Buzzflash
del.icio.us
Digg
Facebook
Mixx it!
RedditAs a general rule I don't do a ton of foreign policy commenting here on Capitolism, but I think the latest news that Israel has decided to ban Arab parties from the upcoming election pretty much speaks for itself.
What a terrible, terrible idea.
Share this article
- Atrios
- Arts and Letters Daily
- The Caucus
- Campus Progress
- Crooks and Liars
- The Daily Gotham
- Daily Kos
- Echidne of the Snakes
- Ezra Klein
- FAIR
- Feministe
- Feministing
- Firedoglake
- Glenn Greenwald
- Gothamist
- In these Times
- Hendrik Hertzberg
- Huffington Post
- Hullabaloo
- Matthew Yglesias
- Media Matters
- Mother Jones
- My DD
- New York Review of Books
- Openleft
- Pam's House Blend
- Pandagon
- Political Wire
- The Progressive
- RaceWire
- Real Clear Politics
- Roberto Lovato
- Romenesko
- Swing State Project
- Talking Points Memo
- Ta-Nehisi Coates
- Tapped
- Tech President
- Tompaine
- The Washington Note
- Utne Reader
- Wonkette
- ZNet
RSS
"All political parties are equal, but some political parties are more equal than others!"----"Animal Kibbutz"
Posted by Mask at 01/12/2009 @ 4:26pm
and the apartheid continues...
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/12/2009 @ 5:01pm
Wait, seriously? I agree with Chris here; terrible decision.
Posted by Thrawn at 01/12/2009 @ 5:07pm
How many of those parties were organized around ethnic or religious lines? Obviously, it's probably fine to back the "we should violently overthrow the government" party, but that's not at all what this is.
Posted by Thrawn at 01/12/2009 @ 5:54pm
Okay....can't wait for our favorite Christian Zionist Liburty to justify this one.....wasn't he the one promoting Israel as a bastion of tolerance because they had allowed some Uncle Tom A-rabs in the Knesset. The "Jewish State" indeed.
Posted by OneVote at 01/12/2009 @ 5:54pm
sounds more like a dumocracy.
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/12/2009 @ 6:09pm
Like Mr. Hayes, when I saw the news (even the egregiously doting New York Times was forced to report it) that Israel was banning Arab-friendly political parties in the upcoming election, I was taken aback. The naked hypocrisy of claiming to be not just a democracy but the only regional democracy PLUS claiming to be a nation which is open to Arabs and where Arabs can vote their interest if they are Israeli citizens, and then banning political parties that don't support for example the slaughter in Gaza, is truly stunning.
I'd like to briefly correct Mr. Hayes on a different point - he seems to go along with the obligatory Israeli claim that they are the "only" regional democracy. In fact, the Palestinian authority held an internationally-monitored democratic election last year, and elected its own government. Unfortunately, Israel responded to that election by kidnapping a good number of the elected officials (the ones Israel disagreed with), fomenting civil war in the government, and is now committing a savage assault on the lands and people where the legitimately elected majority party of the Palestinian Authority holds power.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 6:20pm
In Israel, an Iraeli Arab citizen can either vote to have his people slaughtered brutally in great numbers, or he can ... vote to have his people slaughtered brutally in great numbers.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 6:22pm
The next step is to follow Rabbi Meir Kahane's recommendation and expel all Arabs out of Israel. In fact, Tzipi Livni has come close to advocating expelling Arabs, as a campaign platform. Israel will finally become the pure Jewish state the Zionists always aspired to. This racist decision will bring Israel more in line with the late Apartheid state of South Africa.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 6:22pm
this is absurd. no equivocating - big PR mistake by israel as well as just plain wrong.
Posted by ibbleblibble at 01/12/2009 @ 6:29pm
Well, here they go again, stating what they want...the arrogance of Israel is beyond belief. Is there really any wonder why the support for Palestine is so strong while these bully boy's want to run the show? You have to wonder if they feel that they are in total control of everyone around them...how they are allowed to dictate the terms of anything is absolutely incredible.
