the house leadership covering it up.

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 02:05am

  97. Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 02:05am

    None of the above. I know that I haven't had any exposure to an STD. Thus, the cough could not be caused by one.

    Is it because you're one of those sexless, frigid as an ice cold metallic bumper fish evangelic conservatives... that your positive it's not an STD

    But really, you're being silly.

    I'm not the one trying to equate the legal consensual sexual behavior of a democratic president and governor with perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the house leadership covering it up.

    Good night.

    It will be for me. I won't have an STD in my throat keeping me up coughing all night.

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 02:13am

  98. USC, Will, TJ,

    The whole point to this story isn't Foley, it's the hypocrisy of the Republican leadership. USC, you bring up Clinton-Lewinski (as I already have over on another thread) but miss the point yourself. The same Republican leaders who have been conducting a cover-up for Foley were the ones screaming loudest for impeachment of Clinton. Why? (Wait for it...) Because he covered up his affair with Lewinski. TJ and Will have already shown the differences in these incidents (pursuing 16 year old boys in a positively predatory manner vs. having a consensual dalliance with an adult woman) but the real story is in the hypocrisy of those who excoriated the second to the point of making it a literal federal case vs. the same people covering up the first and now "investigating" it in a way guarenteed to do exactly nothing. They are the ones whose political careers should be ended over this, for blatently abusing the public trust.

    Posted by Stwriley at 10/01/2006 @ 08:40am

  99. Riley you are spot on, it is not clear what laws Foley has broken, there are no reports of him raling boys. this is above all an ethical and political issue, an abuse of his position and an abuse of the public trust.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 09:37am

  100. raping, not raling

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 09:37am

  101. Posted by LILLIAN 10/01/2006 @ 12:44am |

    "The Nation" ad shows a quote from them praising him...they put him on the cover LAST WEEK....and then he votes for the "torture bill"?

    Care to TRY to defend that kind of hypocrisy...or just engage in ad hominum against me?

    Posted by Mask at 10/01/2006 @ 09:46am

  102. engage in ad hominum against me?

    it's ad hominEm, and the against me is redundant in this case.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 09:52am

  103. What an incredible world of hurt this guy has gotten himself into. I just don't understand why a congressman would do something so blatantly risky and dangerous. But it probably just goes to show how little I know about what goes on with most of the powerful, elite goons in Washington.

    My first impression is that, as a congressman, he may have felt invincible from harm. You've got to imagine those guys and gals consider themselves veritable demigods among men. Another thought is that when it comes to addictions, rational thought goes out the window. Whether you smoke crack in hotel rooms, drive drunk on Capital Hill, share a home with gay prostitutes, lead a secret homosexual life while married and with kids, have an affair with a teenage intern who is kidnapped and killed... Good Lord the list is long! In each case I ask myself why these dumb asses would risk it all over something so seemingly trivial. But I guess addiction is addiction and that's a hard thing to resist.

    Posted by Person at 10/01/2006 @ 10:44am

  104. MASK, you and you're Republicans are egg-suckin' dogs. You're a Clinton Democrat (self-described) concerned about hypocrisy like Mark Foley is an advocate for Missing and Exploited Children.

    Add in the issue of your anti-semitism and you take the cake for the list of hypocrite Republicans posting here.

    Posted by fromredbird at 10/01/2006 @ 10:45am

  105. Person, to quote the late great Flip Wilson, the devil made them do it. they are no different from you or me, their sins are just made public.

    Posted by johannesrolf at 10/01/2006 @ 10:57am

  106. Posted by LVLIBERTY1 10/01/2006 @ 11:15am

    Do you have a point to make about the GOP House leadership coverup or are you just taking your "talking points" from the RNC?

    If so, enlighten us.

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 11:53am

  107. By the way, if anyone is concerned with my safety, I'm not holding my breath that liberty loving enlightenment will be delivered.

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 11:57am

  108. Riley:

    Nope. I swear, you, WillC, and TJB must all read from the same "How to Miss the Point" handbook. Read my posts again. I said nothing of hypocrisy because that was not the point of my posting.

    I simply pointed out to those who like to label all Republicans "pedophiles" because of the actions of one individual that they need to consider the actions of members of their own party; Lest they would become known as perjurers (Clinton), bribe-takers(Jefferson), sexual harassers (McGreevey).

    As for the scandal itself, I felt that my earlier statement pretty much summed up my thoughts on the issue:

    Quite frankly, I don't give a rat's ass what party an elected official belongs to. If he/she is breaking the law, then that official should be tried and convicted if guilty. End of story.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:01pm

  109. Posted by WILL C. 10/01/2006 @ 02:05am

    When did perjury become legal?

