Matthew Yglesias explains difference between Fox and The Nation:

Peter Suderman doesn't understand why netroots types get so upset when Democrats go on Fox News:

Perhaps I'm not enough of a partisan, but I wouldn't be bothered -- in fact, I'd be rather thrilled -- to see any conservative candidate, especially one I particularly liked, do an interview with Keith Olbermann, or even, say, a sit down with The Nation. The difference between Fox and The Nation is that The Nation makes no pretense of being anything other than what it is.

Comments (36)

1. I was truly surprised at how well Bill behaved. Not one lapel pin question. I didn't see the whole interview, but the bits i did see, he actually treated Mrs. Clinton as if she had a brain.

   Posted by julien38 at 05/03/2008 @ 6:36pm

2. The Nation makes no pretense of being anything other than what it is.

   posted by Katrina vanden Heuvel on 05/03/2008 @ 5:53pm

   Ian Williams sat down with Bill O'Reilly and not once, but twice flat out said that the Nation was "a bunch of socialists."

   Is that true? It doesn't appear so to me. You appear as democrats who lean left and little more. Which one is correct?

   By the way, why do YOU get a time stamp and we don't?

   Posted by Benchrest at 05/03/2008 @ 7:00pm

3. omg..?? fair and balanced..?? FOX isn't partisan..?? Are you kidding us..?? Tell me you are being sarcastic... What are you people smoking..?? My god... Who do think the Cons what to run against?? Not Obama.. The constant drone of Wright/flagpins/weather underground should be enough proof... Why would the Drug addicted/Illegal employing Rush Limbaugh start 'Operation Caos'... ANYONE..?? Cuz the sad sad Repubs don't want to lose to Obama... Thats why Hill got the old kid gloves treatment... Does anyone think that FAUX News didn't have meetings upon meetings about how to softball Ol' Hill..?? Wake up right wingers ... 4 more years of the same BS from Mccain and this country is in even bigger trouble (if thats even possible) ... Sad really..

   Posted by Vvf1969 at 05/03/2008 @ 7:00pm

4. Oh jeez and the sky is not blue and the moon does not orbit the earth. Fox news is the propaganda arm of the Republican party. And no one else makes any pretense that the other MSM outlets are nothing more than sensational journalists.

   Fox likes anyone that promotes the bottom line.

   Posted by Tzimisce at 05/03/2008 @ 7:03pm

5. Would it be the same kind of "thrilled" as if a feminist had written an article about how, not just one show, but an ENTIRE CABLE NEWS NETWORK, was "misogynistic"....

   yet kept apperaing on it???

   Posted by Mask at 05/03/2008 @ 7:11pm

6. The problem with Fox News isn't their obvious bias, which they have every right to have. What is so insidious is they maintain this perspective then are so disingenuous about it. They insist they act in a non-partisan fashion, only presenting the "facts" and advocating "no-spin zones" (the most hypocritical tag line for an opinion show I've ever heard). If you're going to be conservative propagandists, at least have the huevos to own up to what you are instead of disguising yourselves as a legitimate news source.

   This is exactly why I look to international news websites to get a better idea of what's going on in the world. Thank you CBC and CTV!

   Posted by yutsano at 05/03/2008 @ 7:17pm

7. The ads are random and shift constantly Mary. However I've seen ads for Ann Coulter on this site too so in my opinion it's a wash at best.

   Posted by yutsano at 05/03/2008 @ 7:27pm

8. Fox News is fair and balanced.

   Posted by marybretbrad

   hmmm.

   where to begin?

   Saturday, May 3, 2008 8:26:53 PM

   Posted by frosty zoom at 05/03/2008 @ 8:22pm

9. This is exactly why I look to international news websites to get a better idea of what's going on in the world. Thank you CBC and CTV!

   Posted by yutsano

   well, the cbc isn't bad.

   but ctv.

   yuck.

   they're the ones that viceroy harper turned to in order to trap obama.

   ctv is the canadian version of fox.