Posted by Caj at 01/12/2009 @ 6:40pm
This is particularly nauseating: the thing in the world that Al Franken and Norm Coleman agree on is that the Gaza slaughter is A-O-K:
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/ 2009/01/franken_and_coleman_publicly_come_to gether_on_isra.php
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 6:43pm
And in other news, Ehud Olmert is quoted in Western media as demonstrating the Israeli stranglehold on American foreign policy: he literally called the President and told the President that the Secretary of State was not to vote in favor of a cease-fire, when she planning to do so. Instead, she abstained from voting on her own resolution:
" ... In the night between Thursday and Friday, when the secretary of state wanted to lead the vote on a ceasefire at the Security Council, we did not want her to vote in favour," Olmert said. "I said 'get me President Bush on the phone'. They said he was in the middle of giving a speech in Philadelphia. I said I didn't care. 'I need to talk to him now'. He got off the podium and spoke to me. ..."
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/AL eqM5gD-QcI_C-CrcqfSZBh6A5_e514Zw
from
"Rice shame-faced by Bush over UN Gaza vote: Olmert"
I repeat:
" ... "In the night between Thursday and Friday, when the secretary of state wanted to lead the vote on a ceasefire at the Security Council, we did not want her to vote in favour," Olmert said. "I said 'get me President Bush on the phone'. They said he was in the middle of giving a speech in Philadelphia. I said I didn't care. 'I need to talk to him now'. He got off the podium and spoke to me. "I told him the United States could not vote in favour. It cannot vote in favour of such a resolution. He immediately called the secretary of state and told her not to vote in favour. ..."
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 6:49pm
No Israel lobby, indeed. We have the Prime Minister of Israel himself quoted in Western media as saying he called the President of the US and ordered him to stop his Secretary of State to not vote for her own resolution at the UN because Israel would not have it.
This article makes it explicitly clear who calls the shots in the US when it comes to Israel.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 6:50pm
HAPPYLonghorn,
This is true and expected from a state that is ruled by war criminals. It doesn't remind me of anything but racist white South Africa.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 6:50pm
Why would anyone with an IQ of over 60 be surprised at anything the Jews do?
Posted by ehross at 01/12/2009 @ 6:51pm
syfriendly,
It doesn't surprise me that Ehud Olmert ordered Bush to vote against the UN resolution which the US helped formulate. The Israelis once attacked our navy ship Liberty, killing 34 American sailors and wounding 70, then ordered President Johnson to close the investigation.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 7:04pm
Besides stating the obvious, Israel's lack of democracy except for its Jewish majority, the Supreme Court may shoot this decision down, but we'll see. While politicians and even the public often back incendiary decisions like this on many occasions, Israeli courts SOMETIMES step in and do the right thing, but very mixed bag even on that score. Israel is also not unusual in banning parties it doesn't like. India's constitution prohibits secessionist parties to take part in elections for example. In some countries extreme far right parties are banned (Austria for example). Curiously though Israeli Arabs tend to be very non-violent. They are rarely connected to terrorism (meeting other Arabs in other countries is hardly a crime) and the guilt by association aspect is clear here. What's telling is that Israeli Arabs show a road that could have been, a multi-ethnic state. Lebanon is trotted as the reason that wouldn't work, BUT Israel (or Palestine) could have done it differently by not having a formula for disaster (rotating Christian PM, Sunni President as in Leb.) and perhaps even pushing for a Swiss model. Citizenship for all, equality, rule of law enforced by the state and prosperity would have made Israel truly a beacon of democracy, which it currently IS NOT. A lost opportunity? Yes. Of course, I expect our MSM to either downplay or ignore this issue OR justify it as temporary during war. I mean Coulter and company think the internment of the Japanese and McCarthyism was okay so why wouldn't they be cool with this? Most disappointing, as always, are the Dems who will cowardly continue to back Israel's every move. I've said it before and I'll say it again, terrorism IS NOT the worst thing this world has faced, it's conventional war waged by powerful organized states.
Posted by nukemind at 01/12/2009 @ 7:08pm
Why would anyone with an IQ of over 60 be surprised at anything the Jews do?
Posted by ehross at 01/12/2009 @ 6:51pm
You mean Israelis right? Keep in mind, people Norman Finkelstein, Noam Chomsky, Albert Einstein, and many others are 'Jews' (not necessarily as some have been atheists, but I digress) and have been amongst Israel's harshest critics. Preferably terms like Zionists might even work, but really it's Israelis (discounting the minority that is not supporting the current strife).
Posted by nukemind at 01/12/2009 @ 7:13pm
At some point, Barack is going to have to throw the Israeli Lobby under the bus with Reverend Wright.
