Name Our Epoch

posted by Peter Rothberg on 06/13/2008 @ 3:49pm

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As John Cavanagh and Chuck Collins write in the current issue of The Nation -- a special look at rising inequality, "Over the past three decades, market-worshiping politicians and their corporate backers have engineered the most colossal redistribution of wealth in modern world history, a redistribution from the bottom up, from working people to a tiny global elite."

Historians divide history into epochs. We've all heard of the Gilded Age, the Roaring Twenties and the Great Depression. Our current epoch, however--a period that has seen soaring fortunes for a new American superrich and a fading American Dream for nearly everyone else--lacks a label.

Some commentators have tried to supply one. Paul Krugman calls our past three decades of growing inequality the Great Divergence. Berkeley economist Harley Shaiken speaks about the Great Disconnect, his tag for years of stagnant and declining wages amid a growing economy. But neither has really caught on. That's why The Nation is joining the Institute for Policy Studies in a new contest.

Please tell us what you would Name Our Epoch! Send an email toNameOurEpoch@ips-dc.org with your suggested label for our excruciatingly unequal times. Put your thinking cap on now--we need your entry by July 4. An all-star panel of judges--historian Howard Zinn, journalist Barbara Ehrenreich and novelist Walter Mosley--will determine the winner. In addition to the satisfaction of coining a phrase that may go down in history, the winner will receive personally autographed books written by each of the three distinguished judges.

Comments (131)

How about The Great Bubble Age.

Posted by Wolfgang1 at 06/13/2008 @ 4:51pm
the age of fear

Posted by emile duBois at 06/13/2008 @ 5:11pm
The Age of Unreasoning

Posted by leftofcenter at 06/13/2008 @ 5:19pm
The Dark Times

Posted by leftofcenter at 06/13/2008 @ 5:20pm
Oooo, actually got a good one The Empire of Artifice

Posted by leftofcenter at 06/13/2008 @ 5:23pm
The Last Crises

(too hopeful?)

Posted by Mask at 06/13/2008 @ 5:34pm
The Last Crises

(too hopeful?)

Posted by Mask at 06/13/2008

Does that mean this one will destroy the world so there are no more?

Posted by Cccomfo1 at 06/13/2008 @ 5:48pm
I can't name this epoch yet, I have to see if the US makes a rational or a foolish decision this November.

Posted by yutsano at 06/13/2008 @ 6:30pm
The Fall of Rome part deux

Posted by Cccomfo1 at 06/13/2008 @ 6:39pm
Posted by Cccomfo1 at 06/13/2008

Or it means it's the last major crises the world faces, because we wise up.

See? It works both ways, even ZERO's pessimistic way.

BTW, think ZERO has no kids?

Posted by Mask at 06/13/2008 @ 7:21pm
The Last Alternative.

Posted by Benchrest at 06/13/2008 @ 7:56pm
1 - - The Boomer Bubble ¬

2 - - The ME-llenium

3 - - The Age of Boomerism

4 - - The Cyber Age

5 - - The Great Deception

6 - - The End of Hearts and Minds

7 - - The Age of Entropy

8 - - The Gas Age

9 - - The End of Evolution

10 - - The Fall of the Corporate Curtain

11 - - The Unquenchable Years

12 - - the Era of the Media - Industrial - Complex

13 - - The Greatest Degeneration

14 - - The Ugly Americon

15 - - The Third Right

16 - - The MediaCaust

17 - - The End of White

18 - - The Mass Media Years

19 - - Pre-emptive Darkness

20 - - The Oil Boil

21 - - The Petrol Wars

22 - - The Carbon Corpse

23 - - The Night of Neoconsumerism

Posted by winyahn at 06/13/2008 @ 8:54pm
Fertile Soil for the Post-Industrial Renaissance...

Posted by ttr at 06/13/2008 @ 9:15pm
The age of Provocative Platitudes

Posted by ttr at 06/13/2008 @ 9:35pm
From Bush's autobiography from the year 2012?...

"The Strategery Years"

heheh

Posted by Mask at 06/13/2008 @ 9:36pm
I would like to suggest

"The Era of Bullyism".

Stephan E. Sway

Posted by stephaneswa at 06/13/2008 @ 9:57pm
THE GREAT MELTDOWN!

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/14/2008 @ 12:16am
The Age of Suck

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 01:36am
The Dimming of Democracy

Posted by leftofcenter at 06/14/2008 @ 01:55am
The Grate Age of Regression

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 02:08am
The Dawning of the Great Weakkneed Sports

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 02:18am
er ok - The Grate Regression

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 02:20am
Dirt Bag Heaven

Posted by Sorelish at 06/14/2008 @ 02:52am
The Age of Contradic'tion

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 09:19am
The Age of 'Go Fuck Yourself'

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 09:55am
Ok, for now, what it is:

10. The Age of the Meekiness

09. The Lost Age

08. The Age of Un-Assessment

07. The Un-Re-Age

06. The Age of MIC MAD

05. The Age of OLD (shit)

04. The Grate Regression

03. The Age of Contradic'tion

02. The Age of 'Go Fuck Yourself'

01. The Age of Suck

00. The Age of Interesting Times...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 10:46am
The Hissing Bubble

Posted by ceblakeney at 06/14/2008 @ 11:45am
The Meek Disinheritance

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 12:13pm
"Bubbles, Bubbles, Toils, and Troubles"

Posted by b_kool_66 at 06/14/2008 @ 12:15pm
By the way, Peter, here's a message I left you from a couple of Act Now's ago (I'll be posting more on the subject here at The Nation soon):

Hey Peter, thanks for the video links.