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:03pm

  110. They are the ones whose political careers should be ended over this, for blatantly abusing the public trust.

    Posted by STWRILEY 10/01/2006 @ 08:40am

    I disagree that hypocrisy is the issue here. For more than two decades the great liberal center has been thwapped over head by conservatives and their "values". Now that they are running the show. it's glaringly apparent that the hamsters have no values. For twenty years they've been telling the world that they are better than us. But it turns out that they are worse than us. Liberals may from time to time commit immoral acts. But conservatives are amoral. They completely lack any sense of morality.

    Winning is all that matters in Hamsterland. And the hamsters will do and say anything to achieve that end.

    The issue isn't hypocrisy.

    The issue is treachery

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 12:08pm

  111. When did perjury become legal?

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:03am

    when the charges are trumped up

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 12:09pm

  112. Hi USC? TJ here. Not a democrat. So is there a point directed at those like me who have no ties to Clinton or McGreevey (never voted for either) or is it just merely a distraction?

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 12:13pm

  113. Care to TRY to defend that kind of hypocrisy...or just engage in ad hominum against me?

    Posted by MASK 10/01/2006 @ 09:46am | ignore this person

    Mask, you're not going to suck me into one of your little bullshit 'Mask-box' agruements. Foley is clearly he poster child for hypocrisy (or at least he was until YOU came along.) At least Leave Liberty had the scruples and courage of his convictions to admit that, as a fellow Republican, he is "saddened and sickened" by Foley's actions and hypocrisy.

    You on the other hand, are clearly trying HARD to change the subject. You've posted NOT ONE WORD about Foley's actions OR his hypocrisy!! Given your previous history of CONSTANTLY trying to find (or manufacture) hypocrisy where none really exists, continuously claiming that hypocrisy is a vile sin without equal, etc. your actions now are contemptable and quite revealing.

    You can pretend that I'm "...just engage(ing) in ad hominum against (you)..." if it helps you avoid the shame. But the reality is that your own actions make YOU the biggest hypocrit here. There is nothing that The Nation has done, or that ANY writer at The Nation has ever posted, that even comes close!!

    Posted by Lillian at 10/01/2006 @ 1:00pm

  114. I simply pointed out to those who like to label all Republicans "pedophiles" because of the actions of one individual that they need to consider the actions of members of their own party; Lest they would become known as perjurers (Clinton), bribe-takers(Jefferson), sexual harassers (McGreevey).

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:01am

    it's intersting that you've actually read the "How to Miss the Point" handbook.

    which might explain how you missed the point that niether liberals or democrats helped Clinton, McGreevey or Jefferson cover up there behavior.

    doesn't aiding and abeting a perv mean that you are coddling pervs... that you are "with" the pervs?

    and if you're "with" em, that means you ain't agin em.

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 1:11pm

  115. In-case you think this post is insensitive, think-again. It's from a victim of child-molestation. This perp from Florida needs to be put under house-arrest for the rest-of-his-life. More-galling is the FACT that GOP-leadership KNEW FOR YEARS that this degenerate was guilty of this--this is a criminal-act, or was before the year 2000. Apparently, it no-longer is if you're a Republican, a Bishop or priest, or simply powerful and connected. I've done social-work with children who have had their parents put-out their cigarettes on their bodies, beaten them, everything. The problem is far-more widespread than most Americans know (or do they know?), or would care to admit. It is certainly a 'conspiracy-of-silence', our dirty-secret as a nation. The emails/IMs released yesterday by ABC were transmitted by Foley in 2003. It is likely the teenager alerted the press to this, good-show. http://chickasawpicklesmell.blogspot.com/

    Posted by Dr. Mabuse at 10/01/2006 @ 1:44pm

  116. Posted by LILLIAN 10/01/2006 @ 1:00pm

    Throw Foley UNDER the jail, LILLIAN. And then you can laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh at "GOP hypocrisy".

    Now...care to answer how on serious national policy matters, why "The Nation" is supporting (whole-heartedly I might add, with a quote, not just "accepting his ad money") a guy who voted FOR the "torture bill"?

    Or is it okay to be a hypocrite when the "D" is beside the title?

    Foley may have by hypocritical and working against his own sick desires....but Brown the (according to "The Nation") "future of progressive politics" knew EXACTLY what he was doing when he voted for that bill ....trying to play CYA in an election year against an incumbent.

    Posted by Mask at 10/01/2006 @ 2:25pm

  117. Foley may have by hypocritical and working against his own sick desires....but Brown the (according to "The Nation") "future of progressive politics" knew EXACTLY what he was doing when he voted for that bill ....trying to play CYA in an election year against an incumbent.