How much more proof is needed that current cast of clowns running the Israeli government are a bunch of racist, religious bigots who have absolutely no respect for the democratic values shared by most Americans.
Granted, AIPAC is powerful now because of their donor base and US media contacts, but this "power" can easily be thwarted if Obama has the will to say NO to them and show them during the next election cycle that he has his own donor base and media contacts, and no longer needs AIPAC to win.
Moreover, if Obama leads the charge during his first term to get REAL campaign finance reform passed, he can get the votes as long as it is airtight legislation so that there will be no reprisals from lobbyist groups of this sort ever again.
The key to making this airtight is publicly funded elections as the exclusive means of funding all federal elections, and "reasonable" restrictions on free speech of so-called "independent" groups (527s) so that they can not run ads within 90 days of any federal election.
Let's DO this!
YES WE CAN!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/12/2009 @ 7:24pm
Nukemind,
I fully agree with your remarks on the need to differentiate between Jews and Zionists. Many great and honorable Jews have contributed great deal to the liberty and progress of mankind.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 7:25pm
The paralells between Hamas-Hitler and the german people-and so called palestinians must be purely coincidental. Otherwise the Gaza people are desirous of a democratic dictatorship!
Posted by comanchenation at 01/12/2009 @ 7:18pm
Uh, you are aware that this article is referring to a situation in Israel proper, right? Also, Hamas-Hitler? Please explain where Hamas declares itself the 'master race' and note the huge disparity in power. Nazi Germany was a super power of its day, the Palestinians are an occupied people responding to an aggressive occupation/annexation (Gaza border control and seizing of West Bank territory). Now if Hamas had not been pushed by an Israeli-US supported coup attempt by Fatah, then maybe we wouldn't be talking about a democratic dictatorship anyway. Details, details.
Posted by nukemind at 01/12/2009 @ 7:26pm
"Nukekind"
No, I mean Jews
The number of prominent American Jews that oppose,and speak out against the actions of their fellow Jews in Palestine is minuscule.
When they put America first the page can be turned.
Posted by ehross at 01/12/2009 @ 7:32pm
Many great and honorable Jews have contributed great deal to the liberty and progress of mankind.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 7:25pm
Group association's always a problem. The Israelis are collectively punishing people and so collectively labeling a group makes things problematic in all instances. Even when I say Israelis, I mean the ones who are acting out and supporting this and other policies. There's no need to go overboard like this as the list of crimes and unjust acts by Israel far outweigh anything their neighborhood has done to them despite the rhetoric. Yet, the rhetoric and anger have been used effectively in this country to maintain support for Israel.
Posted by nukemind at 01/12/2009 @ 7:37pm
Re: the conversation here started on "Jews" versus "Israelis -
Certainly, Israel is not winning any PR battles for Jews anywhere. Objectively, some could argue that Israel is a force for creating real anti-Jew sentiment all over the world. With respect to Israel and the rich, doting American Jewish Zionists whose united lobbying efforts and bank accounts together with Israeli lobbying together create a death grip on a segment of our decision making and media, these people need to wake up and see that they are amongst their own worst enemies.
Finally, I continue to insist that it is a sick thing to do, to use the WWII holocaust as a fig leaf or an excuse for covering Israel's decades-long history of crimes.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 7:40pm
No, I mean Jews
The number of prominent American Jews that oppose,and speak out against the actions of their fellow Jews in Palestine is minuscule.
When they put America first the page can be turned.
Posted by ehross at 01/12/2009 @ 7:32pm
Yeah but that group includes people against this too and thus the rub. I agree though that the unconditional backers of Israel are a problem as well as Christian fundamentalists and all the other Americans who put Israel first due to both ignorance and other factors. I just can't apply the term Jews as an epitaph and lump them all together and much prefer terms like Ultra Zionists (the peaceful variety of Zionists who seek co-existence I have no problem with).
Posted by nukemind at 01/12/2009 @ 7:41pm
>>>Yet, the rhetoric and anger have been used effectively in this country to maintain support for Israel.
Posted by nukemind at 01/12/2009 @ 7:37pm<<<
We can give tremendous support to Israel without letting the tail wag the dog.
The Israeli government must understand that America really does stand for something, and is not just a bunch of cowards you can bribe with the Israeli Lobby.
This is a leadership and power adjustment issue, and Barack has all of the tools at his disposal to get this done.