And thanks for the good work you do here at The Nation.

But I'd also like to get your honest opinion on the recent remarks by Barack Obama at the big AIPAC shindig in Washington recently.

I'm personally still shellshocked by the brazen way Obama went far beyond the requisite ass kissing of AIPAC with the "undivided Jersusalem" remark.

James Abourezk (former Senator from SD) at Counterpunch today, and Uri Avnery at the same site yesterday have poignant commentaries on the issue.

I sincerely hope that The Nation and other wide circulation progressive magazines will pick up on this issue sooner rather than later, and begin calling out Obama for not living up to his message of hope.

I also will be urging my fellow Nationheads to join in calling for pressure on Obama to resist becoming another Washington sell out.

We need to act now.

As Chris Hayes' recent posts on Obama's new economics guy, James Furman, also indicate, the early signs on Obama are looking ominous for progressives.

Thanks very much for your time Peter.

Posted by b_kool_66 at 06/14/2008 @ 12:23pm
The Age of Recovery

http://tinyurl.com/3hcd34

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/14/2008 @ 12:35pm
Posted by b_kool_66

ONE remark you disagree with, and you're ready to crucify the guy?

(did you catch my apology to you on a recent thread?)

I agree, that he was pandering, but you're a bit over the top over it.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/14/2008 @ 3:49pm
the status of Jerusalem is by no means the biggest obstacle to peace in Palestine.

the settlements in the west bank are.

what is decidedly not needed is a one sided analysis of the issues.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/14/2008 @ 4:37pm
I've held the view for years that the Confederacy won the "Civil War" in 1980. Which has led to all of this mischief we've witnessed since; basically enslaving all working people without the bother of their housing, transportation, health, etc. Therefore, I vote for "The New Confederacy" as the name of this epoch.

Posted by blueCedars at 06/14/2008 @ 4:43pm
The Long Slide.

The Great Divergence.

The Fear Era.

Foreclosure Times.

The Dispossession.

Posted by racje at 06/14/2008 @ 5:23pm
The Long Decline.

And bkool: "the early signs on Obama are looking ominous for progressives."

Aye. His gratuitous grovel before AIPAC + the prominent Furman hire, Obama is positioning himself as safe for the status quo right from the get go, so far this bodes not well for substantive change. He's no RFK, rather more like a Bill Clinton without the personal deficiencies.

Posted by sloper at 06/14/2008 @ 5:27pm
expect nothing.

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/14/2008 @ 5:30pm
that's it!

EXPECT NOTHING!

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/14/2008 @ 5:32pm
He's no RFK, rather more like a Bill Clinton without the personal deficiencies.

Posted by sloper

RFK was canonized after his death. he was by many accounts a nasty f**k. his record before he ran was checkered to say the least. don't believe the hype.

contrary to what many believe the status of Jerusalem is not one of the great problems facing the US.

I would go so far as to say that the entire Israel-west bank issue is not one of the paramount ones for THIS country.

why do I say this? well that issue has dragged on for decades, and life has not changed because of it here in the US.

Iraq and the dire economic situation are the big issues.

the entire Iran thing is an attempt by Bush to distract attention away from his very great failure, and to ratchet up the fear.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/14/2008 @ 6:14pm
Posted by emile duBois at 06/14/2008

Geez, remind me not to die around EMILE JOHANNES, huh?

He must have already pissed off the relatives and knows HE'll get a pauper's funeral and the "Curtis Lowe" treatment.

Posted by Mask at 06/14/2008 @ 9:26pm
FZ & slope .. to use a football analogy, maybe its a screen play. Fade right until he gets across the line of scrimmage (January), then break left....

Posted by leftofcenter at 06/14/2008 @ 10:18pm
Obama already has the left and the center left. what he needs is the center and the center right.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/14/2008 @ 10:34pm
Obama is going to go right up the middle. Sure... some plays will go right (accompanied by feverish leftist blogging...) and some plays will go left (to the bane of the MSM...) but his merging of the red and the blue will require very synchronized front linemen...;^)

Really though... the sports metaphor is 'out in left field' so to speak, when it comes to politics of this sort. Thing is, there is no other team. There are going to be lots of 'straw men' out there... but they don't have real legs.

This is all about working together... which means... rewriting the play book.

"Please leave your weapons at the door, bring your best ideas to the table, talk with people you completely agree with... and... don't be a jerk.

Posted by ttr at 06/14/2008 @ 11:47pm
oops... it's harder than that.

...talk with people you DON"T completely agree with... and... don't be a jerk.

Freudian slip...;^)

Posted by ttr at 06/14/2008 @ 11:54pm
I would go so far as to say that the entire Israel-west bank issue is not one of the paramount ones for THIS country.

why do I say this? well that issue has dragged on for decades, and life has not changed because of it here in the US.

Iraq and the dire economic situation are the big issues.

the entire Iran thing is an attempt by Bush to distract attention away from his very great failure, and to ratchet up the fear.