    Posted by MASK 10/01/2006 @ 2:25pm

    mask you seem desparate to change the subject to anything other than the republicans being with the pervs

    And are you saying that foley and the house leaderhip didn't know exactly what they were doing?

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 2:46pm

  118. or did the devil make em do it

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 2:46pm

  119. Posted by MASK 10/01/2006 @ 2:25pm

    Still think Harrison is the bigger issue here and I'm not going to let it go until it is beaten silly into the ground no matter how irrelevant the topic is to the thread. As I understand it, he wasn't even an American! Just what nation is The Nation supposed to be about anyways?

    Posted by tjbehrens1 at 10/01/2006 @ 2:50pm

  120. Posted by MASK 10/01/2006 @ 2:25pm | ignore this person

    Mask, remember when Richard Kim wrote about the treatment of gays by Iraqi muslims? You went on and on and on about how he (and other gay rights activists) had no right speak about gay rights without first writing an equal number of words regarding other Iraqi muslim offenses.

    Mask, you have MUCH, MUCH more you need to write on the subject of Foley's hypocrisy AND the hypocrisy of the Republicans who knew about Foley's perversions but remained silent because they placed party loyalty above all else.

    Write some more...MUCH MORE...regarding those hypocrisies. After you've done so, maybe THEN you can change the subject to the hypocrisy you percieve regarding the torture bill.

    Unless/until that happens, you are STILL showing yourself to be the biggest hypocrite posting here!!!!!!

    Posted by Lillian at 10/01/2006 @ 2:56pm

  121. And Mask, just to set the record straight, directly contrary to you're statement "And then you can laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh at "GOP hypocrisy"...I'm not laughing AT ALL. Never did, never will, not once, not ever regarding this subject.

    Posted by Lillian at 10/01/2006 @ 3:00pm

  122. Excuse me...your statement...and a completely made up one with no basis in fact or reality, I might add!

    Posted by Lillian at 10/01/2006 @ 3:14pm

  123. Posted by WILL C. 10/01/2006 @ 1:11pm

    it's intersting that you've actually read the "How to Miss the Point" handbook.

    More interesting is that you're putting it into practice.

    which might explain how you missed the point that niether liberals or democrats helped Clinton, McGreevey or Jefferson cover up there behavior.

    Never missed it. Just never commented on it. But it's good to see you finally admit that Clinton did something wrong. Admitting it is the first step.

    doesn't aiding and abeting a perv mean that you are coddling pervs... that you are "with" the pervs? and if you're "with" em, that means you ain't agin em.

    Yup. Hence, my earlier statement--"Quite frankly, I don't give a rat's ass what party an elected official belongs to. If he/she is breaking the law, then that official should be tried and convicted if guilty. End of story."

    But it's good to see that you're finally catching up. If you need any more help understanding the ideas discussed here, just ask.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 4:36pm

  124. Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 4:36pm

    More interesting is that you're putting it into practice.

    Then I'm sure you can provide examples

    Never missed it. Just never commented on it. But it's good to see you finally admit that Clinton did something wrong. Admitting it is the first step.

    Why would you comment on it if you are trying to equate legal consensual sexual behavior with perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the house leadership covering it up? That would be honest.

    And perhaps you'd like to provide an example of how I made the admission you claimed I made.

    Yup. Hence, my earlier statement--"Quite frankly, I don't give a rat's ass what party an elected official belongs to. If he/she is breaking the law, then that official should be tried and convicted if guilty. End of story."

    Great, thanks for admitting that the leadership of the house republicans are with the perv's. But it's a futile futile attempt on your part at CYA. You didn't enter the thread with your "quite frankly" comment, you entered it this way

    B It's comical how the liberals ***coughClintoncough*** are painting Republicans with such a broad brush. ***coughMcGreeveycough*** I mean, they would be wise to remember the old idiom about people living in glass houses ***coughWilliamJeffersoncough***

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:11am

    You entered the thread not only making light of it (like this is some kind of joke) but also trying to equate legal consensual sexual behavior with perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the house republican leadership covering that up. That is the issue here, isn't it? Your "quite frankly" post didn't even enter your mind until more than an hour and six of your posts later.

    But it's good to see that you're finally catching up. If you need any more help understanding the ideas discussed here, just ask.

    Excellent. I'll be waiting for those examples.