We want to support Israel and make it the model in the Middle East of cooperation between Arab and non-Arab, Christian , Jew and Muslim. But we have to take an honest look at how American oversight of Israel has been undermined by their lobby, and take concrete steps to re-assert American leadership in the region.
Congress is AFRAID of the Israeli Lobby and THAT is why you see all of these lopsided votes and ordinarily decent senators and congresspersons parroting word-for-word what AIPAC tells them to say.
When you are dealing with a bully who wants you to be afraid, you stand up to him and outsmart him to defeat him. You don't try to go after him using their strength, you find a way to defeat them where their strength no longer matters.
Nearly all of lobbies of this sort derive their power from our reliance on their money to fund elections and our allowance of them to bundle resources and target specific members of Congress during the election cycle with TV ads.
But WE control the FCC, and WE control what elections laws we can pass. Let's use this control to put the bully in its place for good!
Posted by Metteyya at 01/12/2009 @ 7:49pm
blackcoptermedia.com is the new reason for the season. Grassroots at its best supported by you the viewing public. Check out a article call CNN and W. Bush and the Kilingons.
Posted by thesid at 01/12/2009 @ 7:55pm
The Jews do not want any term used that properly identifies them,Zionist,Israeli,any thing but Jews.
Does anyone think that it is the Palestinians still allowed to live in their homeland, that are responsible for the massacre taking place in Gaza?
Peel back the camouflage and what you have is Jews.
Posted by ehross at 01/12/2009 @ 8:04pm
<i>Posted by ehross at 01/12/2009 @ 8:04pm </i>
Oh, OK. So you don't even pretend you're not defending outright bigotry. Glad to know.
Posted by Thrawn at 01/12/2009 @ 8:33pm
Arabs have NOT been banned from running for office or voting. Two parties specifically were banned who are Arab only parties, United Arab List-Ta'al and Balad. Posted by lvliberty1 at 01/12/2009 @ 8:50pm
lvl,
This is equal to preventing members of La Raza "Hispanic Organization" from running for Congress, unless they join the Democratic Party. Besides, I am sure that a Gentile Zionist like you is fully aware of the bias nature of the Israeli High Court. This is the same high court which closed its eyes while the Zionists settlers ripped off most of the West Bank.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 9:14pm
Posted by lvliberty1 at 01/12/2009 @ 8:50pm | ignore this person | warn this person
I ask you again: is there no act that Israel can commit which would finally shock your conscience?
They're mass-murdering babies, for Christ's sake!
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 9:16pm
And I ask you all again: where is the outrage at what I linked to above? The Prime Minister of Israel was quoted today in reliable, safe Western media as stating explicitly that he called the President of the United States, demanded that the POTUS leave a meeting, and then he ordered the POTUS to direct his Secretary of State not to vote for a resolution at the UN she herself authored and went to the UN with presidential backing for, presumably.
And the POTUS did as he was told.
What more compelling proof could we have that Israel is dictating our foreign policy to us than an overt, legitimately reported declaration to the press by the Israeli Prime Minister that he dictated our foreign policy directly to the POTUS who reversed his course and slapped down his own Secretary of State in order to appease the Prime Minister?
What more compelling proof could there be that our own government does not control its own policies in the Middle East?
Where is the doting and bent New York Times on this? Where is their editorial babbling? That doting newspaper has blatantly transformed itself into an offshore propaganda ministry in the employ of the Israeli military ... where is their patronizing editorial voice now?
And CNN? Why hasn't CNN carried this report even? Not newsworthy that the POTUS takes his orders from the Israeli PM on our foreign policy?
Where is the outrage?
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 9:22pm
sysfriendly,
I am afraid that lvlliberty1's conscious is very selective; much like that of the Israeli High Court, crimes are not really crimes unless the victims are Jews.
Posted by CripThink at 01/12/2009 @ 9:28pm
"At some point, Barack is going to have to throw the Israeli Lobby under the bus ..."
And the Israeli lobby will then do their damndest to throw Obama under the gun(s) of Mossad-cutout assassin(s).
Q: what does Israel have on a POTUS that it can order him what to do, even what the POTUS is not up for reelection? what, for example, is it that the Israeli govt & lobby can leak about Bush (& perhaps his father & grandfather) that would totally discredit the Bushes?
We only know the tip of that iceberg which must go very deep indeed.