   Saturday, May 3, 2008 8:30:00 PM

   Posted by frosty zoom at 05/03/2008 @ 8:25pm

10. I'm trying to find the ad again, but it's not showing up.

    Posted by marybretbrad

    i want to know why they are trying to sell me arab women.

    www.doubleclick.com or something like that is watching you, pinko.

    Saturday, May 3, 2008 8:33:22 PM

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/03/2008 @ 8:28pm

11. The only problem with this site is that righties think it's an adjunct of Fox.

    Posted by Sorelish at 05/03/2008 @ 9:48pm

12. Fox News is fair and balanced. It is the only mainstream news organization that is honest about it's point of view.

    Posted by marybretbrad at 05/3/2008 | ignore this person

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

    This has to be..................

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!

    .......the most ridiculous........

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!

    ..............thing I've read in months!!

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

    Fox.....HAHAHAHA...honest about it's point of view.....HAHAHAHAHA...while usine "Fair and Balanced" as a part of it's NAME......

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

    Whew!!!

    Thanks for that MBB...that was PRICELESS!

    Posted by Lillian at 05/03/2008 @ 11:21pm

13. *ctv is the canadian version of fox.

    Saturday, May 3, 2008 8:30:00 PM

    Posted by frosty zoom *

    I agree, but they have better movie reviews. Heather Mallick is a riot, though, and the CBC is better for journalism as a whole, but it's interesting to compare the two.

    Posted by yutsano at 05/04/2008 @ 01:30am

14. When the fox is guarding the hen house...

    Nothing's what it seems

    The public trust and sacred vows

    Soon give way to schemes

    Posted by ttr at 05/04/2008 @ 02:36am

15. Fox news is partisan and that's ok. But, how can you compare Fox with The Nation or Olbermann's show? Of course Nation and Olbermann are partisan, but Fox is so icky about how they do it. Fox has gimps and stiffs who they employ to represent the opposition. I.E. Allan Colmes or Juan Williams (observation: is it just me or does Juan williams constantly look like he is about to cry.) I've also seen Fox have actual guests on who represent the left and usually Hanity shouts at them and cuts them off or Chris Wallace does a slanted interview. It's not balanced, fair and least of all honest.

    Posted by koroviev at 05/04/2008 @ 03:29am

16. Katrina,

    Thanks for the Matt Yglesias link. I also highly recommend the fantastic Yglesias piece on John McCain's largely unexposed neocon affiliations in The American Prospect that is linked at the J Street blog under "Friday Links".

    But at least as impressive is today's superb Frank Rich column in the NY Times entitled, "The All-White Elephant in the Room".

    Straight out of the gate, like Big Brown at today's Kentucky Derby, we are treated to an electrifying link to John Hagee preaching on the Great Whore of the Roman (Catholic) Church wielding a chalice of Jewish Blood raised in its hand while riding a beast that represents "the anti-Christ system" --the same John Hagee who has been assiduously courted by John McCain of course.

    What is made abundantly clear by Frank Rich's vivid illustration of the Wright versus Hagee media hypocrisy is the unvarnished racism that still glaringly exists in this nation.

    It's a divide that has been understandably avoided by Barack Obama as he attempts to negotiate the Scylla and Charybdis of a black presidential candidacy in a country that is dominated by fear-mongering at nearly every turn.

    What is Obama to do?

    Glen Ford's recent lead piece at his outstanding Black Agenda Report is illuminating.

    Excerpt:

    "The world views of Rev. Jeremiah Wright and Sen. Barack Obama were incompatible from the start, just as the mythical American Manifest Destiny world view is directly at odds with the facts as perceived by Blacks in the United States. Wright finally forced Obama to choose sides in the conflict of racial/historical visions, and in doing so, performed a service on behalf of clarity. Obama lashed out in a startlingly personal manner, calling Wright a "caricature" of himself and linking the minister to forces that give "comfort to those who prey on hate." Rev. Wright exposed the flimsy tissues of so-called "race neutrality" in a nation founded on racial oppression."

    The only readily apparent way to clarify the situation is to peer through the prism of evolution.