Posted by emile duBois

••••••••••••••••••••

"we form our reply based on two questions directed at the Americans:

(Q1) Why are we fighting and opposing you? Q2)What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

As for the first question: Why are we fighting and opposing you? The answer is very simple:

(1) Because you attacked us and continue to attack us.

a) You attacked us in Palestine:"

usama bin laden, November 24 2002

••••••••••••••••••••

just sayin' it is important because of the tangled web that's been woven.

and now everybody's freaked out! all worried, an' such. and people won't calm down now till this nonsense is resolved.

no, liberty, i don't agree with mr. bin laden's violence.

just like i don't agree with yours.

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/15/2008 @ 12:16am
LOC:::::::::::::::::

i think that's the perfect name for our epoch:

expect nothing.

with obama, i expect nothing.

with mccain, i expect nothinger.

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/15/2008 @ 12:17am
We are suffering through the Imbalanced Age; revisionistically (and hopefully) later to be renamed the Pre-Balance Era.

Posted by leedurhamstone at 06/15/2008 @ 12:50am
less than no expectations

chop wood

carry water

Posted by winyahn at 06/15/2008 @ 12:58am
that's right.

don't wait for goredot.

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/15/2008 @ 01:08am
Let any Trojan Horse borne by our candidate be filled with only good things, an anti-war assemblage.

Posted by Sorelish at 06/15/2008 @ 01:10am
I'd name the epoch "Blessed Were the Rich," for they inherited the Earth (and stole what they couldn't inherit).

Posted by jrconner at 06/15/2008 @ 03:13am
Days of Cons and Poses

Posted by chinpoko at 06/15/2008 @ 03:46am
<i>The Days Of Cons And Poses,

Laugh And Run Away Like A Child At Play

Through The Meadow Land Toward A Closing Door

A Door Marked "Nevermore" That Wasn't There Before.....</i>

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/15/2008 @ 03:55am
"It was the the best of times, it was the worst most of times..." - A Tail of Three Worlds

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 04:02am
The era of "piss-on-me" economics.

Posted by rspero at 06/15/2008 @ 07:46am
The Patricio-Fascist Era

Posted by jrd0013 at 06/15/2008 @ 08:45am
The Chicago Curse.

Posted by kfailing at 06/15/2008 @ 08:56am
How about that...? Just weeks after his holiness "made history", the "progressive" people of The Nation, realized that "oppps" (Sorry Hillary and Edwards we did not see this coming) there is inequality in this country!!!!!!!. Finally their well-deserved and expensive educational degrees are paid off. But , do not worry fellas, his holiness don Obama de la Mancha, is on his way to re-establish the credibility of USA inc, to save the feminist in distress , to defeat gigantic corporations and ,most important, to make American sound Exceptional , again.

Posted by amarti at 06/15/2008 @ 11:10am
amarti

my aren't we clever.

sophomoric creative writing, B-

Posted by emile duBois at 06/15/2008 @ 1:32pm
The Age of Random W's

W - www - WTC - WMD - Wolf - Wool - Wag - Words - Wax - Wain - Write - Wrong - Worth - Warn - Wipe - White - Wash - World - Weather - Water - Waves - Wind - Whirl - Winter - While - Wild - Wilderness - Wood - Weed - Whisky - Weave - Wed - Wedge - Waste - Waist - Wait - Weigh - Wounds - Worst - Whoop - Whip - Worry - Wet - Worm - Wallet - Want - Work - Wage - War - Will - Welcome - Wizard - Waltz - Wealth - Wall - Weep - Wreck - Why - What - When - Where - Wilt - Whisper - Waffle - Whine - Weak - Week - Weasel - Weevil - Witness - Walk - West - Wasp - Whore - Witch - Which - Wig - Wrist - Wife - Women - Wisconsin - Whimper - Watch - Wake - Whistle - Window - Wheel - Warrant - Wink - Wrinkle - Wire - Wreath - Wheat - Wish - Wise - Win - Wednesday - Whole - Well - We - w

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 1:42pm
Age of Gluttony

Posted by rwe2late? at 06/15/2008 @ 2:16pm
The Information Age

Posted by rah at 06/15/2008 @ 2:38pm
The Age of Uncoverage

Think about it! I'll let you count the ways.

Posted by ryebread at 06/15/2008 @ 2:46pm
The Age of Random W's (revised)

W - www - WTC - WMD - WBG - WH - Washington - Wolf - Wool - Woo - Wag - Wad - Words - Wax - Wain - Wayne - Write - Wrong - Warp - Wrap - Worth - Warn - Wipe - White - Wash - World - Weather - Water - Waves - Wind - Whirl - Winter - While - Wild - Wilderness - Wood - Whack - Weed - Whisky - Weave - Wed - Wedge - Wicked - Waste - Waist - Wait - Weigh - Wounds - Walter - Worst - Whoop - Whip - Worry - Wet - Worm - Wallet - Want - Work - Wage - War - Willing - Welcome - Wizard - Waltz - Wealth - Wall - Weep - Wreck - Why - What - When - Where - Wilt - Whisper - Waffle - Whine - Weak - Week - Weasel - Weevil - Witness - Walk - West - Wasp - Whore - Witch - Which - Wig - Wrist - Wife - Women - Wisconsin - Whimper - Whicker - Watch - Wake - Whistle - Window - Wheel - Warrant - Wink - Wrinkle - Wire - Wreath - Wheat - Wish - Wise - Win - Wednesday - Whole - With - Well - We - w

The Age of Random X's...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 3:21pm
The Information Age

Posted by rah at 06/15/2008

+

The Age of Uncoverage

Think about it! I'll let you count the ways.