Posted by sloper at 01/12/2009 @ 9:44pm
ehross,
Not for the first time here, unfortunately, this Arab-American says: Take your Jew-hating shit and get gone! Opponents of Israel and Zionism neither need nor want your poison.
Posted by cka2nd at 01/12/2009 @ 10:20pm
For those who wonder where Mr. Obama is headed with his administration, it would appear a Zionist Settler who lives in an (occupation) settlement in the West Bank has been invited to his inauguration:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite? cid=1231774432732&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticl e%2FShowFull
Such a message to send -
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 10:25pm
Posted by HAPPYLonghorn at 01/12/2009 @ 6:26pm
Soon HAPPY you will become so irrelevant that when you look in the mirror all you will see is the reflection of the wall behind you. And then when you look down at your tentacles they will fade into the piss stained floor of your bathroom.
At that point you should make your way to the potty and flush yourself before even that appliance fades to black and leaves you writhing in a pile of bubbling black tool.
Have a nice day!
Posted by chaoszen at 01/12/2009 @ 11:03pm
tool=stool. This damn cast on my right arm is damned.
Posted by chaoszen at 01/12/2009 @ 11:05pm
" ... The fighting continued despite another day of pleas from both the United Nations and the European Union to stop the violence which has so far killed 919 Palestinians and wounded 4,250 others wounded, an estimated 40 per cent of them civilians, mostly women and children ..."
919 killed, headed towards 1,000. 4,250 wounded. Nearly half non-combatants, mostly women and children.
We can never forget this. We can never, ever forget this. And if there is a God, then there will be a way to stop it from happening, some day.
Over 5,000 people killed and injured so that Ehud Barak and Tzipi Livni can win an election in Israel. So that the brutish and dumb Israeli people can cheer on the carnage. So that fanatical "settlers" can take land that is the property of another people. To repair Israeli self-esteem after their loss to Hez'b'allah.
What savages, these Israelis. And armed with our weapons, bought for them with our tax dollars.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 11:17pm
This is ethnic cleansing. Period.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 11:18pm
"The naked hypocrisy of claiming to be not just a democracy but the only regional democracy PLUS claiming to be a nation which is open to Arabs and where Arabs can vote their interest if they are Israeli citizens, and then banning political parties that don't support for example the slaughter in Gaza, is truly stunning" (Syfriendly)
Brilliantly and accurately said.
Israel is even a more brutal apartheid system than South Africa was (I should know--I grew up in it). I would say that Israel is more accurately a theocratic totalitarian system, ironically similar to that of Iran (but more brutal); Iran has never attacked another country for over 350 years, while Israel has never stopped, and is now killing and butchering children. It is provoking Iran to have nuclear power TO DEFEND ITSELF from Israel, not the other way around. Frankly, I can totally understand that.
Posted by mystic7 at 01/13/2009 @ 12:00am
ooh, this has got to sting:
"Olmert Says He Made Rice Change Vote
By MARK LANDLER
Published: January 12, 2009
WASHINGTON -- In an unusually public rebuke, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert of Israel said Monday that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice had been forced to abstain from a United Nations resolution on Gaza that she helped draft, after Mr. Olmert placed a phone call to President Bush.
"I said, ‘Get me President Bush on the phone,' " Mr. Olmert said in a speech in the southern Israeli city of Ashkelon, according to The Associated Press. "They said he was in the middle of giving a speech in Philadelphia. I said I didn't care: ‘I need to talk to him now,' " Mr. Olmert continued. "He got off the podium and spoke to me."
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/13/2009 @ 01:26am
Meanwhile, a war-weary world continues to await the much-hyped "change" which so many long for from the incoming US administration. Sadly, there is and will be no justice on the face of the earth, not at least from a long-corrupted US government. The criminal Bush regime has acquiesced to the Zionist warmongers and paymasters; W himself, supposed president of a sovereign nation and "leader of the free world," wretchedly asked "How high?" when Generalissimo Olmert bade him jump.
Will Obama be able to rise above the long history of America's criminal collaboration with Zionism? Hardly. His near total silence on the killing of civilians and on the other outrages speaks volumes to the peoples of the world who were foolish enough to expect better of him. Moreover, he has filled his administration with Zionist hawks and sycophantic fellow-travelers--whether he has done this as payback for his "grassroots" election victory or in abject fear of the Israel Lobby we do not know. Perhaps he simply doesn't give a damn about any of his rhetoric or supposed values. Just as Obama will continue embracing these manifestly unjust and self-defeating pro-Israel policies, look for more of the same from him on Afghanistan and Iraq. Perhaps he'll even fulfill the neo-con dream of tackling Iran.