    The powerful will inevitably seek to consolidate their leverage by any means within reach– a particularly pungent recent example was the NY Times story revealing the placement of Pentagon apparatchiks in the media to spin the American war effort in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    The basic premise of the American constitution was an attempt to construct a system of checks and balances in order to negate the power of the few –monarchies in the time of the Constitution's framers-- over the many. Today, in an era of sophisticated propaganda techniques employed by public relations firms utilizing the latest in psychological research and the lever of the media bullhorn, what chance do we stand to resist our corporate masters?

    There is no readily apparent answer.

    I can only urge us to fight as furiously as possible from the grass roots level. But in the final analysis we can only hope that our constitutional concept of human rights and freedoms for "American citizens" is extended in the most liberal sense to include all of us on this planet, as well as a broad-based respect for the entire biosphere.

    We might even give that attitude a name.

    Wisdom, perhaps.

    Posted by b_kool_66 at 05/04/2008 @ 04:37am

17. Under our current circumstances it's difficult not to conclude that we're not at least a bit "thick" as a species.

    In honor of my beloved and recently deceased older brother who infused my early mind with some basic wisdom:

    "Really don't mind if you sit this one out.

    My words but a whisper -- your deafness a SHOUT.

    I may make you feel but I can't make you think.

    Your sperm's in the gutter -- your love's in the sink.

    So you ride yourselves over the fields and you make all your animal deals and your wise men don't know how it feels to be thick as a brick.

    And the sand-castle virtues are all swept away in the tidal destruction the moral melee.

    The elastic retreat rings the close of play as the last wave uncovers the newfangled way.

    But your new shoes are worn at the heels and your suntan does rapidly peel and your wise men don't know how it feels to be thick as a brick."

    ~Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull)

    Posted by b_kool_66 at 05/04/2008 @ 04:46am

18. Fox is not fair and balanced. Being fair and balanced means being NON-PARTISAN. Being fair and balanced means doing nothing but reporting the news with no opinion added in. Fox does not do this. Fox adds their opinion into everything and flat out lies about many things. Months after it was proven that Iraq didn't have nuclear weapons a survey was done of people. They were asked simple headline questions and which news source they watched. You know who had the highest percentage of misinformed people? Fox News. A good portion of them thought they had found nukes in Iraq. Yeah that's a great news source.

    Posted by Cccomfo1 at 05/04/2008 @ 04:59am

19. "Rich people ... God bless us." Hillary on Fox. Fair, balanced & above all truthful. Hillary tells it like it is.

    Posted by sloper at 05/04/2008 @ 07:29am

20. hillary and rupert sittin' in a tree.

    p-l-o-t-t-i-n-g....

    Sunday, May 4, 2008 10:23:52 AM

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/04/2008 @ 10:19am

21. much of your assessment is incorrect, JM.

    Sunday, May 4, 2008 11:57:06 AM

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/04/2008 @ 11:52am

22. Cccomfo1 's observation about how pathetically misinformed Fox viewers are hits the nail on the head. I would like to dismiss out of hand the type who hang on Fox's every lie, but unfortunately they have become a substantial portion of the electorate. It is amazing how much of a paradigm shift we have made from an era when the fairness doctrine was accepted to an era when it is seen as infringing on the liberties of a network to be the official propaganda organ of the White House. That said, the Pentagon " experts " scandal reveals how deeply corrupted our news has become. It troubles me more than pathetic 'Fair and balanced " to have supposedly respected news organizations being cheerleaders for war. These folks had to know what they were doing was wrong, bit I suspect that the corporate perversion of media is on display for all to see.

    Posted by waters at 05/04/2008 @ 12:46pm

23. To loyal Fox viewers, "Fair and Balanced" means "Telling Me What I Want to Hear". It doesn't matter how much they're lied to as long as they're spared uncomfortable truths.

    Posted by scootbootin at 05/04/2008 @ 7:05pm

24. jomamma... Where do you get your stats ..?? FOX..?? lol.. You Brainwashed fool...