Posted by ryebread at 06/15/2008

=

The Disinformation Age

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 3:23pm
How about "1917 Russia"? We're gettin' mighty close.

Posted by PJ Coco at 06/15/2008 @ 3:36pm
The Age of Reeducation...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 3:58pm
Posted by JOMAMMA at 06/15/200

er, isn't that why some students make failing grades and others make A's? Personal responsibility to listen, study,... Perhaps making our public schools the best by funding them at the top of the priority list than at the bottom-- isn't to do away with personal responsibility but to place a higher standard on it by acknowledging it as being valued at the highest cost for the greatest society.

Consider the logic of taking money away from hospitals for still having sick people around or even 'dying'-- clearly as long as we've had hospitals there should no longer be sick people or death, hospitals are obviously a failure and should be unfunded and outlawed.

Ever see 'Idiocracy'?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVPKNIGCztk

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 4:20pm
that's right.

don't wait for goredot.

Posted by frosty zoom

No wonder the Eagles changed the original lyric, "Standing on a corner in Winslow, Arizona... waiting for Godot..."

Posted by winyahn at 06/15/2008 @ 4:48pm
hsuBfools

quite well put.

education is what happens after you leave school, IF you learned how to learn and what to learn.

Andre Gide put it best when he said that after his whole life he became the mentor he had wanted as a student.

of course those who are the least educated rail against education the loudest.

their approach to education is like the bleeding doctors used in days of old. a technique likely leading to the demise of the patient.

the dumbest ones here, for once I shall not name names, suggest scrapping public education and starting over. if they were doctors the equivalent would be to kill the patient in order to start over.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/15/2008 @ 5:10pm
Yeah, it's all about and is an education. You either get it sooner or too late...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 5:28pm
And hey, Al isn't waiting, he's out and about:

http://www.brightcove.tv/title.jsp?title=1514307400

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 5:30pm
hsuBfools

you're not still carrying a torch for Gore in this election, are you?

Al's a fine fellow, and the election was stolen from him, but he's done in presidential politics.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/15/2008 @ 6:29pm
The Great Concentration...

Posted by anachemia at 06/15/2008 @ 7:13pm
Posted by emile duBois at 06/15/2008

I would not rule anything out this election year...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 7:51pm
The age of The Great Rip-Off

Posted by JHP at 06/15/2008 @ 7:54pm
Hey talk to Carville:

http://tinyurl.com/5fzxex

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 8:20pm
I would not rule anything out this election year...

Posted by hsuBfools

you are a pip.

it's getting a little sad though.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/15/2008 @ 9:31pm
you are a pip.

it's getting a little sad though.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/15/2008

As in Gladys'? Yes I would sad, about 80 or dead too.

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/15/2008 @ 11:16pm
The Age of Imbecilism...

Posted by thegonzokid at 06/16/2008 @ 07:06am
JOMAMMA

I don't know where you get this from. I cannot speak for your experience. perhaps in Nebraska this is indeed the case.

what I can tell you that in the country's largest school system this is by no means the case.

I suggest you back up this incessant diatribe with some facts.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 07:41am
Posted by JOMAMMA at 06/15/2008

You're confusing the hospital with the patient, the school with the student. The institution has the responsibility to render service, the individual to utilize it. The more you squeeze a hospital's funding the more people receive bad service and either they get worse or die. Same holds true of an educational institute. Want better doctors and teachers-- pay more. People compete for better paying jobs-- not for the worse. That's a very simple concept to comprehend unless you have other motives and have chosen not to...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 08:13am
hsuBfools

welcome back.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 09:12am
Hey JoMa -- it was YOUR analogy. You run for office lobbing those turds around see the if you attract anything but a few horseflies.

Perhaps if you were to work your way up like the rest of us? What if you started out teaching in preschool, then primary, secondary, then college; bet you start learning a ton-- simply because you have to teach it. Your working in the corporate world isn't helping you in the learning department.

BTW: http://tinyurl.com/64vpxz

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 09:25am
Time warped to the top...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 09:28am
JOMAMMA

this isn't even true, as usual for you.

http://www.higheredinfo.org/dbrowser/index.php?measure=23

the graduation rate is a symptom. it does not explain the cause, nor does it offer a remedy.

a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. you are the living breathing example of this.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 09:37am
a lot of people die in hospitals. should we close the hospitals and fire all the doctors?

is it the doctors' fault that they die?

is it that we spend too much on hospitals?

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 09:39am
It's simple: 2000-2008 will go down in history as The Lost Years. This administration has made the exact wrong decision in almost every area of public policy since it came into power: tax cuts for the wealthy when tax increases were the fiscally responsible course (resulting in a massive shift in the tax burden from the wealthy to the poor and the squandering of surpluses); framing the struggle against terrorism as a "war" (resulting in the use of the military as the main tool in instances when more subtle methods are called for and the decimation of our armed forces and our credibility and reputation abroad--not to mention our strength); stimulus packages that were just massive giveaways to campaign contributors while the poor languished with their benefits cut off--just to name a few.