Posted by feinfein at 01/13/2009 @ 05:42am
Posted by Thrawn at 01/12/2009 @ 5:54pm |
Notice it didn't take too long for THRAWN to change his mind?
Posted by Thrawn at 01/12/2009 @ 5:54pm
Posted by Mask at 01/13/2009 @ 07:27am
Obama goes with the money and power. That means asskissing with AIPAC. Like Bill Clinton, Obama wants to cozy up with the Zionists and Republicans, while kicking progressives in the teeth. That is called "centrist" in U.S. corporate media lexicon. (I feel better every day for voting for Nader.)
Posted by philbq at 01/13/2009 @ 08:21am
This article makes it explicitly clear who calls the shots in the US when it comes to Israel.
Posted by syfriendly at 01/12/2009 @ 6:50pm
Exactly right, many just refuse to see that the US is completely controlled by the wishes of Israel. They have been in control for far too many years and have been allowed to do whatever they like when they like with no accountability from us!!! It is shameful and the policy needs changing.
Posted by Caj at 01/13/2009 @ 08:31am
Posted by philbq at 01/13/2009 @ 08:21am
Curious...do Naderites' arms ever get tired?
.
..
.
..
from patting themselves on the back all the time??!?!????
Posted by Mask at 01/13/2009 @ 08:40am
MASK: Many people told me I was "wasting" my vote for Nader. My contention is that a vote for principle is not wasted. It is a moral decision. And I am happy with that decision. I am not respondsible for the deceptions and betrayals of Obama. If Nader was Prez, the Israeli lobby would not be running U.S. foreign policy. I believe the Democratic Party is hopelessly corrupt, and must be replaced by a truly progressive party. And that means not voting for the Demo candidate for President unless he/she deserves it. The reason I mention my vote is to show others that there is another way.
Posted by philbq at 01/13/2009 @ 09:05am
Here in the UK we chastise the US media for saying nothing on its government's compliance - so I commend The Nation for publicising this fact when it hasn't been that apparent in reporting over here. Mind you, we can't read everything... http://inkybinary.wordpress.com/
Posted by billcode at 01/13/2009 @ 09:12am
This overreaction was against two Arab parties which have been getting militant in support of Hamas. That said, as the Israeli press is reporting, this action will be reversed by the Israeli Supreme Court.
Posted by lvliberty1 at 01/12/2009 @ 8:50pm
Considering that 20% of Israel's population are Arabs of predominantly Palestinian descent, and suffer discrimination already, it is up to ISC to right this injustice.
Posted by OneVote at 01/13/2009 @ 09:23am
Metta,
"..We want to support Israel and make it the model in the Middle East of cooperation between Arab and non-Arab, Christian , Jew and Muslim. ..."
Who is WE and make it the model?
WE can not do anything to help these three groups in anything if 1 in the group does not want that to happen. They must do this for themselves....
and 1 group here has voted into office a political party that is a terrorist orgainzation, has sworn to rid the ME of Jews as PART OF THEIR GOAL, and has as it governing authority....the Koran. The Muslums in the ME are comfortable having the authority of the govt BASED soley on Islam and the Koran..ergo...God is the law and the Jews must go. AND, the lack of need for democratic organizations...
So, the WE is wishful thinking of a utopia on your part(sound familiar?)...not based on a reality senario or practical application with the parties and materials on the ground...(can't we all get along? NO, we don't. Period)No Kumbayah(sp I am sure).
kind like liberalism...would be nice to idealy work all the way around except for the pesty evidence that it doesn't work, can't work unless forced down on people who have to pay for it..and when they resist..presto!!!
Socialism!!!..to be fair..of course..comrade..wheres my right to free food?
Israel, the minute it gives back more land and opens itself up to the lefts idea of fairness, the quicker more rockets will be resupplied, upgraded and sent into Israel again.
Israel needs to finish Hamas and completely.
Posted by YourJomamma at 01/13/2009 @ 09:28am
BTW, can Jews vote anywhere, besides Israel, in the ME?
Can any ARAB? Anywhere in the Arab world? Islamic world?