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 6:22pm

  125. Uh-oh, WillC's no longer being trite and actually trying to frame a debate. This could be trouble.

    Go back and read for comprehension, WillC. Those six subsequent posts are illustrating to TJB and others how they were missing the point of my initial post. Which, after multiple explanations, you still don't get. Jiminy Crickets, man, are you this dense on purpose or do you come by it naturally? Either way, I'm afraid we're going to have to hold you back a grade if you can't keep up with the rest of the class.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 6:53pm

  126. Ah, well, responsibilities await. It's been fun if not fruitful. Have a good week everybody.

    Posted by usc1 at 10/01/2006 @ 6:54pm

  127. Go back and read for comprehension, WillC. Those six subsequent posts are illustrating to TJB and others how they were missing the point of my initial post. Which, after multiple explanations, you still don't get. Jiminy Crickets, man, are you this dense on purpose or do you come by it naturally? Either way, I'm afraid we're going to have to hold you back a grade if you can't keep up with the rest of the class.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 6:53pm

    Really.. Your six subsequent posts are illustrating to TJ and others how they were missing the point of your initial post.

    What do you say we take a look at them?

    :)

    Well... here's your first post making light of the situation and trying to equate consensual sexual behavior with perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the republican house leadership covering it up

    It's comical how the liberals ***coughClintoncough*** are painting Republicans with such a broad brush. ***coughMcGreeveycough*** I mean, they would be wise to remember the old idiom about people living in glass houses ***coughWilliamJeffersoncough***

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:11am

    Here's your second post highlighting that your point in your first post was a long chain of dashes

    TJB: Here's my point--------------------------------------------------------------and here's you.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:31am

    Here's your third post. Considering it's a sentence fragment and that it only makes sense if it's taken as part of your second post. The two taken together say that your point is a long chain a dashes and that TJ missed that it (your point) was a long chain of dashes

    Missing the point.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:32am

    Here's your forth post commenting on how you upset TJ after he realized that your point was a long chain of dashes and he didn't get it

    But it seems as though I've struck a nerve.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 12:32a

    Here's you fifth post which is really the only time you try to make a point. Excepting that you never used the term "dirty rotten scoundrels" in your first four post so that wasn't right in front of anybody and consensual sex with an adult doesn't exactly make you a dirty rotten scoundrel. In addition your first four posts never said anything about all levels of government so again that concept wasn't right in front of TJ's face. And while you are correct that there are individuals who have broken the law in the Democratic Party that pales in comparison to the organized corruption, crime and cover-up that is the modern day republican

    TJB: You didn't miss anything between the lines. Only what was right in front of you. There are "dirty rotten scoundrals" throughout all levels of government. And--GASP!--in both parties. So while you and your liberal comrades enjoy painting Republicans with such a broad brush (hence my earlier use of the phrase "painting Republicans with such a broad brush") as pedophiles or criminals, you forget that your party has its own criminal elements-past, present, and undoubtedly future-that it must face down. (Thus, my use of the "glass houses" idiom.) Cases in point, during the democrat scandals, I don't recall liberals or even Republicans labelling the entire democrat party the party of liars (although it could be argued for any elected representative), bribe-makers, bribe-takers, or pimps while those respective scandals were going on.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:21am |

    Post six, where again you are making light of perv boy republican hitting on 16 year old kids and then he (perv boy) and the house republican leadership covering it up or… you demonstrate that you really do type cough every time that STD in your throat flares up.

    Since you deny the later… the former it must be

    Cough

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:22am

    And alas post seven, where after making light of the situation and a fool of your self in the first six posts, you rather clumsily try to CYA

    Quite frankly, I don't give a rat's ass what party an elected official belongs to. If he/she is breaking the law, then that official should be tried and convicted if guilty. End of story.

    BTW, hats off to you. You're the first to figure out that there is more than one USC.

    Posted by USC1 10/01/2006 @ 01:29am

    Now having reviewed your posts, jiminy crickets are you dense, do you really expect us to believe that any of them were a faithful attempt to explain your first post?

    You need to tell me what schools you did those seven years of post grad work at. I want to be sure that none of my family ever goes there.

    Posted by Will C. at 10/01/2006 @ 7:49pm

  128. Meanwhile, the FBI has now launched an investigation into Foley's conduct. Apparenlty, they haven't been briefed by Mask on the Sherrod Brown / The Nation criminal hypocrisy yet!

    Posted by Lillian at 10/02/2006 @ 12:11am

  129. Posted by LVLIBERTY1 10/01/2006 @ 11:15am

    I don't know whether you are purposely trying to be absurd or you are more ignorant than your previous postings suggest.

    No Lvliberty, I leave absurdist writing to you, not having much use for it myself. As for ignorance, we'll deal with the actual ignorance involved here (yours) below...

    Foley is not the point? I think most Americans would disagree with you.