It's sad: with eight years of solid leadership we likely would have emerged from this decade ready to face the upcoming fiscal and foreign policy challenges--as it is we are going to have to spend our energy for many years recovering from the unspeakable damage of the Bush years.

Posted by BlueSpark at 06/16/2008 @ 09:43am
Maasch, you have no suggestion. you don't even have a diagnosis. never mind a remedy. in fact you don't seem to know anything about education at all.

how's your boy? graduating? with good skills?

my son is graduating from an elite public high school. he has earned numerous college credits.

I am telling this not in order to brag, well maybe a little, but rather to point to a success in education. a small school, extremely dedicated teachers, and yes a high outlay of funds per student.

I do not deny the problems, but I am loath to lay the failures at the feet of teachers, and throwing less money at the problem has never worked, in any endeavor.

when corporations educate their workers, do they spend less? of course not. they spend more.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 10:01am
Capitalist Meltdown

During the Gilded Age, accumulated wealth became more valuable and powerful than work.

'Making Money' was more important than actually producing goods or services.

Money itself produces nothing. It is a token of exchange which was created to facilitate the barter of goods and services.

Capitalism, coupled with Democracy, is a good system; and has historically been far more successful than Monarchy, Theocracy, Socialism or Communism. But as with all good things, it contains an inherent risk. When money becomes concentrated in the hands of a few, and those few use the power of money to control government, it allows them to over consolidate wealth, and place the system itself at risk. As the value of work is reduced, and the value of the token (money) replaces the value of what it was originally intended to represent (goods and services produced), the economy goes into a freeze (the Great Depression). Again, money itself produces nothing; if goods and services are not produced, the money itself becomes a worthless token. The final result is that unrestrained Capitalism goes into a self induced 'Meltdown'.

Like a power plant, the system of Capitalism can function quite well if the right safeguards are in place to control its inherent risks. FDR attempted to do this through a system of graduated income taxes and estate taxes to insure that capital remained liquid; and could be acquired anyone through work and new enterprise. This actually worked quite well in the latter part of the last century; just look at the companies listed on the NASDAQ for examples. As the middle class prospered, all measures of civilization such as living standards, education and health care increased dramatically; as did our ability to invest in things like national security and infrastructure.

Unfortunately, the wealthiest 1% have since dominated Washington politics, and are intent on removing these safeguards, which they see as a risk to the status quo and an impediment to the further consolidation their own wealth and personal interests.

We have been down this road before, it does not end well.

Posted by alanmusico at 06/16/2008 @ 10:12am
alanmusico

good analysis. one quibble.

we and most first world countries have a mix of capitalism and socialism.

I know of no 100% capitalist economy.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 10:38am
The 2nd Age of the Robber baron

Posted by df248 at 06/16/2008 @ 10:58am
and simple logic tests after reading a few lines are a must regulation for teaching anything anywhere

Posted by JOMAMMA

oh, the irony......

Posted by frosty zoom at 06/16/2008 @ 11:02am
speak for yourself, Willie.

we babyboomers have accomplished quite a lot.

take the antiwar movement against the Vietnam war AND the present wars. lotsa baby boomers there.

the whole idea of dissent, on campuses, and many other public spaces, has had a revival thanks to the boomers. not a silent generation, they.

the openness to foreign cultural influences, eastern religions and spiritual movements is a boomer legacy.

an explosion of culture in all its forms, music, art, dance and theatre is a result of boomers' interests.

a new appreciation of the body and new approaches to healing and prevention. meditation, yoga and now Pilates are a boomer legacy.

a more open approach to sex, sometimes named the sexual revolution, is also due to boomers.

most of all a resistance to conformity and an emphasis on individual freedom of choice is a hallmark of our generation.

all in all we did pretty good, and we're not yet done.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 11:10am
Emile,

I agree with you, but did not address social welfare systems because they confuse the main issue. I would also argue that a well functioning Democratic and Capitalist system is what allows us to have Social programs just as it allows us to invest in National Security and Infrastructure. We can't give anything to others unless we produce it first. Only then can we have a discussion about what these programs should look like. Like Capitalism, Social programs have their own benefits and risks which must be balanced.

Posted by alanmusico at 06/16/2008 @ 11:16am
alanmusico

well we have plenty of models to choose from. France? Germany? England? Ireland? etc.

if I may ask, what kind of musico are you?

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 11:24am
I know of no 100% capitalist economy.

Posted by emile duBois

And that is probably what is holding us back from so many solutions to the problems we face in America.

Posted by abell12ct at 06/16/2008 @ 11:26am
Emile,

Born in Brooklyn NY, (by way of Ellis Island of course).

I think that the countries you reference lean too far toward Socialism. I would prefer to chart our own course, starting with healthcare and social security.

Posted by alanmusico at 06/16/2008 @ 11:32am
alanmusico

I know Brooklyn well, living across the river.

the US has charted its own course, not too successfully where health care is concerned.

social security, which was "invented" in Josephine Austria and Bismarck's Prussia, is one of the success stories of american life.

what would you do differently?

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 11:53am
Maasch, your bitterness concerning the education system is displaced. Some people are so entrenched in their regressive ideologies that they are simply beyond the reach of even the most heroic pedantic efforts. Perhaps you should blame your parents for endowing you with such abysmally substandard genetic material.

As for the name- THE GREAT UNRAVELLING, THE LONG GOODNIGHT, DARK AGES REDUX, and REQUIEM FOR DEMOCRACY all seem apropos, off the top of mu heasd.