Can any ARAB protest their rulers openly or..stand up and shout with pride, that anyone who believes in God is delusional, as is daily written here, on this leading, cutting edge, well read publication?
Would they face..crusafixtion in the Arab world? How about that Sharia?( gotta love that thoughtful system) I dont know about you, but vote that in as the basis of law and my guess the left would be ..ok with it, because after all it was voted in?
Please
Posted by YourJomamma at 01/13/2009 @ 09:44am
Posted by YourJomamma at 01/13/2009 @ 09:44am
MAASCH, I thought I heard about some Arab democracy....somewhere between Jordan, Syria and Iran?
Posted by Mask at 01/13/2009 @ 10:34am
"what does Israel have on a POTUS that it can order him what to do..." (sloper)
I have always felt blackmail is the answer, something so terrible that Israel knows what our president did (with Israel's help and complicity), something we are not allowed to talk about but everyone in Europe knows is true, and everyt9one here knows what tha
Posted by mystic7 at 01/13/2009 @ 10:34am
Posted by philbq at 01/13/2009 @ 09:05am
phil, it drifts from "principles" and "another way"...
into self-congratulations and self-righteousness.
Posted by Mask at 01/13/2009 @ 10:36am
"what does Israel have on a POTUS that it can order him what to do..." (sloper)
I have always felt blackmail is the answer, something so terrible that Israel knows what our president did (with Israel's help and complicity), something we are not allowed to talk about but everyone in Europe knows is true, something that explains the 3 trillion dollars missing from the Pentagon that most likely was for "services rendered" by Israel. That's why Congress refused to impeach Bush.That's why Obama has been silenced. We all know.
Posted by mystic7 at 01/13/2009 @ 10:37am
MAASCH, I thought I heard about some Arab democracy....somewhere between Jordan, Syria and Iran?
Posted by Mask at 01/13/2009 @ 10:34am
Really?
King Hussein can be voted out? Syria's Assad could have an inauguration day where he retires to the side lines afdter a plebicite? Can a Jewish citizen living in any of the 3 be voted as leader of any party in any "parlimennt" in Iran?, Syria, Jordan?
Please, you know better..
How about Jews simply having a street demonstration against Islamic terrorists in say..Tehran, Damascus, or even Amman? Think they would make it a block?
How about Jews or Israelis bring forth a suit in any Islamic Supremme Court in Iran,Syria, or Jordan?
Posted by YourJomamma at 01/13/2009 @ 11:00am
"Israel needs to finish Hamas and completely."
Posted by YourJomamma at 01/13/2009 @ 09:28am
From what I am seeing with the manner of the offensive I believe they will do just that this time.
Posted by Benchrest at 01/13/2009 @ 11:33am
<i>Posted by Mask at 01/13/2009 @ 07:27am </i>
I would like to believe that I can change my mind when the facts provide solid reason for doing so. The two aforementioned incidents (cutting off all-Arab parties and apparently compelling Rice to alter her vote) are such facts. Though I'm curious...you cited my 5:54 post twice. Why is that? There was no internal change, and I do not believe I posted at 5:54 in any other thread.
Posted by Thrawn at 01/13/2009 @ 12:27pm
Posted by mystic7 at 01/13/2009 @ 10:37am
They don't have anything on Obama, that is why they are trying to flex their muscles now with the Gaza invasion and lopsided votes in Congress.
Obama is going to call their bluff at some point in his Administration, and the good news is America will be a much better country in many "other" areas as a result.
Dramatically reducing the influence of lobbyists in our government has a lot of benifits that go well beyond reigning in AIPAC.
Posted by Metteyya at 01/13/2009 @ 3:02pm
What Jews seem to not understand is that ALL children grown into "Chosen people"
Posted by ehross at 01/13/2009 @ 3:43pm
From what I am seeing with the manner of the offensive I believe they will do just that this time.
Posted by Benchrest at 01/13/2009 @ 11:33am
are you nuts?
just the opposite, just the opposite......
people are pissed.
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/13/2009 @ 9:15pm
Posted by frosty zoom at 01/13/2009 @ 9:15pm
No FZ. Not nuts.
If I am correct in my assessment of the Israeli tactics, there will likely not be a tangible remnant of Hamas after cessation of hostlities in Gaza.
Posted by Benchrest at 01/14/2009 @ 09:15am