    Posted by Vvf1969 at 05/04/2008 @ 7:42pm

25. Sorry, but Fox is where the action is. The left is So angry All the time it is painful to watch MSNBC and most of the other networks. Yes, Fox is fair and balanced and you get both sides on most programs.

    Posted by pyeatte at 05/04/2008 @ 8:19pm

26. Posted by pyeatte at 05/4/2008 "Sorry, but Fox is where the action is."

    Where are the facts? Maybe it is complacent dweebs, who don't think or learn, but vote anyway, that make the left so angry.

    If YOU are not angry yet, you're not paying attention....oh wait, you watch Faux News, you're obviously not actually paying attention.

    I'd say good luck with that, if folks like you weren't sucking the rest of us down with you.

    Eric

    Posted by Malcontent at 05/04/2008 @ 8:32pm

27. Does the preview work in IE yet, or is it still just broken in Opera?

    Posted by Malcontent at 05/04/2008 @ 8:33pm

28. preview works nowhere.

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/04/2008 @ 8:49pm

29. Democrats and Fox News Make Friends

    By BRIAN STELTER

    Published: May 2, 2008

    Standing in front of a television camera last week, the chairman of Hillary Rodham Clinton's campaign, Terry McAuliffe, uttered four words that the Fox News Channel would not soon forget.

    "Fair and balanced Fox!," he exclaimed, noting that the network was the first to project Mrs. Clinton's Pennsylvania primary win.

    Fox executives could not have asked for a more rousing endorsement. The next day it showed up in promotions.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    well, of course.

    hrc is rupert's little angel.

    Sunday, May 4, 2008 9:22:51 PM

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/04/2008 @ 9:18pm

30. Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull)

    Posted by b_kool_66 at 05/4/2008

    Tull is great. Ian Anderson is one of the if not the best at flute and 12 string

    Posted by lvliberty1 at 05/04/2008 @ 9:39pm

31. Hard to decide if Fox News is a propagandist for conservatives in general or Rupert Murdoch in particular. Probably one of those distinctions without a difference.

    Caught neither the Clinton nor the Obama interviews. Heard it all before, seen Fox before. Curiosity factor: zero. Suppose political candidates have to do these sorts of things. A dirty business.

    What's with this tiny little box we have type comments into?

    Posted by Sam Thornton at 05/04/2008 @ 11:49pm

32. Final comment on this thread from me...IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER (to quote the classic "Meatballs")...

    because Fox has the highest ratings of the cable news guys and they certainly aren't going to change now at the behest of "The Nation" magazine, are they?

    Move on.

    Posted by Mask at 05/05/2008 @ 09:28am

33. because Fox has the highest ratings of the cable news guys

    Move on.

    Posted by Mask

    no wonder the great ship america is sinking......

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/05/2008 @ 2:08pm

34. marybretbrad

    it's not the same viewers everyday.....

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/05/2008 @ 3:52pm

35. plus, 2000 was decided by what, 17 "votes".

    Posted by frosty zoom at 05/05/2008 @ 3:53pm

36. Fox is not fair and balanced. Being fair and balanced means being NON-PARTISAN. Being fair and balanced means doing nothing but reporting the news with no opinion added in.

    Posted by Cccomfo1 at 05/4/2008 | ignore this person

    I disagree. Telling a journalist that they should keep their opinions to themselves is basically telling them to report only "what he said and what she said" and invites them to hide their point of view within the story. Yes, report the facts, but please give me the benefit of your analysis. And please fairly report both, or all, sides of an issue, even if you agree with one and disagree with the other.

    Fox's only show that actually lived up to it's Fair and Ballanced slogan was Fox News Watch. I don't know what happened, but with Neal Gabler (the stronger of the two liberals commentators) and Eric Burns (the relatively balanced host) gone, the show is listing to the right. Right-wing airhead hosts, faux liberals like Juan Williams, and a James Pinkerton who seems to have been told that as a conservative, he can't criticize the Bush administration, but it's ok to attack the left and the Dems to your heart's content (I've lost a lot of respect I once had for him).

    Posted by cka2nd at 05/05/2008 @ 4:57pm