Posted by entropy at 06/16/2008 @ 11:54am
The Liberal Betrayal

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/16/2008 @ 12:03pm
or perhaps:

The Age of Ozymandias

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/16/2008 @ 12:06pm
Barbara Ehrenbach & Howard Zinn et al as judges? Oh good I stand about as much chance of winning as Gloria Steinhem at the Augusta Open

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/16/2008 @ 12:12pm
Emile,

I Think Social Security is basically sound. I would increase revenues by removing the salary cap; and improve return on Social Security Trust Assets by investing in stock and bonds just like TIAA-CREF or CALPERS does. The SS Trust Fund has done this in the past, is allowed to do it today, and in fact currently holds residual investments in stocks and bonds in the portfolio. Investing only in Treasuries is just plain dumb. The decision was made so that the gov't could claim that the budget deficit and natl debt were lower than they really were by subtracting 'money which we owe to ourselves'. This is not true. The only difference between Treasuries issued in the market and 'special issues' bought by the SS Trust is the redemption feature. Market Treasuries cannot be redeemed early, but are negotiable in the secondary market. Special Issues are non-negotiable but can be redeemed on demand at face value. Despite what Bush and Cheney say, they are not worthless IOU's and can be presented to the Fed at any time for cash, and the Fed would have to issue market securities to redeem them.

Regarding Health Care - I have not done enough research to have an opinion yet. But I do have a predisposition to think that it should either be a not-for-profit or a regulated industry. I have also heard that some of the Scandinavian countries have systems that work pretty well.

Posted by alanmusico at 06/16/2008 @ 12:43pm
The Age of Corporate Governance

Posted by nobrand at 06/16/2008 @ 12:50pm
If a restaurant puts out poor quality food with no taste or value, it doesn't matter if it is the manager, the waiter, the food buyer or the cook...it will close from lack of customers..they will move on to a place where any combination of the flaws is corrected...

Posted by JOMAMMA at 06/16/2008

Ok that sums up the problem with new cons-- they see people like fodder or food. Soylent Green without real individual choice or responsibility unless it's their corporate upside-down inside-out a'logical version.

It matters not that there's a solution and people will compete for good wages, it's all about getting the corporations to control us rather than We the People to live in OUR own lawful FREEDOM. Theirs is all about destroying OUR government to benefit the CORPORATION; profit, bottom line. Witness all that new con repub hsuB/cHeney admin have rot and laid asunder. And they do indeed need a stupid electorate to pull it off.

Yep-- give us more of that shit please. But JoMa's logic would say to just do away with government... and let the CORPORATIONS take over-- the MIC MAD GOP. Yep that'll really do it.

Witness-- birth of true Idiocracy...

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 1:00pm
to emile, regarding your comments on RFK -

emile, the main thing about Bobby Kennedy, if you were to read "The Life and Times of Robert F. Kennedy" by Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., as Schlesinger points out, is that out of all of the figures in history, the thing that was special about Bobby was that he "changed".

Yes, he had quite the past - working for Senator McCarthy, not really caring about poor people - growing up wealthy, a certain level of insecurity due to being the runt of the family and the aggressiveness that he displayed as compensation, fighting the unions - but after JFK was assassinated, and after the nation started to look to him, and after MLK Jr. was assassinated, and he really saw what was going on and where the country was headed, the inequality, the injustice, the war - he changed. He grew up. He became a different person. He became more of a man. He became a truer form of patriot.

There was a quote in the beginning of the Schlesinger book, and I'm paraphrasing, something about how a man perceives the terror in the world and steels himself to face it.

It's most important for us to not "canonize" anybody, even the kennedy's. It is more important to look at their legislative record - as Sorensen points out in his book about JFK, and their public service.

By the time June of 1968 rolled around, RFK had begun to transform. Schlesinger notes how with Bobby, there was a "hidden agenda" beyond what he was saying on the campaign trail...he was steeling himself to really bring about the changes that the country needed.

It is quite interesting, for example, to see footage of him discussing the War - and his words could mean today's Wars.

"The hope still lives, and the dream shall never die".

Perhaps try transforming, yourself.

Posted by odysseus14 at 06/16/2008 @ 1:02pm
"The Era of Consequences"

Posted by odysseus14 at 06/16/2008 @ 1:05pm
Perhaps try transforming, yourself.

Posted by odysseus14

that was an interesting post. except for that gratuitous shot at the end. that was uncalled for.

I might add that, perhaps unlike you, I lived through that time.

but if I run across the Schlesinger book, I'll take a look, as I a fan of his book on Jackson.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 1:15pm
let's see now, '68

resigned from ROTC because of the Vietnam war

participated in two anti war marches in Washington

refused being drafted

I may have been even more transformed than RFK.

how 'bout you?

Posted by emile duBois at 06/16/2008 @ 1:31pm
How about "Mandeville's Juggernaut?"

From Wikipedia: "A juggernaut (American pronunciation) is a term used to describe a force regarded as unstoppable, that will crush all in its path."