    Foley is not the point of the story and hasn't been for at least two days now. If you paid any attention to news beyond what's spoon-fed to you by FOXNews you'd know that. The story of Foley ended when he was exposed, resigned, and came under FBI investigation (though that was only announced today, it has certainly been going on since the revelation of his email exchanges, as that's the only criminal issue that's possibly involved.) As far as the story goes, that has since shifted to the cover-up. If you think otherwise then you are out of touch with what people are seeing even in the MSM and the real importance of the story as it has developed. The American people have already judged Foley, found him to be a hypocritical and unethical figure, and moved on. The question now is what was done to cover for him; the old "what did the Republican leadership know and when did they know it?" That is what is now relevant.

    From many of your previous postings here at the Nation, I would suspect you get a number of your talking points from the DNC. Certainly that seems to be obvious on this thread.

    Oh, a nice switch from ad hominem abusive to ad hominem circumstantial. Excellent, Lvliberty, you've proven that you know how to employ more than one logical fallacy. Not that that makes it any more valid. I have long since made it plain that I am not a Democrat, but a radical left progressive who usually supports Democratic candidates because they come closest to my own political positions. Your canard about the DNC is no more than distraction from what you don't want to even admit much less discuss; the complicity of the Republican leadership in covering up what is likely to be criminal activity. Despite your obvious affinity for positions that are very close to RNC positions (indeed, identical to them) I have never accused you of being an operative for or "taking your talking points from" the RNC. You might try extending the same courtesy, if you have any to extend.

    It is also apparent from your use of the DNC talking points on Clinton. Trying to use the subterfuge that Clinton was impeached for an affair. Wrong!!! Clinton was impeached for lying under oath. The impeachment process was thus appropriate. The vote to not remove from office is more open to debate.

    My point was and remains that Clinton was impeached for covering up his affair, which is exactly why the Republican leadership's cover-up activities are the height of hypocrisy. They may not have lied under oath in a civil case (and the entire question of whether that rises to the Constitutional level of "high crimes and misdemeanors" is still not clear and thus the articles of impeachment are still questionable despite your own certainty) but they do seem to have covered up a federal felony (the use of electronic communications to solicit sexual activity from a minor, which in federal law is anyone under 18.) These same men (Hastert, Boehner, et al) were screaming for Clinton's head and his removal back during the impeachment. Now they may well have been guilty of a far more serious breach of the law, yet you choose to defend them by insisting that this is all about Foley. You are being willfully obtuse on this point Lvliberty, as you are below.

    BTW, do you have some inside connections with the DNC that has given you all of the evidence on an investigation that was only authorized on Friday that gives you such confidence that all of the Republican leadership needs to be removed? If so enlighten us as to this extraordinary influence you have in Washington.

    Since an "inside connection with the DNC" would not yield anything in this regard, as you well know, this is another piece of willful obfuscation. I am working from publicly made statements by Republican leaders themselves that have been reported over the weekend. This requires no special knowledge other than an ability to actually hear what is being said by the people involved, an ability you apparently do not possess. You also deliberately conflate my obvious meaning in using the phrase "Republican leadership" from the Republican House leadership involved in this affair to all Republican leaders, a meaning so obvious to everyone here that I did not think the clarification even necessary. Once again, deliberately obtuse. This simple fact is that their own public statements about when they learned of the email exchanges have not only changed but now reveal that they knew of these at least a year ago and possibly as far back as 2001. They also certainly knew that these were violations of federal law since they were the ones who actually passed the relevant legislation (and just to add an additional layer of hypocrisy, vetted it thru Foley's Caucus on Missing and Exploited Children.) Just because you refuse to see what is becoming obvious to virtualy everyone else in the country does not make it either "secret knowledge" or some insider DNC plot. It just means that you have a hard time with truth when you don't like the result. Prehaps you should be a member of Republican (House) leadership; you'd fit right in.

    Posted by Stwriley at 10/02/2006 @ 10:57am

  130. I'm not generally a conspiracy theorist.... but..... anyone else out there noticing that the Foley issue has overshadowed this flagrant breech of both the Geneva Conventions and the US Constitution?

    Foley is a depraved individual and a symbol of where our leadership has gone over the last 6 years,

    but the issue of weather our (elected-by-idiots) government is allowed to "disappear" and torture people with impunity is world-changing.

    Could the outting of Foley-the-pederast be a very well timed, well planned way of filling simple American minds with foul clap-trap so that they are diverted from the effort of trying to understand the complexities of the Detainees Bill?

    Are We so dumbed-down? Are "they" so clever?

    Anyone else worried?

    Posted by akdamm at 10/03/2006 @ 7:18pm

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