"The word is derived from the Sanskrit Jagannātha (meaning "Lord of the universe") which is one of the many names of Krishna from the ancient Vedic scriptures of India. One of the most famous of Indian temples is the Jagannath Temple in Puri, Orissa, which has the Ratha Yatra (chariot procession), an annual procession of chariots carrying the murtis/statues of Jagannâth (Krishna), Subhadra and Baladeva (Krishna's elder brother). During the British colonial era, Christian missionaries promulgated a fallacy that Hindu devotees of Krishna were lunatic fanatics who threw themselves under the wheels of these chariots in order to attain salvation. Such a description can also be found in the popular fourteenth-century work "The Travels of Sir John Mandeville." In rare instances in the festival's past, people had been crushed accidentally as the massive 45 foot tall, multi-ton chariot slipped out of control, with others suffering injury in the resulting stampedes. This sight led the Britons of the time to contrive the word "Juggernaut" to refer to examples of unstoppable, crushing forces."

"In modern times, the government officers and temple priests managing the festival take elaborate precautions to protect people from injury during these processions."

Posted by javaman222 at 06/16/2008 @ 2:09pm
"..Ok that sums up the problem with new cons-- they see people like fodder or food. Soylent Green without real individual choice or responsibility unless it's their corporate upside-down inside-out a'logical version. "

--Bushfooled

This explains nothing of the sort other than a bad resaturant will close and it will not matter which caused the bad food.

Posted by JOMAMMA at 06/16/2008

So you are saying that people like food cannot make any choices on how they're prepared? Ergo might as well be ruled by corporations than our own constitution... since after all-- individuals are just a snack. Now corporations, now thems there people.

DUH NOT.

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 3:41pm
Talk about a new age-- Here we go:

Gore endorses Obama

By NEDRA PICKLER – 41 minutes ago FLINT, Mich. (AP) -- Al Gore says he is backing Barack Obama and will do whatever he can to help him get to the White House.

In a letter to be e-mailed to Obama supporters, Gore says Obama has united a movement over the past year and a half.

The former vice president also asks for donations to help fund Obama's effort -- the first time he's asked members of his Web site AlGore.com to contribute to a political campaign.

Gore is one of the most popular figures in the Democratic Party, but he kept a low profile in the primary campaign. He's planning to appear with Obama at a rally in Detroit Monday night.

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 3:49pm
"I've never asked members of AlGore.com to contribute to a political campaign before, but this moment and this election are too important to let pass without taking action," Mr. Gore said. He added, "Over the past 18 months, Barack Obama has united a movement. He knows change does not come from 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue or Capitol Hill. It begins when people stand up and take action."

The decision to stage the appearance in Michigan underscores the importance of the state for Mr. Obama. It was also in Michigan where former Senator John Edwards unveiled his endorsement of Mr. Obama in a surprise setting.

"Over the next four years, we are going to face many difficult challenges -- including bringing our troops home from Iraq, fixing our economy, and solving the climate crisis," Mr. Gore said. "Barack Obama is clearly the candidate best able to solve these problems and bring change to America."

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 4:05pm
THE GREAT DIVIDE or GREAT DISCONNECT

-between the classes, especially the rich and the middle that loses thousands daily to the poor; -between both houses of Congress, and the wants/needs of the electorate; -between most mainstream media reporting on TV and in newspapers, and the great amount of important, significant news each day that ends up online or in blogs only; -between the truth and lies on every level, both personal and public relations; between--OBVIOUSLY, DUH--the actions of this Administration and The Constitution; between what this country has become on numerous levels and most of the rest of the world; between true believers of all persuasions and the growing disaffection with organized religion in general, particularly its insinuation into politics....

and the list could easily go on and on....

Posted by robertann at 06/16/2008 @ 4:11pm
As long as Gore's not on the ticket, I'm voting for Obama. The absolute ineffectiveness of our leadership on immigration, global warming, taxes, you name it is staggering. The concept behind the training of german non-com's during WWI comes to mind, ie do something, even if its wrong.

I know Obama will go into my pocket: Most libs do for one reason or another. But I'd like to see some direction and action, almost any action. The baby boomers aren't cutting it, I'm sorry to say, since I am one. I'm ready to try the magic wand.

William Harry

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/16/2008 @ 4:12pm
As long as Gore's not on the ticket, I'm voting for Obama. The absolute ineffectiveness of our leadership on immigration, global warming, taxes, you name it is staggering. The concept behind the training of german non-com's during WWI comes to mind, ie do something, even if its wrong.

I know Obama will go into my pocket: Most libs do for one reason or another. But I'd like to see some direction and action, almost any action. The baby boomers aren't cutting it, I'm sorry to say, since I am one. I'm ready to try the magic wand.

William Harry

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/16/2008 @ 4:12pm
Hey JoMa-- it's your highly flawed analogy. You run for office lobbing those turds around and see the hoards you attract... not.

Here's an idea-- try teaching pre-school first, then primary, secondary, college-- work your way up. You might actually try to learn something if you need to teach it. Being out in the corporate world isn't working for you.

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 4:48pm
I am not bitter..I just recognize that the entire system is a complete failure on all levels except funding...

Posted by JOMAMMA at 06/16/2008

You are so out of touch it is pitiful. Funding for public ed is way way down in real dollars. It's your disability of perception that has failed you. You talk responsibility-- but take none. I'm sure you had at least a few good teachers, but pulled this same BS and thus ignored their good work. You blame the effort of the lowly paid for your own bad choices not to learn. That is always the the students' responsibility. I've seen students like you that have a chip on their shoulder, psychologically bent, can't learn for unusually personal reasons not physically impaired. Real tough nuts. It's not the teachers-- it's you FrGr. Take some responsibility.

Posted by hsuBfools at 06/16/2008 @ 6:06pm
TO EMILE DUBOIS:

Our unbelievable polarization is a legacy of growing up divided over a war.

Dissent was hardly invented by baby boomers. Check out the isolationist protests on campus in the '30's.

Nor was the openness to other cultures a boomer invention. We however, fail to understand the importance of cultural assimilation and think the country will be better off as a hodge podge of various cultures all operating independently of the whole. The Fall of Rome is a good example of the Salad Bowl: The Survival of China is a good example of the Melting Pot.

I'll give you the part about the openness on sex. Can't be upset about that.

But individual choice a hallmark? Give me a break. We allow our leaders to dictate to us that we WILL have medical insurance? California is trying to implant monitors on the heating units IN PEOPLES HOUSES. Mayors in Texas telling me what I can and cannot say or I'll be fined? Covanants & Restrictions on property in neighborhoods? The state telling me how to raise my kids. Forcing companies to pay for medical insurance? The ridiculous PC of the 90's? Hell if there is one hallmark of The Lousiest Generation, as I call them, its collectivism, not Individuality.

We're not done yet? Thats what I'm afraid of.

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/16/2008 @ 11:39pm
will, my comparison was with the 50s and the previous generation.

the openness to other cultures again is startling compared to earlier generations. take food for instance. can you imagine our parents eating Sushi for instance? or doing Yoga or Tai Chi?

individual choice? the most my mom could see me aspiring to was becoming a teacher. you remember tune in, turn on, drop out?

I have had many friends who did indeed drop out, out of the rat race, towards personal fulfillment. after kicking around for a few years, I invented my job and my business.

the great invention of our time, the personal computer, did not come from the white shirt only culture of IBM, but rather from a bunch of drop out phone phreaks, around the kitchen table of their house.

"The state telling me how to raise my kids. Forcing companies to pay for medical insurance?"

this is pretty much nonsense. no one is telling you how to raise your kids. and no one forced corporations to pay for their employees health care. they did so voluntarily.

so you're gonna have to do a lot better than that.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/17/2008 @ 01:47am
Emile, I point only to the Mass. plan for insurance. Its not an option anymore up there, nor would it be anywhere if Hillary became Queen.

In my State the "It takes a Village" mentality was pretty well entrenched until one year finally the courts told them flat out to back off.

The 50's were pretty intolerant and closed minded-no argument there. But I found at least the same mentality throughout the 90's and this decade. O, we're open minded enough to listen to another view-as long as it sounds like ours. The Right, or rather non Leftists, have no monopoly on intolerance, they merely couch it in "good spiritedness"

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/17/2008 @ 03:25am
will, every single state has mandatory auto insurance.

if the state is willing to insure EVERYONE, which no insurance company guarantees, I will be happy to accept the mandate.

right now I pay over $500 a month to insure two.

right now millions go uninsured.

you seem to subscribe to a "go it alone mentality"

that hasn't been in vogue for over 100 years, since the gilded age.

try to address my points, as I have done yours.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/17/2008 @ 03:40am
Emile, the analogy of mandatory car insurance is used a lot by those advocating the various socilizing type plans to correct medical costs and the uninsured. There is one big difference though: Car insurance is mandatory only if you drive. There is NO option with the medical thing. The analogy is not quite fair.

And I've never been one to discard an outlook on life just because of its age. New is not always better. Marxism, for instance, is officially 141 years newer than the beginning of the Founding Father's Republic: Nazism 157 years newer, The Cultural Revolution newer still. You wouldn't embrace any of those, would you?

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/17/2008 @ 1:34pm
the analogy has to do with coercion issue. let's try taxes. you, and I are compelled to pay taxes.

the second part is an absurd strawman. why don't you argue with yourself, you are already answering your own questions.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/17/2008 @ 1:41pm
Why is the second part absurd? It's a perfectly logical analogy.

As to taxes, it would be unrealistic and unfair to expect no taxes. There are those who truly need the help generated from taxpayers money. Where the line is drawn always seems to be the issue. I, for one believe that the less gov is involved in ones life the better,that individualism is more important than collectivism, that man and not government is the best one to decide his fate (or her fate)

I thought they were progressive ideas. Guess I'm just and old fashioned right wing fanatic.

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/17/2008 @ 2:30pm
There are those who truly need the help generated from taxpayers money.

this is just absurd. the rich get far more benefit from our taxes.

you seem to live in a world of shopworn slogans.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/17/2008 @ 2:35pm
Emile, your comments are disconnected. What benefit the rich get from our tax system has nothing to do with how much certain people nee tax money. These are two different arguments.?

Posted by william.harry13 at 06/17/2008 @ 3:52pm
yes, they are, but you are responsible for the disconnect. you were justifying taxes using the poor. that is the absurdity.

the rich need the tax money more, BECAUSE they get a far greater benefit from it.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/17/2008 @ 4:27pm
will, we have gotten far afield, but I enjoyed our discussion.

Posted by emile duBois at 06/17/2008 @ 4:44pm
Decades after the Roaring Twenties, we come to the Whining Zeroes, or perhaps, the Naughty Naughts.

Posted by ryebread at 06/19/2008 @ 4:58pm